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Nice work! Video links don't work tho.
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Alyosha wrote:
What you want to do here is verify that the RAM state at the end of the SMB3 movie matches that at the start of the SMB1 movie. BizHawk lets you export RAM as a text file (from hex editor), which can then be used by online diff checker or something similar to verify they are the same.
I did so and they match, so it's good.
You mean even tho savestates don't match, RAM state inside them does?
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Since it's so obscure, I think it makes sense to copy this great review here because I can't link to it.
Random-cm9qm wrote:
As a Demo, this looks intresting. I'll leave my thoughts here:
{Zones Score: 4/10}
These Zones feel pretty alright for the most part, mainly because a good majority of those weren't changed or had been edited from pre-existing Sonic 2 Zones (CNZ, ARZ, Etc).
I will say that Wood Zone/Secret Jungle Zone was pretty barebones, it didn't feel as open as I've seen in previous hacks & it doesn't expand over you just jumping over spikes & onto platforms without that push that sort of makes it more intresting or fun to play, hence why the score was capped at 4.
So my wish would be to modify that so it uses platforming and puzzling gimmicks whilst also providing you with speed as its reward rather than it being used as a tool to jump over repeated spikes & platforms, as well as adding alternate paths for Zones.
(Music Score: 2/10}
The music wasn't the best, alot of the time it felt like slightly high-pitched (or what people like to call "nightcore") variants of the base songs, each song didn't really stick out to me, apart from Wood Zone/Secret Jungle Zone.
Specifically because this track just sounded terrible, it felt like the instruments were clashing with eachother without any sense of rhythm attached to them. Not to mention it used the exact same sort of note progression throughout the song. Also, the boss theme in HTZ might be bugged, something about the start just sounded a little too off to me, which didn't help the already low score. Just take a listen to this 16:40.
I'd say space your music out more, so that it's a little more bearable on the ears.
{Colour Palettes/Colour Schemes Score: 3/10}
I'll be honest, most of the palettes weren't really that good, with GHZ's Act 3 having an orange background without the clouds being properly shaded, CPZ's Act 1's single colour type patterns & CNZ having barely any changes to it lead this to being my final score.
Most of the times, Act 2s of the zones would have a decent looking colour palette, albeit looking a little too close to that one Sonic 2 Enhancement RomHack. But I think the worst one of all of them had to be HTZ Act 2, Whilst it was cool that they had implemented design quirks from Sonic 2 SMS/GG, it didn't really feel like anything was really changed apart from the fact that it looked like it was night by the dull-looking dark blue sky.
I feel like stars or some kind of symbolise that there might be a moon in the sky would greatly help. Along with modifying and redesigning some of these backgrounds.
{Boss Fights: 3/10}
A whole lot of these are just dumbed down variants of the original, not much to comment on other than making them feel more challenging and fun to mess around with. You can even see in this timestamp 10:52 that the boss fight didn't cover-up a specific spot, giving you free hits to defeat it easily.
WZ/SJZ was the only one that, for the most part, helped provide a little bit of a challenge for the player, although, it does fall flat as it's not entirely that memorable. It gets the same point as I previously mentioned before.
{Final Score: 4/10}
This Hack does have potential, I've seen hacks that are styled like this do a great job, even if at any point those have been long gone, you can't deny that it may have inspired the devs to make these more expansive. Which I think they did an okay job to say the least.
Just fix up the previous mistakes and you should be golden, I hope the development of this hack goes swell & I hope the details get improved upon greatly.
{Bonus Mentions}
• I like the animations at the end, though I do think Tails' one should be worked on, he just looks a little off to me.
This also applies to Sonic's balancing animation, it's just too fucking fast.
• The Title Screen is alright, though I don't know if I like Tails' face, it just seems like he's the most broken looking one out of the whole romhack.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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PurpleSun, is there a way to lose in this game?
