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MrGrunz wrote:
bombs don't do as much damage like a sword, deku stick or bow, so how should this be useful?
OoT is also really limited with the number of bombs, so this shouldn't be really helpful for boss battles
You do realize it doesn't matter that much that it doesn't do alot of damage. The point is that on bosses where you normally have to wait for them after you hit them 1 time, you can hit them multiple times with bombs. If this is possible. it can reduce some bosses that took more than 1 cycle down to 1 cycle, because you can hit them more than the normal amount of times during that cycle. This is all based on the assumption that pulling out the ocarina (or whatever other items it works with) does remove the cooldown that yourself (and enemies) have in between getting hit. But, more than likely, the cooldown is for getting hit is just completed by the time the ocarina is taken away, and instead, the bomb explosion damage duration is just extended from pulling out the ocarina.
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MrGrunz wrote:
we know that in the SDA irc for a long time already
the only useful place for this are death warps. it can't speed up a ESS or something, because the Hyper infinite superslide uses the knockback speed from the bomb and this is the maximum speed we can gain from damage ;)
it also works only in OoT and doesn't requier ocarina. you can do it with a lot of things, like zelda's letter etc. just to prove, that we really know it for a while already ;)
Somehow, I'm still not convinced. A test that someone (wink wink MrGrunz) could try is to put a bomb down in front of you, throw a bomb behind you, use the front bomb to SS off of, and have it timed so when the bomb that was behind you explodes, it is in front of Link's shield during a SS.
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I'm gonna post this in here and in the OoT thread.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JJAFu1TiTxQ
A couple of questions about some possibilities with this:
Could you combine this with superslide to add more force, and basically make the SS faster? From my understanding of SS, the initial explosion has the most force, but has anyone ever tried to add additional force while SSing?
"I think we can put our differences behind us... for science, you monster."
Joined: 4/18/2006
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I'm gonna post this in here and on the MM thread.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JJAFu1TiTxQ
A couple of questions about some possibilities with this:
Could you combine this with superslide to add more force, and basically make the SS faster? From my understanding of SS, the initial explosion has the most force, but has anyone ever tried to add additional force while SSing?
"I think we can put our differences behind us... for science, you monster."
Joined: 4/18/2006
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Kuwaga wrote:
There is a difference between graphical disabling (transparency) and real disabling of the C-Buttons. And on vines they're maybe just not usable because you're not grounded. But that's a very interesting observation you've made there.
Yeah. I had a suspicion about that. I wish I knew how to read the values for these elements, like the veterans in here do. I would venture to say that there are values associated to the HUD elements (such as visibility, 'graying out', the item's image on each button, the 'Navi' button that appears, etc.) and values that are associated with game mechanics (delays linked to Link's animations for being able to perform certain actions, control enable/disable, what position Link is currently in, etc).
That makes sense, but if you ignore the HUD values, I still think there is clearly a global 'Enable/Disable User Controls' value that is set at certain sequences. It's gotta be hard to distinguish the differences between all these values... :-/
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bkDJ wrote:
chaosv1 wrote:
To clarify, the glitch works with something that deactivates A,B, and C buttons(like the tunnel). For w/e reason the game takes a while to reactivate the controls after you climb out of the tunnel so that if you do something else that deactivates your buttons(like activating text), the game will reactivate the buttons while you are talking.
Anywhere these conditions can be met, the glitch should be able to be activated
So... ladders?
Ladders don't re-enable control when you let go of them. The game handles that. You need to find events that specifically control disable/enabling of the buttons.
Also, I have this observation about climbing and the C buttons that I just noticed:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=92bNoWJRHOs
My video explains that it doesn't really make much sense. Lol. Exploitable? Probably not.
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Comicalflop wrote:
So then how is freezing the camera in place going to help Link get up to a place he normally cannot get to? UP denotes height. I so far see the glitch being used to get past something, not above something. The new glitch gets past an obstacle, but the type of obstacle is different for the fishing pond in trying to skip the scarecrow song.
