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If nothing else, it is a complement to Sleepz that Phil could only improve his run by 36 frames and not do anything more entertaining along the way. He made a faster run, that is for sure, but failed at making one that is more entertaining. Whether or not this run gets published, you have something to be proud of, Sleepz.
The completion time is only a hint for lazy judges.
so it pretty much has the same purpose as the voting system. :p
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player
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Maybe the 36 frames of improvement was done to purposely start this argument, and in that case can be classified as entertaining. Was that the genius behind it all?!
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Speed is entertaining. Frame Battles are not.
This argument is similar to what started in the competition over NES Track and Field. For those of you who were not here when it happened, you can check it out here: http://tasvideos.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=218
It was established then that this site is not an ego collection and that speed does not come before entertainment. I still vote yes here though, provided that sleepz gets credit.
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Sleepz wrote:
Why would you even bother to do something like this if you can’t add anything to the table? As FODA said, this is really a stab in the back.
I felt the same way when Phil and Genisto beat a run of mine by a mere 4 time units. I worked hard and submitted a run 1 time unit faster than theirs. The reason I didn't feel guilty about publishing it was because much of the strategies I discovered myself. The tactics I did not find I gave credit to the authors who discovered them. I don't think it is backstabbing as long as the proper credit is given to those who contributed to the tricks. Thus, if this run is published, Sleepz should be fully credited for his work. In fact, I believe this should be the standard for all runs.
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If Sleepz submitted this run, would we even be having a discussion?
Here's how I'd think this topic would have instead played out:
"Wow, Sleepz, you did it again!"
"I didn't expect this improvement. Nice work!"
"And I thought it couldn't have been done any faster. Good job at finding that small improvement."
"We're getting closer to perfecting this run; I really liked how you handled 4-1"
Now I'm a Sleepz fan myself, but to remain objective, it is important to judge the run and not its author. You have my yes vote, Phil.
Edit: Oh, and after Sleepz would have his run published, we'd get these comments:
"What codec do you use for this avi? I can't watch this run!"
"how do you do that double-jump thing?!"
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It is a misconception that till emerged as a short form of until. The word till is actually older than until. They both came into usage around 800 years ago, but till came first. Additionally, the usage 'till came in the 1700s. If there is any complaint, it should be about 'til, which is the most modern form of the word.
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when I first visited the site, it was one page with about half a dozen or so runs including an unfinished MM3 run by bisqwit. There was no forum at that time. I didn't take a screenshot though, because I had no idea the site would grow to be what it is today.
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Isn't there a way to face the insane difficulty AI? You can't choose it normally, but I think you can use the insane AI script if you make a custom map that triggers it. It's been a while since I've played this game though...
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this is something we mostly did as kids to impress one another. My friend used to tell me that in Donkey Kong Country, everytime you land on the last boss, one of his teeth will fall out. Collect them all and a bird will come to transport you to an island where you will face Banana Man.
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He probably doesn't want someone to just copy his run, make only small changes then create a new WR out of that.
I do think a lot of speedrunning is just practising sequences until it is all encoded in procedural memory and happens almost unconsciously. Coming up with routes and creative strategies is the best part because this is where most of the thinking is involved. I think to demonstrate whether one player is truly more skillful than another you'd have to make them do something that goes out of their preparation. Let them play a cart that randomly generates levels and see who handles them better. This, however, would be very difficult to arrange.
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Want to comprimise? Use the term timeattack around those who are familiar with it or in places where it is defined or the context clear, but use "tas" otherwise. Examples:
"hey guys, check out this timeattack of Metroid. Even though savestates and slowdown were used, I still think it looks really cool."
"someone should timeattack this game" (on this forum)
"Here's a site with speedruns that are tool-assisted: http://bisqwit.iki...."
Personally, on my own site, even thought Time Attack is in the title, all the runs have a disclaimer explaining that tools were used to create them.
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The main obstacle here seems to be personal preference.
yes, this is my main argument. As I said before, dogmatism plays a big role.
Then please leave this topic. This is for those who want to contribute to the topic. Not for people who want to tell others they're wasting their time. We don't see it this way.
There are quite a few people who have posted in this topic who think it is a waste of time. Since there has been almost no progress after ten pages of posting, there is at least some reason to believe so. I'm not saying this to belittle you, I simply believe this topic breeds a negativity that can only escalate.
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The name itself is awful to pronounce or think out loud.
say it ten times fast, and do the same with tool-assisted speedrun. Now tell me the latter is easier to pronounce. You probably think it sounds better because you are more familiar with it. Notice that using a term that sounds good is one of the arguments for which your rival Arc was pushing.
This is an attempt to attach an explanation to a name due to its controversy, something which is redundant
No, this is an attempt to demonstrate that this term, tool-assisted speedrun, and similar terms are just labels that could work equally well. This topic is just about dogmatism and various users clinging on to their pet terms.
The term "tool" applies to the emulator; and the emulator describes techniques, such as save states and slowdown, which can be further divided into luck manipulation or other such possibilities
When a person looks at the word "tool", it will then make them think of an emulator, which then make them think of techniques, which then helps them realize luck and manipulation are involved? This is a slippery slope fallacy.
Speedruns exist for serveral purposes, all which pertain to our movies as well
Speedruns exist to demonstrate players thinking on their feet, controlling their nerves while playing in one sitting, and trying recover from mistakes as they play on to finish the game. This does not pretain to our movies, so your statement is false. In addition, calling yourselves speedrunners is something pure speedrunners might find insulting. But this is for another endless forum topic we could make.
Unlike your term, "tool-assisted speedrun" is very easy to read, and doesn't have a slash, which breeds only annoyance for both sender and receiver of the term.
yes, using a dash is superior to using a slash. Why would you even argue this? Don't tell me "tool-assisted speedrun" is very easy to ready. Words like This, Topic, Is and Pointless are examples of easy words to read.
In closing, tool-assisted speedrun is a term I'd conceade to using. I'll even call them like superplays now and then. I just wish I could call this topic "locked" one day.