Also it may be possible to manually advance time in order to play more of the game in one movie, but it's complicated, and we allow single-loop movies for games without ending anyway.
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Interesting. In Alternative, we allow cheat codes as long as the goal is entertaining. In Standard, we only allow codes that add gameplay (like ones that unlock content). In this case, A+B is a suicide code, which doesn't add/unlock gameplay or content. So it doesn't seem to belong to the Standard class.
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It worked!!!
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Thanks. It synced with your folder once and then never again, regardless of fresh unzips, cleanups, and config matches. I guess I'll rely on fsvgm777 here.
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No change. Can you send me your portable Dolphin folder where it consistently syncs?
Also how do you remove save data? I just delete Wii and GC folders before every try.
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It's included with bizhawk in Lua\Genesis.
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3 frames can still be removed now, since max yardage would be a different branch.
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The solution is very easy.
"Any%" is either shortest possible input to make the player win eventually, or quickest possible win with whatever input is required.
"Maximum score" is maxing out whatever the game gives you as a "score".
"Full completion" in this game would simply be maximum yardage since it'd be the main optional metric to maximize to consider the game completed the fullest.
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Incredible!!!
(I started reading but couldn't finish because I needed to post so hard lol)
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Can't get this to sync. Can you describe the exact sync steps from a fresh portable install? That is, after unzipping Dolphin, create an empty portable.txt file alongside Dolphin.exe, then it will be independent on whatever you had previously played.
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Bizhawk movies include SaveRAM anchor in them.
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Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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What does the questionmark icon say when you click it (bottom left)?
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In a lot of places I see you wait for the hole to move closer towards you, but you don't also move closer to it to get down sooner. Does it never help in those cases?
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We define gameplay as "an in-game task or puzzle that is meant to be accomplished or solved by a human while playing the game, by sending inputs to the game and getting its reaction".
If a code instantly moves you ahead in the game, it doesn't add any new task or puzzle beyond what was originally there. It quite obviously removes the task that was there - playing through the levels to get to that point normally.
It would have added gameplay if it unlocked a level or a character, or at the very least an item. While items are not in-game challenges, they were agreed to belong to unlockable gameplay, and maybe the definition above is a bit old now (it was added when we tried to decide whether there's any gameplay still left in #6466: Masterjun & ais523's NES Super Mario Bros. 3 "game end glitch" in 00:00.78). If it was an item that you could use to make shortcuts, it'd fit. But if the code is already the entirely of the shortcut, it's not allowed for Standard.
However it's fine for Alternative now if it's entertaining!
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Because they both aim for fastest completion, just using different timing. Unless one happens to be cool enough for Alt.
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Yeah it'd be ideal if the main submission obsoleted the current record within the same metrics first, and then the one that aims for a different type of ending could co-exist as a secondary publication file.
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Cycle count in this core is important because it's the only way to have correct duration info. It's easy to fix it by simply saving the movie when it pauses on the last frame.
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KusogeMan wrote:
I did a little searching into the profiles and I noticed something very clear from the start. The only who are being affected by this rule in this voting were the specific people that voted against the ruling that was passed.
[...]
So basically this is the equivalent of inviting 12 politically not interested people and 2 politically interested people to vote for laws that only affect those 2 interested people.
It's called the community. There's no sane way to look at an open questionfor everyone and conclude that it "invites" specific types of people in prejudiced quantities. We invited the entire community. We invited everyone, to share their thoughts and feelings, to give us ideas and suggestions.
Comparing people who were firmly against obsoleting the most legit category ever (starting from power-on) to "politically not interested" is invalid. It's the most legit category ever because it requires zero technical verification, and has zero room for speculation about optimality of unlockables and their legitimacy.
With movies that start from a savegame or a savestate, you need to technically verify that they are reproducible, and then also verify that they unlock and use the most optimal things. And those things may also raise questions about whether they should be allowed, like what if you could unlock noclip in a platformer or an FPS? What if you could unlock a mode that removes all enemies? Would those things count as the most optimal route ever? There's no such concerns for power-on startup. And it's always been accepted for the entire history of the site. People supporting it are absolutely "politically interested".