JSmith wrote:
The glitch seems to be an effect of the triggered dialog rather than the crawl space.
If this were so, why was the trick found in Kokiri forest, and why do both methods- Navi text, and the sign- require you to, you know, crawl through the hole in order to achieve it? Otherwise, someone would have found this back when ISG was discovered, because according to you, those requirements (activating a text) are all that's needed.
From what I can tell, the glitch happens because, for some reason, when you get out of the crawl position, the value, lets call it AllowCButtons, is set to 1 (on) continuously for the duration of the 'getting out of the crawl position' sequence. So, when a text bubble comes up, which would normally set AllowCButtons to 0 (off), the 'getting out of crawl position' sequence is still setting AllowCButtons to 1 (on), so they are set to being on.
Actually, it is probably that the Dialog sets the AllowCButtons to 0, and then once the 'getting out of the crawl position' sequence ends, it sets AllowCButtons to 1. This works since the dialog only sets AllowCButtons to 0 once at the beginning of the dialog.
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chaosv1 wrote:
Synx wrote:
hmmm, I've been thinking.
Can't that trick be used elsewhere in the game also?
If it can, isn't there other places such a trick would save time?
Elsewhere yes,
save time who knows it still needs more testing
If you do this glitch, and then jump into water, you do a slide in the water, but it doesn't seem to be as fast as a superslide. Also, just going into the sliding motion on the water changes the camera angle you are looking at.
Edit: When you press start, you will regain full controls (jump, etc).
This gives you full controls, but you are permanently stuck in this view until you enter a loading zone. You can only do this after pulling out the ocarina, it seems.
Edit2: Nope, figured it out without the ocarina. All you do it hit C-Up after you are in this mode. This will scroll through any text and will then release the talking dialog that you were previously stuck in, so then you can just hit start to release controls.
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Ver Greeneyes wrote:
Synx wrote:
I don't get it... why is there tons of action with majoras mask, but no action here.
Does this count? Discussion seemed to indicate the old way would still be faster for a TAS..
Does anyone know if you can do this on other mini-cutscenes? Is there anything else in the game that is like the crawling sequence? Maybe coming out of certain buildings or something.
Edit: Also, If I head toward certain places, the game either starts to freak out and change camera angles, or basically, put me into a statis, where I'm frozen and can't move and it is set to a fixed angle. This happened while I was trying to get to the Deku Tree area.
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Wyster wrote:
Okay got some really crazy problems here, I'm about halfway through Frigate(which is going amazing and fast btw), However, yesterday after first pause, i tried to playback, and i thought i had gotten a desynch when nothing was chosen during pause. But today i tried again and IT SYNCHED. So i thought like "Wieerd, but okay i guess i'll playback again and continue progress", but this time it didn't synch, twice in a row. So i restart mupen and this time it synched again. Next try it didn't.
So it seems the game only synchs on first playback and none of the following? I've never seen or heard of anything like it.
I have no idea if my second problem is possible to fix but the water on frigate is just beyond terrible. I thought Rice's and Napalm had fixed that problem somewhat but appareantly it's no diffrent at all. The water is made up of a green hypnotic background. It's extremely annoying and if someone knows a way to just remove it or something(Without sky glitch like in RT's run, and btw, i know nothing of how this problem occurs but i don't suppose replacing the water texture would help? Like a hi-res pack or something) that'd be awesome.
Edit:
Frigate Test run: http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/945598202/Frigate%20in%20progress.m64
I finished this run 3 times in 0:59 seconds but appareantly the graphical issues is making the game desynch like hell. And to that add that it's practicly impossible to optimize ending since i cant see a thing! I simply don't have to patience to sit and make this synch, you'll just gonna have to take my word for it that's it's a COMPLETED 59 second run.
