Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Skilled player
(1091)
Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom
In both instances I had already taken out the bomb at its earliest point. Both points left me with slightly too much time and so placing the bomb doesn't really matter.
bkDJ -- I remembered that your method won't work. You can't superslide on ice.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Skilled player
(1091)
Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom
I can see what you're getting at. It sounds like a perfectly valid idea, however, it would be a very deep angle to make the exit from a superslide and pushing into the wall at such an angle would slow Link right down so there may not be any frame-profit at the end of it.
It's worth looking into. It's at the very end of the file so it won't take too much effort to investigate :)
Yautja -- I couldn't backwalk and shield drop because I never had time before the bomb explodes. If I remember correctly I took out the bomb at the earliest point (after the backflip, i think?) which meant that I wouldn't lose any time by placing the bomb down normally.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Skilled player
(1091)
Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom
monotoli doesn't seem to be loading up for me at the moment. I'll have to guess at the times you're refering to.
1:31 -- If you are refering to between the first superslide and the invisible platforms. The angle I used was te best I could use to get as close as possible to the platforms without activating the owl text..
1:25 (if this is right then 1:31 is wrong) -- No, I tried many a time. I was sure it looked possible, but the little guy never quite made it. The same was true when doing the invisible platforms. The backflip isn't all that good.
2:30 -- It would be pointless to superslide because I sidejump just after the Goron to position myself for the jump towards the exit.
Yautja -- I'll look at that as soon as I get the download to work.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Skilled player
(1091)
Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom
I've redone up until leaving Goron Village.
Take a look at this WIP and get back to me on it. I was going to hold off until the end of the cycle, but this redo has been a stress. There are so many ways to get to the lens of truth and it was a nightmare to test them all. I think I have the fastest methods, but tell me if you think I have missed anything.
I want this cycle done and out of the way asap.
http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/3396/ZELDA%20MAJORA%27S%20MASK.m64
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Skilled player
(1091)
Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom
I would think so, however, if I can backflip and sidehop across the invisible platforms (ie. Shop to Mido style) then sidehopping up there and then backlipping onto the path above would probably be faster.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Skilled player
(1091)
Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom
I can definitely see the logic in a hack forum. Hacks are clearly becoming more popular and hack TASes are being made and obsoleted in a fashion that is no way different from normal runs.
I disagree for subforums within the hack forum as I don't see it as neccessary. Just 'Game Hacks' or 'Hacks and Concept Demos' would fit everything.
I think a forum such as this would make sense in an organisation similar to that of the 'Other' or the 'Speedrun Competitions' forum (the latter of which is already pretty dead and a hacks/concept demos forum would capture much more interest).
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Skilled player
(1091)
Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom
I wouldn't expect to any of these runs until summertime at least. I can't speak for the others, but in my case --
- I've been working on this solidly for two months now. I have had 37 desyncs, 25000 rerecords, each area has probably been redone at least once and I'm not even 10% of the way there yet :)
- Also as the year goes on other commitments will arise (eg. exams etc.) and I have also recently found new job and girlfriend. In short, I do have a life.
- You will probably see most progress over 'bare' areas of the year e.g. over xmas and new year I did quite a bit of this run because most other commitments were put on hold. Future times such as this are mid-february, easter and (the good news!) 100% free from June to September (this is my target area).
Anyway, in short, don't expect to look in the workbench forum tomorrow morning and see it. Sorry :(
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Skilled player
(1091)
Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom
That was really impressive. Much better than I anticipated and if mrz's is faster then this will be a very high quality run. Very looking forward to it :)
Now hurry up and do the levels I haven't got to yet :P
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Skilled player
(1091)
Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom
The main reason i'm restarting, again, is like you said. I haven't properly looked into what health stars I will need for the future.
I realised shortly after doing this that I could have made extra use of a star at the end of level three and also when I come to inside the claw machine I can take some damage there.
I'm going to watch back through my old movie whenever I get the chance and properly figure out how much I need.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Skilled player
(1091)
Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom
I redid the bridges area and saved 126 frames.
I threw my strategy about a bit. I ended up with one that was somehow 15 frames slower (no idea how, it seems much better), however, it does let me superslide brilliantly across the last two bridges which saves the time.
I think that area is about as good as it's going to get. Now for the village.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Skilled player
(1091)
Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom
Yes, i work on this when MM is going slowly.
I've restarted this run several times and have discovered lots of tricks etc. to make it amazing.
On just the first two levels I've saved over a minute on the run I submitted back in September.