KusogeMan wrote:
I could give a more specific example with politically charged issues but I don't want to derail this. I just wanted to vent out how bad i feel about being a major contributor, along Spike obviously, and having my vote crushed by the uninterested party.
Do you want your feelings to matter more than the rest of the community? We can not provide that. Best we can do is counting everyone's feelings equally. And in cases when feelings of some people contradict feelings of other people, what do you think the best solution is?
My personal solution is reflected in my forum signature, and it's what I've been doing since 2018 when I became a senior judge. Or maybe even since 2014.
For conflicting opinions, the best thing to do is figuring out reasons and priorities behind everyone's point of view, and accounting those priorities as best as we can, instead of sticking to hyper-focused extreme visions that miss the forest behind the trees.
We, site staff, can not afford missing the forest behind the trees. We need to see the bigger picture at all times. Not only in space (various people posting in a certain thread during a year), but also in time (what should we expect to happen as a result of our decisions, in the next several years?)
Now you may know that the universe operates by the laws of logic. People may not know exactly what's happening in nature through facts, but facts we can observe can only compose a theory that is able to reliably predict things if it's build using logic. Your smartphone keeps working because processes inside it rely on laws of physics and their logic.
Similarly, we won't be able to build a reliable system for people to operate in unless we rely on facts (opinions/feelings/experiences) and logic. Logic guarantees it will keep working given the same reality, and if reality changes we should be ready to adjust the rules. And those adjustments still have to be logical, because only then people will be able to understand them, and to predict results of their actions. This is what makes a policy legitimate - when people who want to challenge the policy conclude in the end that it makes sense. We do this among staff all the time, and we invite the community to chime in all the time.
KusogeMan wrote:
I understand you don't want to discuss this anymore because you already voted.
Honestly, I don't feel comfortable commenting anything nowadays on the site.
I presented a ton of logical arguments in this thread in all my previous posts. If you're interested in helping the community move forward, discuss them using logic and facts, and be open to other people's logic and facts. If you don't use logic and objective verifiable facts, yet you still want your feelings to matter more than feelings of others, you're being disruptive.
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Spikestuff wrote:
I can refer to Guilty Gear X: Advance Edition where Ky is obsoleted by Zato as they're both characters available form the start for an instance of a character that wasn't unlocked.
Since they are available from the start, a Standard movie starting from the game start requires the most optimal char to be used. Originally one char was considered the best, then later it was found that another char is better, so a movie with one obsoletes a movie with the other.
Since SaveRAM is not involved, movies of that game will be unaffected by the (year-old) changes in SaveRAM rules. The slower char will remain obsoleted, unless people take a second look and feel that it's entertaining and different enough to co-exist in Alternative, with the "uses suboptimal char" tag. If that happens, particular char available from the start would be the only difference, so we would put char name into branch label to distinguish the 2 existing branches.
It won't imply any policy regarding other games and their branches. Branch labels are only used to indicate what makes branches different for a particular given game. If we try to add other meanings to branch labels, it quickly becomes impossible to reliably handle.
Now, you also asked "Let's pretend that Zato's the "savegame" character for this, which is why I'm saying for the sake of argument" in a non-public chat.
If Zato was a savegame char, the whole point of this thread's existence is splitting savegame-anchored movies into their own goal sets and obsoletion chains, therefore it would be published as a separate Standard branch called "savegame", and the Ky branch would remain without a label. Because there would not be several branches coming just from char choice. Savegame would be the key difference, therefore it goes into branch label for all savegame goals.
Finally, if we imagine an unlikely scenario that after that distinction someone makes entertaining movies for suboptimal chars, labeling becomes more complicated, tho it doesn't mean we won't be able to solve it.