Without a fix to this graphics problem i'm not gonna continue/redo.[/url]
Mine doesn't desync... it just crashes Mupen when you are going into the pause menu.
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So, I've tried 3 different Ghoul School (U)'s, and all of them were the same, meaning they didn't display the background. Those versions of the ROM do display the background in other emulators than FCEU, but obviously that isn't useful. Then, I used Ghoul School (U) [b1], and it displayed the background. It also worked fine with this TAS, despite the checksum being different. Basically, anyone who has problems with Ghoul School (U), use Ghoul School (U) [b1], and it'll play fine.
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nineko wrote:
Flygon wrote:
Give me a video and I'll give you an upload to youtube.
Anyway, will give a proper opinion when an encode is made. =P
It will be up in ~15 minutes.
edit: woo it was faster than I thought. Encode.
But... but... that doesn't have the background either. Honestly, I've never heard of this game, but I can view videos of it on YouTube, and it has stuff in the background. It's not even interesting to watch it without him jumping over things; he is just jumping, and we can't see why.
Edit: This is what the background looks like:
[URL=http://img15.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ghoulschoolnestopia.jpg][/URL]
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Derakon wrote:
DemonStrate: that's the space-time glitch, and it's pretty well-known. You can use it to reset the bits that mark which items have been obtained, which bosses have been killed, etc., without clearing the items you already have...that said, using it breaks the "100%" concept because items you've already obtained are now available to be gotten again. I didn't watch all of the video, but it looks like it's mostly demonstrating the visual glitches you get (blocks visually offset to the side, junk data above Samus' ship, etc.) and the fact that items are available to be obtained again.
I don't see the space-time glitch being useful unless it let you bypass barriers like the select glitch in Metroid 2...but to my knowledge, it doesn't.
Gotcha. Thanks!
@moozooh: Yeah, if you've seen Donnie Darko, it just makes me think of the Fear <--> Love spectrum, which clearly doesn't make any sense. I know you know there are other states than just Progress and Dead, as Kyrsimys mentioned.
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Sorry if couldn't find this, but was this video posted at some point? Its old, so I'm hoping it was.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=97tuIfG4n5Y
Useful for 100p maybe? Idk. I don't really get what is going on.
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snorlax wrote:
As long as the center tile of a square remains (or the main tile, which you would bulldoze and which flashes the lighning bolt), a developed zone retains its population forever.
Using that concept, a maximum population run would be very interesting to watch.
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Posts: 179
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FatRatKnight wrote:
I made a different layout. It reaches capital before I do the money trick, and 600k population by 1902 NOV. This one is pretty close to being perfect.
I'm not sure if it's possible to manipulate the warnings into never appearing. Pollution and crime will always be present, but even though they are running rampant in the megalopolis...
The weird thing I noticed about this, is that if you let the game keep playing after the disasters, it goes down to 28800, and stays there, even though there aren't any buildings with power or nearly any complete squares at all. Why are there still residents?
"I think we can put our differences behind us... for science, you monster."
I was able to jump down there from the other side of that area from your other smv. I glitched onto the fence on that side, and it lets you jump into the water (but I didn't have flippers). Also, how does the Edge Jumping work? I don't know when I'm supposed to use the mirror, and what direction I should be pressing while warping, or whatever needs to be done to make it work. I figured out that the chicken farm glitch, you just literally wiggle onto the next screen, but the edge jumping baffles me.
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Sounds like the key to a successful TAS of this is to figure out how to get knockbacked through walls. That would be so amazing to see all the shortcuts that it could be used for.
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Derakon wrote:
I'm sorry, but I just can't read "Guess what guys I did" the way I'm pretty certain it was intended.
Looking forward to an encode, though. Always good to see a new movie from you!
How did everyone else not burst out laughing when they read that first line! Dyslexic much? It reads, "Guess what guys I did while I was stuck in Rockman 2 and had too much free time!"
