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Hurray time to remove Out to Lunch! That brings it down to 21. I'm still pretty stuck on Double Dragon, I also tried Cobra Triangle but it was so boring I couldn't continue. Most likely Wai Wai World will be my next target.
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Thanks for encoding this fsvgm777. Out of curiosity, how did you get rid of the high pitched whirring sound whenever an item is picked up? Is it just encoding magic? Honestly just having that removed makes the run much more enjoyable, thanks!
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dwangoAC wrote:
I would obviously prefer that this fell into a demo or technical showcase tier, but the site lacks that.
I'm not sure it was ever publicized but there is a recently added demonstration category at least that I hope this run makes it into. (Added about a week ago as far as I can tell.) I particularly like the high level of documentation done here, as this kind of knowledge is always at risk of being lost if not properly written down.
The article can be renamed .lsmv and magically run? WOW!
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Dimon12321 wrote:
People want to see TASes of modern games (games for Wii, GC), but not many of us (I mean TASVideos community) takes long games because of difficult mechanics, RNG manipulations (AI actions, weapon damages etc), possible improves, route planning and so on. What do you think about the acception of partially TASed games (completed circle of missions/stages/areas or other part of sth game which has the logical ending)? So we can cover more games and attract more people! Share your opinions!
This is actually something I've put a bit of thought into myself. Is there a way to speed up the TASing process for modern games?
I've thought about macro level TASing where you just string together common movements but I don't think that would make it very far.
I've also considered autmoated path finding between waypoints so the TASer can focus on routing and such but this seems like a far future goal.
I would personally be very happy to see a tool 'assisted' run of modern games if it means getting more of these games published / worked on at all. This as opposed to the modern standard in older platforms which has really become tool 'based' not just tool 'assisted.'
I think this is a timely topic given the recent OOT post about boat skip which is apparently just rediscovering a glitch known for years (unless I'm misunderstanding something.) If knowledge of that level is being 'rediscovered' then definitely something needs to change in the content generation arena.
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If there is interest in Battletoads I'd be willing to work on it from the TAS end of things. I've been meaning to pick up that game for a while now anyway.
I like console verification type things, so I'm willing to help on other games too. I don't have much hardware but if help is needed on the TAS end just let me know.
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I just realized this run doesn't make it to the credits, oops. I really only saved about 200 frames, not 600.
Anyway I will cancel it for now pending the implementation of ram initialization in Bizhawk.
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^ sure, I'd be willing to rework things in BIzhawk, its not a difficult run by any means, more of a technical novelty.
EDIT: oh, and also quicknes core in Bizhawk seems to have trouble with this game for some reason, didn't look too deeply into it though.
EDIT2: Probably has to do with quicknes setting everything to FF after a cursory look at the RAM.
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I have been testing out improvements for the diddy route and so far can only save a few dozen frames at most. The biggest problem with diddy is that to move efficiently horizontally he has to roll, but to move the camera efficiently he has to jump, and since diddy loses speed when jumping, I end up not gaining significant time.
So I'm pretty comfortable now in declaring Expresso the winner. I would estimate that a final optimized version will likely save an additional ~30 frames, and I am still optimistic that more frames can be saved during the setup.
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Radiant wrote:
BrunoVisnadi wrote:
A run must be stared to be Newcomer'd?
Yes. Newcomer is essentially the fourth tier, one step higher than Star.
(that might not have been intended, but that is in practice what it turned out to be, anyway)
I found this comment pretty interesting, are we actually trying to present these TASes to newcomers or just being pedantic? After all I was a 'newcomer' only a little over a year ago and never noticed 'newcomer' TASes until one of the random star movies on the front page happened to be one with a question block, and only realized that block meant 'recommended for new comers' after clicking on it since I didn't know why it was there.
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^ that was fast, seeing that new glitch is action is really neat though, it makes the any % run seem much faster.
I had a bit of a breakthrough in 4-4, and expresso is now ~150 frames ahead of diddy. I think this is the last attempt I'll make with expresso until the final version TAS gets up to 4-4.
http://tasvideos.org/userfiles/info/28246805744061414
Now I'll try and take what I learned and see if Diddy can catch up. Diddy has much less down time to work with though, so I'll not sure how much I can save, time will tell though.
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Personally I don't think that either of these runs is documented in a newcomer friendly way. "Newcomer' doesn't necessarily mean 'stupid' , and some newcomers might be pretty technically knowledgeable, but my opinion would be that any ACE TAS recommended for newcomers should have author's notes written with this in mind. (The SMB3 run for example has 'as seen in the previous run' references which are not newcomer friendly.)
So I think an ACE TAS could be a good newcomer candidate, since as GDQ's show they are extremely popular, I think some more careful documentation is needed first.
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I usually try to follow this game as I played it a lot, even though things have gotten too technical for me. I just want to say I am amazed at the research done here and the results are incredible, can't wait to see a TAS with the new strats, hopefully even console verified!
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Emulation accuracy effecting RNG state is something that happens in NES all the time, so its quite possible that the same could be true in PCSX emulators. Some RNGs are implemented as idle loops and are thus cycle dependent, so it wouldn't surprise me if this is the case here if you can't seem to find any other explanation Samtastic.
But it sounds like you fixed the problem, so all good anyway!
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Back in 4-4 i have saved more time with expresso and am currently 45 frames ahead of the diddy route, i think i can save an additional second or so as well. Things are starting to break with increasingly minor changes now, so I take that to mean I'm closing in on an optimized version.
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I will vote for arandomgametaser and samsara as I think they did the best work this year. I am particularly envious of Samsara's ability to add entertainment to otherwise bland games / stages.
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On a bit of a side note here, I was wondering why quicknes ended up being the preferred BizHawk core? Was there something in particular or a lesson that was learned to improve emulation?
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I am wondering which version of the game is preferred, the GDQ modded one or the original? Would the real RNG in the original allow for a faster run due to more optimal farming?
VVVV I prefer the original as well, in fact even if it turns out to be slower. But either way I think this question should be answered before any frame war type stuff gets going, so no one wastes their time.
EDIT: or at least give this one a "GDQ Edition" branch to distinguish it.
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I tried for about an hour before realizing I really needed a team to make anything decent. I guess I should have taken that suggestion in the opening post a bit more seriously!
One other point I'd like to make besides the ones listed above is that one utility of this speed TAS competition is to give ANYONE a decent chance of being able to submit a run, even if not high quality, kind of like an outreach opportunity. This one though was definitely for experienced TASers only.
But hey, this was only the second iteration of the contest, gotta climb that learning curve somehow! Still great work with the organization of everything. I did like the format of expert TAS team vs human runners, but perhaps that is better as a seperate item to the speed tas competition.
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Absolutely amazing, very impressive and original content.
The fact that it can all be done on console is even more impressive and shows the level of mastery that has been developed both in working with the NES and with this game in particular. ACE + console verification never gets old for me, really awe inspiring.
