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franpa wrote:
question, why do you place bombs before entering a room? purely luck manipulation?
For making the item automatically switch, without having to go to the start menu. The bombs are placed while walking out of the door, so no frames are lost (link can keep moving). I don't know what lag you are talking about.
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Michael Fried wrote:
You gain much more time by being able to take the big shortcut to level 6, so it's worth it.
You might indeed be able to complete the FDS version a little faster due to the glitch... but it appears that it's only useful once or twice (I don't think it's faster getting the white sword)... and you can wonder whether it's worth to make a zelda FDS version TAS, when the difference is only 1 glitch, that can be used only once or twice.
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SXL wrote:
it would look more entertaining if the author did not try to block the character in one or more game(s), to make him do totally different stuff in the other games too often. it's as if the matching between the games was avoided as much as possible ; yes it's faster but it spoils the fun.
I contest the objective "finish all games as fast as possible" being more important than "make it look astonishing, 4 guys doing exactly the same most of the time, still finishing all games". I'd suggest the latter, then it would fit better in the fun section of the site than on the speed section. as it is now, speed is not that impressive. it should show they do the same, it should not be known
You are forgetting that it are actually 4 different games we are playing. There are lots, and lots of things that will make the games looks different. There are for instance ladders, there to no way to make this correlate with other games. Then, if 1 game has to make a jump to get to a platform, it will land on the platform sooner than the other games land (since they will just jump in the air, and won't land on a higher platform). Since one game lands earlier, the jump motion will stop sooner for this game. There is also a big difference between rooms that scroll horizontally, and rooms that are steady (where you mostly will have to move up, or at the end of a room). In this case, the game that is in the steady room will move to the right or left at the screen (while the other ones are centerred). Then there are obviously cutscenes such as room transitions and time after beating a boss. When megaman3 is sliding for a few frames, pressing A will make him jump, even when you press down+A. Then there are obviously different weapons, which will also make the games look really different (one megaman shooting balloons, which another uses the regular buster weapon). There are lots and lots of other things that will cause differences, which are just unavoidable. Finishing all levels at the same time, or the final bosses will just result in walking minutes and minutes into walls, and I think it's a good thing that we showed that even with the same input, you aren't forced to be walking into walls all the time. We did try to make the run as entertaining as possible, also adding some glitches for instance in megaman5 that aren't (and will not be) in the published regular run.
So basically, the thing you are suggesting is not possible, since the games are different.
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dave_dfwm wrote:
The triforce refills your energy, but it doesn't take any extra time unless you're missing ALOT of energy. The fairies didn't seem necessary to pickup.
You can only make such a statement if you timed actually timed it (frame by frame). We obviously did, and letting the triforce refill health is a lot slower than picking up the fairy (even if you only need to refill a little). For instance, picking up the level 1 fairy took the longest (like 50 frames), but it would take like 110 frames to let the triforce refill the health.
Edit: Thanks all of you, for enjoying the run, and the comments. Sure made making it worth it :)
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moozooh wrote:
I URGE you to use Snes9x 1.51 for this run.
Yes, obviously.
I am interested in doing a 100% run of this game, but I wouldn't start this before all of the movies I'm currently working on are completed. (And I also think Comicalflop should finish the 15 projects he is currently working on before adding another one.)
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Kyrsimys wrote:
Here's a totally unrelated question: if (when) this gets published, do you think that the site should accept (quality) quadruns in general? Or is this a special case?
I think this can only be judged for every movie seperately. But of course it is possible that if a (other) quadrun is good enough, that it is published. It would be stupid to say no other quadrun movies could be accepted, since even you might be voting yes to a quadrun movie (well, it's theoretically possible ;) ). It should obviously make sense that it should be a quality movie, and generally liked by the audience.
Asteron wrote:
In my opinion whatever criteria was used to accept dehacked's X+X2 entry should be applied to this run as well.
There is quite a difference. If I'm not mistaken the main goal of the X+X2 run was to have 1 movie file which completes both games. The goal of this run is to complete these four games as fast as possible.
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Kyrsimys wrote:
The purpose of the site is to produce entertaining movies, not showcase experimental concepts that are not entertaining.
There are 35 yes votes, and 5 no votes to the question "Did you like watching this movie?" (at this point). I think that should be considered when you say the movie is not worth publishing. Saying it shouldn't be published ignores that over 85% of the people liked watching the movie.
Fabian wrote:
I don't think it's worth publishing. That's why I voted no. I don't know what to tell you if you really don't understand how I can think this.
(Note: Make it a concept demo and I think it's worth publishing)
Err... All I read here is that you do think it should be published, just like me, since I also agree it should be in the concept demo section...
Like I said, I fully understand people voting no, but saying it shouldn't be published is something quite different.
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Thanks for all the responses. I agree that the movie is hard to follow, and I can fully understand the people who voted no because of this (no to the question, "Did you like watching the movie?" that is).
SLX wrote:
a simple test to see if the movie is worth publishing
To me, this sounds like suggesting it shouldn't be published, which kinda saddens me. Saying it's not worth publishing is something I don't quite understand.