Most likely for Alternative, we would not care if it's a savegame char or not, so yes, in Alt a better savegame char can obsolete a base roster char. However it doesn't mean it'd be faster. It could be slower and more entertaining, and still obsolete, because in Alt we aim for entertainment.
Now I said above that if a suboptimal char exists in Alt, both char branches would be labeled, because it's what we do according to branch label policies. But it really looks like "princess only" is a better example here, where an Alternative branch aims for a specific char, while other branches aim just for the most optimal char combo whatever it is.
For that reason, chars that are used for Standard goals (and can be changed in newer runs if they are quicker) should not go to branch labels, unless char choice results in what we consider a separate game mode altogether.
Chars that are used for entertainment in Alternative goals will go to branch labels if showcasing them was the sole goal.
If the Alt goal is different, and any char could be used within that goal, then that goal goes to the label but not the char.
Finally if different chars co-exist in Alt within the same goal, they go to branch labels to distinguish which is which.
This is all just branch labeling policy, obsoletion policies are unrelated and don't need to care how we label things. It's the other way around: we agree on obsoletion (or split) policies, and then adjust the labels to work with it. Making movie rules depend on labels would be a very bad practice that makes things worse.
Spikestuff wrote:
I can also refer to Digimon Rumble Arena where an unlocked character wasn't allowed, and instead a character that's available from the start would have been preferred instead.
That submission would be accepted under the current SaveRAM rules as a separate "savegame" branch.
Spikestuff wrote:
But we're in the new site era now where we have a new submission that's using an unlocked character in Mortal Kombat: Deadly Alliance which should outright obsolete the Kenshi run and be the preferred run. But isn't for some reason.
A character name as a branch implies we would accept and publish every character. Which isn't good on the site side, as Judges and Publishers will have to deal with a "mess" of fighting game TASes.
But I already experimented with that idea with 5 separate characters in Tekken 3 and they're ineligible to be accepted due to Yoshimitsu (and that puddle can get muddier, but let's avoid that puddle) and of course Guilty Gear X as I referred to earlier.
If individual char branches are not good enough to go to Alternative, they just go to Playground. There, they will have char labels, because showcasing those chars was their sole goal. As I explained above, we need to update labeling policies to account for the new class system.
Spikestuff wrote:
In my opinion the character should obsolete the other regardless if they're an unlocked character or not and if they're an unlock then they should have the tag of well in this case `Second quest/Post game-completion`. We have tags, we should make the tags work at the very least, we still make new ones to this day.
This allows it to be simplified, and any other run from an unlocked roster or a standard one can instead go to Playground whilst the actual fastest can obsolete one another.
Adding extra clauses to movie rules is the opposite of simplification. Especially when those clauses go against the already existing agreement (always split SaveRAM in Standard unless all unlocked content fails to make the movie quicker). And especially against the current site direction of letting everyone have their favorite goal published (as long as we can afford it).
If our wording of the current policies needs to be clearer, we can and should improve it.
Spikestuff wrote:
This also allows another type of branch for fighting games, where you have the fastest character, a playaround and then "all endings", at least for the fighting games that show off different endings.
A fighting game movie that goes through all chars doesn't sound like a very popular goal among players or viewers, so I think it would be incredibly rare. If replaying the game with all chars is the only form of full completion for a particular game, maybe it's fine for Standard. But that's a discussion we haven't had yet, and adding it to this one seems to only make it even more complex. Like look at all the posts I already made in this thread, and tell me how many people have read them all and understood them.
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Thanks, that's a solid enough reason then!
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However, it was only after I had got this done and the encode uploaded that I checked the No-Intro database. The database said that while the split games are considered "good" dumps the original data of the memory pack is considered a "bad" dump.
I can understand that but it's kind of a bummer to realize the version you've made a completed TAS on was considered a bad version.
How easy would it be to resync on the good dump version?
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
