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Because they make some levels that should be "impossible" as small really simple. So we decided not to include them, since they kinda go against what makes a small run cool.
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Ren wrote:
Amazing... never thought I'd like this video, considering all the hours I spent just trying to get to that darned castle :P
Kudos dude, superb. I doubt anyone could do better even if they shave frames.
//Edit1: Amazed by this, I went and checked out the 96-exit version. Are there plans to redo that with the flying into doors glitch? It'd save time in several instances even I can spot.
A redo of the 96 exit run is in progress. I dare say you will be amazed by that too :)
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You used my other idea in the Blue Switch Palace! That made me happy to see :)
This run is very very well made and I think it's really unfortunate this happened. Good job Chef, I also thought the Red Switch Palace (all I can comment on are switch palaces?) was very clever.
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Chef, if you want to I'd be interested in checking your run out. If you'd like to send it I'll PM you my email address or something.
It's an unfortunate situation though, that two people have been working on the same run since we didn't know you were doing it.
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mrz wrote:
I think he meant that with such little knowledge we had in the game when it was first speedruned we thought the runs were perfect :) like i thought viper7's run was perfect :D
Yes I understood what he meant. It's still not true though.
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AKA wrote:
I just finished watching Rikki's run and I'm excited by the new strategies that were showing mainly the by the lobby glitch and BoB stars as well as Bowser#1 stuff, but like others have said there is too many sections in the game where the run was obviouly slower and the improvements should have shaved at least 3 seconds and anyway the route I choosed wasn't even the optimal route through the game after FODA had commented on my run I reckon I could obselete the current movie by at least 7 seconds. I've decided to do Bower#1 after BoB, but I felt doing Bowser first would add a more surprising factor but since people know to expect that I'll delay it a bit next time, as going to BoB first might throw people off a bit at the start.
So the two existing runs actually DO look different too? Interesting.
Anyway, that discussion probably won't matter soon since you're redoing it. Good luck with that.
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FODA wrote:
It was finished after AKA's, wasn't it?
Anyway, they won't encode it because tomorrow or next week someone will show up with a 5 frames faster run, and it should be published too? what about 2 frames? or 1? The run needs to LOOK different.
I have no idea, if you say so it probably was. Can't have been by a lot though?
I'm not sure what's going on here. Either you're ignoring my points completely or I don't understand that you're joking and everyone will laugh at me. So to avoid looking like a complete fool I'll just point you to my last post, and from there we'll agree to disagree, I guess.
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FODA wrote:
because 13 frames can be achieved with little effort copying someone's run and then changing something. It wouldn't be fair to the one who made it first. I don't say Rikku copied anything, but if you want to obsolete this run, you'll need to use at least a different technique somewhere to justify it. Just "better angles" don't. Like they said, it's still far from perfection, and there ARE better techniques to be used. It makes no sense to keep publishing every 13 frame improvement because the encoders wouldn't sleep, since the run can be improved a lot still.
I kinda get the impression you didn't read my post. I agree it's a complicated grey area when someone decides to improve a run and only slightly improves it (which doesn't mean I agree with you in that situation either, though it does become more complicated). I don't think that's the case here. From what I understand, here we have two runs done at the same time, one being faster than the other.
Now, if this was accepted for publishing and it turned out no encoder felt like going through the hour (?) long process of encoding it, that's one thing. I won't ever tell an encoder what to do, they're providing a great service without getting any compensation for it, and how they decide to spend their encoding time is completely not my business. Rejecting an existing faster run because a) it is arbitrarily decided the improvement is not significant enough or b) non-encoders decide what encoders should or should not spend their time on, are not good reasons in my opinion.
Again though, repeating my earlier point, it's one thing to start redoing a run aiming for a 13 frame improvement. It's a completely other thing to have a faster run done and it still not being accepted. Again, if encoding it takes a lot of time because no encoders put it high up on their priority list, that's fine and up to them.
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Here is my opinion.
[13:26:19] <Fabian_> it pisses me off how people say "it's just 13 frames it shouldn't be published"
[13:26:41] <Fabian_> I mean I see the problem when someone says "I'm going to redo this run, I expect to save 13 frames"
[13:26:43] <Fabian_> but here we are
[13:26:47] <Fabian_> with two runs
[13:26:50] <Fabian_> one is faster than the other
[13:26:57] <Fabian_> so what the hell would it be rejected for?
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Michael Fried wrote:
Would it be possible to save time by doing the jumping trick at the beginning of Donut Plains 1 before you get the cape? I haven't tried it myself, but it looks like you could probably fit in 2 jumps there.
It looks possible, but it's not. The reason is the takeoff meter (the one counting down from 80 to 0 when you jump/fly) goes off, and it doesn't have time to reset until it's time to jump again when bopping the dude with the feather. So, when you grab the feather the takeoff meter is at 0, which means you don't start flying.
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It's fine though probably not useful, since changing earlier parts of the movie will affect luck later on.
Other alternatives you might want to look into would be to study the game code, or to write a bot to solve it.
Hope this helps.
It's the same method used for doubling other blocks, like ? boxes or those ON/OFF boxes in Donut Plains 3. Still it's nice to see that it's possible (hasn't been tested before as far as I know), and who knows maybe a yellow block doubling or two might find its way into the 96 exit run :)
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thegreginator wrote:
I just finished watching this run. Excellent work, easy yes vote.
My favorite things about the run were the inputs to match the music and Castle #1 ending screen, the Bowser Fight, C#1, DSH, and the shell hit in SW4.
Fabian wrote:
That's the thing I like about this run too. I feel that it's now very very very close to perfect with the knowledge we have about this game.
I would say with the knowledge we have, this run is perfect. :)
There are a few lag frames scattered throughtout the run which should be possible to get rid of, in theory. If it's possible in practice, I'm not as sure of (changing score route means other lag frames in other places, etc).
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asteron wrote:
Fair enough ... In either case this movie is pretty uber :) The bowser fight is definitely my favorite yet! Juggling the mushrooms hasn't been done this well before!
I like how a lot of the improvement came from very precise play as opposed to more glitches.
That's the thing I like about this run too. I feel that it's now very very very close to perfect with the knowledge we have about this game.