Fabian wrote:
If this was to be published as a concept demo [...] Also, the other megaman dual run should be moved to concept demos
I agree that both runs should be in the concept demo section (as well as some other runs which aren't right now).
Tub wrote:
avi that contains only the sound-effects
That would be awesome... but impossible :(
Tub wrote:
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Fabian wrote:
I don't necessarily think people should be forced to mention "this should get SMW any% star" just becuase it's a point you keep making over and over and over and over and over and over and over again. The rest of your post I agree with.
I don't know what the "over and over and over and over" is all about... it's true that I mentioned this before, but that was a long time ago, at a totally different occasion (is was probably about multiple movies of the same game having both stars, and not about a specific movie).
I didn't intend to start a discussion about multiple movies of the same games having stars, and I didn't plan on discussing (or defending if you will) the fact that this was mentioned before somewhere on the forum. I just wanted to put it to the attention of the people who were saying it should be starred, and was interested in if they took it into considerating, and what they think about it in this case.
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Fabian wrote:
This sounds oddly familiar.. Has this been discussed before?
Yes, is has. I wonder if the people voting for a star took this into consideration though, since no one actually said: "this should get SMW any% star".
On a slightly unrelated note, I also considered posting about this when people were saying the Mario64 16 star run should get a star (without mentioning the 120 star star).
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Are the people who say this run should be starred suggesting that it needs to get the SMW any% star?
If not, I would think it's a very bad idea to recommand more than one movie of the same game. If people see a starred SMW movie, and really like it, they will also be able to find the other SMW movies too.
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mmbossman wrote:
Just thought I'd let you know that this seems to be recorded with bad dump rom, although it plays back just fine with the [!] version, so it shouldn't be a big deal.
It seems to me like I used the right rom (U) [!]... so I'm not sure about that.
mmbossman wrote:
everyone seems to absolutely love it
Haha, where did you get that impression?
dave_dfwm wrote:
Even though this movie has been in the submission queue for about 4 months
Actually, the previous version of this movie was published less than a month ago. At that point, there weren't any known improvements, so this submission can't possibly be older than a month. You probably get this feeling because the run is constantly being improved, which is why there is nearly always a run of this game at the workbench. Hopefully this is the final version ever :P
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I still hope either a new any%, or new warpless run will obsolete the current peach run... but it seems like Bisqwit decided to keep it the last time a new SMB2 run was submitted...
So if it's not gonna be obsoleted by another SMB2 movie, I'd say go for it!
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Bisqwit wrote:
TAS. Completion time: 2 minutes, 35.4 seconds
Nice movie :)
I was wondering (although there is probably a frame rule or something), but wouldn't it be faster to make a jump to reach the flag in level 1-1?
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andrewg wrote:
Can you improve the time on this run by dying right before you get to the bosses? The bosses do not appear until you get a certain distance to forwards, so I would figure that if you hit an enemy and press left for 1 frame into it, it will send you forwards slightly making the boss appear quicker.
We tried this, but it appeared to be impossible to save time with it.
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Awesome movie! When FODA finished his run, I didn't think anyone would try to improve it anytime soon, and especially complete the TAS this fast. Some very nice inventive improvements, great job :)
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Lorenzo_The_Comic wrote:
FractalFusion wrote:
Mega Man 3, 4, 5, 6 would be crazy.
I think it would be impressive if every game fights bosses at the same time, although it would be hard to do.
Hmm, I could try that someday, even though I haven't been playing these games for a long time, since 2004.
I don't think you quite understand the idea. What FractalFusion meant was synchonizing the boss fights in the entire TAS (which completes all four games).
From what I understand (also from the "I'm new to TASing"-thread), you are talking about non-tool-assisted speedrunning. I am sometimes surprised by what people can accomplish without tools, but I can assure you it's impossible to complete megaman 3,4,5 and 6 with the same input in realtime (don't know if it could be called a speedrun anyway, it would more be like showing it's possible to complete them all in realtime with the same input, but like I said, this is not even remotely possible). If you in fact were talking about doing it in realtime somehow, then you were suggesting you would synchronize the boss fights also in real time also?
If you were only talking about doing 4 bossfights at the same time, non-tool-assisted, then I still think it's extremely hard to do... but also really arbitrary. It's not what FractalFusion meant at all, and I don't know what the purpose of it would be (it would even be debatable if it's really from the same input when doing it realtime, since the frames will desync, and it's not possible to play back the movie with the same movie file on all games).
Then the last option I see it that you were if fact talking about a real TAS, and doing it with the boss fights synchronized. This would be pretty redundant, since there would already be a quad megaman 3,4,5 and 6 TAS. It would only be slower (since you would have to slow down a lot, and bump into walls) to synchronize all movies, and it would seem like a big waste of time. Although, if you did mean this (which would mean you quoted FractalFusion in the right way), it would be pointless to mention you haven't played these games in a long time... since you would be making a TAS anyway. It would also be strange to mention you could try it someday, since doing it would take more like a year than a day.
