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Looks pretty well done.
Honestly it's not as entertaining as I'd hoped. Primarily because it seemed like there was as much time spent watching repeated cutscenes as there was watching actual game play....but that's not your fault.
As far as voting, I'm borderline between 'meh' and 'yes'; but I'll give it a 'yes' simply because I understand how much of a pain DOS TASing can be (which adds a bit to impressiveness/entertainment in my opinion).
Congrats on your first DOS TAS.
Side Note:
I don't remember the crew of the Enterprise having quite the Arnold physique.
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Unless there's significant differences in game content between the difficulty levels, doing all 4 difficulties is probably unnecessary.
Also as a generality, the highest difficulty setting is usually preferred unless a lower setting yields a significantly higher entertainment potential.
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Just a quick comment on Version Choice.
I still have been unable to get the CD version of this particular game to work. It may be due to the CD-DA issue, or other settings. I have gotten some degree of success with other CD based games in JPC-rr (see forum post linked in submission text).
Thus it is currently still 'impossible' to run the CD version of the game in JPC-rr (but that doesn't mean it will always be). As such, this run's use of the floppy version should not be used as grounds for rejection.
Looking forward to watching this...will vote after I do.
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Is there a reason you chose 1 Player instead of 2 Players?
I'm not super familiar with the arcade version, but I'm guessing running 2 players co-op would yield a faster overall run and may offer more opportunity to be entertaining.
I'm going to refrain from voting on this run but will agree with Dimon12321's comment; not bad for your first TAS.
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I've played around with the game on my own and compared to your WIP.
I think your run looks pretty good. I can gain 2 frames by the end of the 1st bridge by braking slightly differently before the wall of cars. However, this is just enough to alter RNG to result in me being only 1 frame ahead by the end of the second bridge; by the third bridge, you're back in the lead. The RNG changes of the oil slick directions is where I think i'm losing the time back to you in the latter portions of the run.
I think you're good to submit.
You need to decide on your goal though....
If you want fastest in-game time, then submit as is (after eliminating empty frames at the end).
If you want fastest TAS time, delete everything after the last 'up' movement. The car will coast to the end of the race. You'll have a shorter TAS time even though it'll be a longer in-game time.
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I don't think it's worthwhile trying to convert this from QuickNES to NESHawk
Reason:
NESHawk core yields one extra lag frame at power-on. This one frame changes RNG. Thus the first play from scrimmage after going out of bounds on the kickoff has a different defensive formation.
Essentially this means that all three halves in which a normal play is run would need completely re-TASed. I don't expect this would change the overall length by more than of a handful of frames over the course of the entire run; thus I don't see it being worthwhile to try and convert.
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Referencing the above:
4) If I convert to NESHawk and the resulting movie is longer, which run takes priority from a publication standpoint?
6) I don't mind converting and re-syncing if it's a worthwhile endeavor
7) This makes sense. I had my original BizHawk set up for NESHawk before upgrading to 64-bit windows. I just forgot to check this particular setting in this one instance after the fresh install. I've definitely corrected this oversight now.
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I had recently upgraded to a 64-bit version of windows and installed BizHawk 2.2.1. I didn't realize the installation defaulted to QuickNES core and ran the whole TAS in those settings.
If this is a reason the run can't be accepted, I guess I can try and convert it over to NESHawk Core.
2 Side Notes:
1) I was unaware that there was that drastic of a difference in accuracy. Why is QuickNES default if it's less accurate?
2) I've unfortunately had to downgrade my laptop back to 32-bit windows. If I do convert this run to NESHawk, it will be a different/older emulator version.
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If the changes between difficulty levels don't add any new content but only make the gameplay more difficult, just start with the hardest difficulty setting.
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Multiplication and division are equal in value and occur from left to right when separated by corresponding symbols, but the parenthesis directly associates with the 2 (without a symbol) thus separating the entire segment 2(2+1) as the divisor.
Edit:...which is why multiplying by reciprocal works for division when symbolically separated.
Edit 2:
So in this case, multiplying by the reciprocal would yield 6*.166666666666..... which equals 1.
EDIT 3:
Well crap. I'm mostly wrong. It is apparently no longer the convention to do the parenthesis association with the adjacent number. Though it USED TO BE the convention. Every math teacher I had through all my school used the old convention, not the new one.
I don't understand why the new convention is used; you'd never separate the expression 6÷2x to be 6÷2*x
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PEMDAS
Parenthesis then exponents, then multiplication, then division, addition, then subtraction.
The right calculator is the correct one.
EDIT: Further, the parenthesis is not separated from the 2 by a multiplication symbol thus the parenthetical portion is assumed to be directly associated with the 2 before the 2 is associated with the division symbol.
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Generally the TAS standard is to use the highest difficulty setting available. Unless there's reason for using a lesser difficulty (different game-content not seen at higher difficulties), it's frowned upon to use an easier setting simply to yield a marginally faster time.
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While tapes and disks do lead to long loading times and inflated TAS times, it's understood and isn't likely to impact the judgement of any submission. See this run for an accepted example with a long loading time.
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I have no suggestion for this problem, but.....IIRC, using multi-game carts is frowned upon unless it's not possible to find the game you're wanting to TAS by itself.
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It was not my intent to blow things out of proportion. I did not intend for any of these posts to be interpreted that I am upset with the current system. I'm not...unless the example I used (judges completely disregarding the community in preference of their own opinion) is actually happening. Forgive me if my choice of words did not convey this or came across too harshly.
ThunderAxe's post that I first referenced can be interpreted as though votes don't matter to judges unless they are explained with an accompanying forum post. I don't believe this is currently happening. I only want to re-enforce the idea that vote totals should matter to judges when determining tier. I recognize that they aren't the only factor considered.