Firstly, is that supposed to be a question? Whats with the exclamation point? Is is supposed to be, "Guess what I did guys while I was stuck in Rockman 2 and had too much free time?" I guess that is how someone would speak. Or, could it be him declaring, "Guess which guys I had sex with while my piece was stuck inside of Rockman 2's body and just had so much free time!!!!" Thats saying it in the most in offensive way possible; I hope. Anyway, I'll check out the run later.
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marzojr wrote:
DemonStrate wrote:
What is the requirement of a hill or angle to be able to jump off of it to gain forward momentum?
Ground speed, slope gradient and how (and if) the slope gradient is changing. The optimal jumps to make in slopes are the ones that not only actually increase your speed, but that leave you with (a) a positive vertical speed (going down) or (b) the ones that leave you with a really high negative vertical speed (going up) and end by hitting the ceiling before speed reaches the drag range (upward speed in the 0 to -1000 range). With Tails in particular, any slope jump that allows you to start flight at or above the screen's top edge before drag kicks in is also optimal, in that your vertical speed will be set to zero when you start flight in these cases and prevent further loss to drag (SLZ2 is the perfect example).
Jumping also makes a slight (1-frame) pause during which position is not changed. This must be considered when determining if a slope jump is worth it.
DemonStrate wrote:
There are a few levels where there is a hill, and I didn't know if there was a reason you don't jump forward off of it.
The most likely reason is that I would lose most of the speed gained (and then some) because of drag. The second most likely reason is that the speed gain is not enough to reduce the time further (because of the 1-frame cost or because the distance is too short or both), and the jump would not have any entertainment value.
Of note:
DemonStrate wrote:
Like in Marble Zone 3, at the end of it before the boss.
Jumping from that slope loses most of the benefits to drag, even if I jump at the last frame with slope 16 (I actually have two jump one frame before that or the loss will be even worse). It also prevents me from making that jump at the end; that jump is made at high speed in the change from slope -8 to slope 8 (possible due to speed and subpixel position). That jump grants me the vertical speed boost of slope -8 with the forward speed boost of slope 8; the time it takes for the vertical speed to reach the drag range makes me suffer from only 7 frames of drag before it becomes irrelevant (as the screen stops scrolling because I reach the boss area).
DemonStrate wrote:
Or in Spring Yard 2, at then end of it.
In this case, the speed gain nets exactly the frame lost due to the jump and nothing else.
DemonStrate wrote:
Edit: Also, as of not the latest WIP, but the one before it, mine desyncs at, I believe, Labyrinth Zone 3. It still does this in the latest also.
Nineko beat me to the punch (the server was under heavy load when I wrote the original reply), but: it is very likely that you are using the version v2.1 of the hack; I have checked, and the movie desynchs in Labyrinth 3 with that version. The movie is meant to be played with v2.1.1, a bugfix release that was released shortly after v2.1.
Wow, thanks for the explanation of that. Most people usually don't go into such great detail, and I've never really looked into the specifics of movement in a Sonic game works. I understand the basic glitches and such, but this was just something I was wondering about.
Also, thanks for notifying me about the update to the game. It gets annoying when things desync and I have no idea why. I'm not used to the fact of a 16-bit game getting updated. Lol.
Finally, thanks for the constant WIP updates. I enjoy watching them, even if its hard for me to tell the noticeable difference from the previous WIP.
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I was wondering something. What is the requirement of a hill or angle to be able to jump off of it to gain forward momentum? Like, does it have to be at a certain angle, or anything? There are a few levels where there is a hill, and I didn't know if there was a reason you don't jump forward off of it. Like in Marble Zone 3, at the end of it before the boss. Or in Spring Yard 2, at then end of it.
Edit: Also, as of not the latest WIP, but the one before it, mine desyncs at, I believe, Labyrinth Zone 3. It still does this in the latest also.
"I think we can put our differences behind us... for science, you monster."
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Edit: This is the same problem that Randil states above this post.
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