I wasn't suggesting, nor am I now, that any of the site's current (or past) judges are guilty of this. I've been quite pleased with how things have been judged since I've been around. If there is a current judging problem, I'm unaware of it.
I'm not trying to start (or prolong) a debate here. Yet, I stand by my opinion that judges should not go against the general community opinion simply because they personally disagree with how entertaining a submission is. I'm not saying this is occurring, just that it's something I believe shouldn't be.
Side Note:
I found this statement hilarious, assuming you meant that millions of flies will still swarm around s**t even though it's s**t. Great reference!
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Point considered (along with some statements in IRC). Is the voting then worthwhile in the first place?
Maybe a new policy on determining community entertainment value would be to only use forum posts. We could eliminate the voting mechanism and simply put our yes/no vote in the forum for a given run. While this would unfortunately inflate the length of many topics, it would ideally lessen the abuse.
EDIT;
I guess the point I was trying to make in my earlier post is that a judge's personal opinion should never be able to override the collective opinion of the community (however that collective opinion is determined).
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If you're saying that submission votes aren't the only factor in whether a submission is accepted for publication or not, I agree with that.
However, if you're claiming that votes aren't the only factor on what tier a submission is accepted to, I respectfully disagree with your statement. In my opinion, a judge's personal opinion on whether a TAS is vault or moon quality should not override the community voting.
If the voting is borderline, I have no problem with the judge being the determining factor for the resulting tier. If the voting is clear on how entertaining others find a submitted run, yet the judge's opinion is opposite; the judge should not be allowed to override that voting and put the run in the tier of their own personal perspective.
This applies in both directions. A judge shouldn't be able to override a low entertainment vote to promote a run to moons, nor should they be able to override higher entertainment vote to relegate a run to vault.
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I've been playing around with getting CD games functioning in JPC-rr.
I've created a new FreeDOS boot image (HDD instead of floppy) that installs the CD-ROM driver.
Then I made a CD image of Warcraft (well the data portion at least--JPC doesn't support CD-DA discs).
I then assembled JPC with the following settings:
*The new FreeDOS boot image mounted in the hda slot
*A blank 256mb disk image mounted in hdb slot
*the warcraft data CD image mounted in the CD-ROM slot
*changed boot device to hda instead of fda
I was able to perform a full-install of the game from the CD to the blank drive and run it.
Further, I was able to then dump the drive with the installed game on it to a new disk image and then re-import that dump for a new mountable game image.
I can run the game from this new game image as well (even using the floppy FreeDOS boot image) as seen below:
Link to video
Sorry about the odd sound (it may be resulting from using a different boot disk than what I installed with).
For what it's worth, the console reports the "error message about "int 15h" not being supported" both with the installation program and starting the game itself; but all seemed to work fine thus far.
I don't yet know about games that need to access the CD drive for data during gameplay, but this is at least a good start.
I just wanted to show that the "15h error" may not be a death sentence for some games.
In my opinion, this may be a big step toward getting many other games to work with JPC-rr.
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MAJOR UPDATE (at least in my opinion it's major):
I've been playing around with getting CD games functioning in JPC-rr.
I've created a new FreeDOS boot image (HDD instead of floppy) that installs the CD-ROM driver.
Then I made a CD image of Warcraft (well the data portion at least--JPC doesn't support CD-DA discs).
I then assembled JPC with the following settings:
*The new FreeDOS boot image mounted in the hda slot
*A blank 256mb disk image mounted in hdb slot
*the warcraft data CD image mounted in the CD-ROM slot
*changed boot device to hda instead of fda
I was able to perform a full-install of the game from the CD to the blank drive and run it.
Further, I was able to then dump the drive with the installed game on it to a new disk image and then re-import that dump for a new mountable game image.
I can run the game from this new game image as well (even using the floppy FreeDOS boot image) as seen below: The mouse movement is weird on this because it uses the old floppy FreeDOS without the corrected ctmouse command.Link to video
Sorry about the odd sound (it may be resulting from using a different boot disk than what I installed with).
I don't yet know about games that need to access the CD drive for data during gameplay, but this is at least a good start.
In my opinion, this may be a big step toward getting many other games to work with JPC-rr.
Still can't get Star Trek to work though....but I'm not giving up yet.
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UPDATE:
I've successfully created a FreeDOS boot image (based on the most recent FreeDOS 1.2 release) that automatically recognizes the CD drive for JPC-rr. As an added bonus, it loads ctmouse with the /r32 linear settings by default.
There are a few catches:
*The boot image is a HDD image, not a floppy image.
*Unfortunately, I still cannot get Star Trek to work properly.
Any progress is progress!
I'm going to try some other CD based games and see what I can accomplish.
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I was able to contact Ilari on IRC.
ST 25th Anniversary uses CD-DA for the music. CD-DA is not emulated in JPC-rr.
So even if we could use the CD version of the game, it wouldn't help with the music.
He also said that the problem with getting the CD to work in the first place is that most of the floppy images of FreeDOS used for booting don't contain CD-ROM drivers.
I'm looking into seeing if I can make a boot image that would offer this functionality.
I'll keep you guys updated.
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You guys are awesome. I love the collaboration here.
I actually figured this one out myself while testing out the stuff mentioned above. I've already updated my run,I just need someone with power to update the submission file. EDIT: Thank you, Mothrayas END EDIT
Running out of bounds did yield faster halves. As did getting tackled instead of extra points. This extra point strat specifically allowed for a major reduction of frames (that I could have done before if I had thought about it); I stopped input mid way through the kick return on the 2nd half of the super bowl, cutting out a TON of frames.
The run will still play through to the 'game over' screen. The score total is just smaller due to missed PAT opportunities.
I'll be updating the submission text and temp encode asap.