I decided not to use the invincibility glitch because it isn't even a glitch but a cheat (in my opinion anyway).
http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/3375/toystory-tas-mukki.gmv
Here's what I've done so far, but there are still a couple of things I'd like to go back and change.
I'm actually really looking forward to your run Stanski. I reckon if I really do the business here I can get sub-20 minutes...maybe...if I find a few more things.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Skilled player
(1091)
Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom
Keep in mind the speed that the notes are going in at. No one will recognise the song.
It'd be cool to have a song in there that sounds like a mess of shit to everyone else, but we get it. All we really need is that song. Im all for Bolero of Fire if that's what everyone wants, the Simpsons sounds good, also the theme from 'The Mask' was funny.
I'll sleep on it tonight and I'll see if I can come up with something.
I'll redo the last part of the Second cycle tomorrow. I'm confident it won't desync either so I can just play through at my leisure without having to watch back every 30 seconds.
Here's what I will change --
- Will not do owl statue later. Unproven whether faster or not.
- Will start off on the bridges. Will try supersliding up the slopes (unlikely, but worth a shot). Will try and luck manipulate Wolfos so I can superslide.
- Will try the backflips and sidehops across invisible platforms (doubt it will work).
- Will otherwise roll jump on platforms.
- Will roll jump from bridge and try sidehoping up the slope.
- Will try backwalking into graveyard.
If I am missing anything speak now or forever hold your peace.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Skilled player
(1091)
Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom
Of course it wouldn't work if it were is this frame perfect? 10, is it not? 0.
When I rate in this category I read submission texts, forum threads etc to gain a better idea of the game and what else could be done.
Whilst watching the movie you are thinking, was that jump the best it could be? Would the top platform be faster than the bottom?
The only way to answer these questions would be to properly TAS the game yourself. This is something most people wouldn't bother to do and so the tech rating would be based on reasonably false evidence.
That it is really why i think it is pointless.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Skilled player
(1091)
Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom
Fabian wrote:
I noticed there's a movie format called "DMG", and when you click it it says "Error, format not recognized". I don't really get that, is it supposed to be a joke? I've never heard of DMG and don't see it mentioned anywhere on this site. It also seems odd that all the major movie formats seem to be supported except for game boy movies. Hope someone can fill me in here.
That is exactly the joke.
There was a big argument a few weeks back because people kept reffering to Game Boy as DMG and most people never knew what the hell it meant. Hence "format not recognised".
My personal favorite part of the program, rather clever :)
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Skilled player
(1091)
Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom
The reason I never did a superslide on the last part of the bridge is because the White Wolfos always got in my way (where I dropped the bomb was where it always appeared). I could try different ways to try and luck manipulate its white ass out my way, but even doing that would probably take more time.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Skilled player
(1091)
Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom
primorial#soup wrote:
An alternative might be Aerodactyl, which knows Hyper Beam from the start (as well as Bite, which isn't bad).
Aerodactyl sounds like a good option imo. The speed and attack is great, but my main reason lies in its speed, which would allow us to take full use of this. For example, this is the fastest battle message in the game (if I remember correctly) --
XXX used bite.
XXX flinched.
For us it would be --
Aerodactyl used bite.
Critical Hit!
XXX flinched.
Which is faster than --
Snorlax used lazy bastard beam.
Critical Hit!
XXX used blindfolded tackle.
XXX's attack missed.
Then again we can use Gyrados' bite for the same purpose. This would cut out the need for glitching high-level pokemon, of which I am still in doubt over how much time it would save.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Skilled player
(1091)
Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom
I checked that. It doesn't seem to save any time because it is awkward getting from the entrance to mountain village to leaving it so you might as well take the long way and hit the statue.
Any way, a few questions --
1) What needs redone here? all I can think of is roll jumping the first platform (both directions) and roll jumping off te bridge on my way to the goron graveyard. What else? Superslides? The owl statue?
2) Let's now look forward to the third (and final, yay!) cycle. Inverted song of time? Is this needed? I calculated (on my PAL version) that without it I will only have about an hour of play time to complete the game. Is this enough? I don't want to get within touching distance just to run out of time.
Also, the scarecrow song, I want something good/imaginative/different. I have a few ideas running around my head, but I am definitely open to others.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Skilled player
(1091)
Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom
YautjaElder wrote:
The only thing that might be improvable is when you jump across those invisible platforms. Have you tried roll jumps (as in rolling when you get near the edge to get a boosted jump)? I'm not totally sure if it is faster than jumping normally, though it is one of my most basic reflexes when playing OoT/MM.
If you mean can I skip the third platform by roll jumping from platform 2 to 4 then no. I roll jumped and jumpslashed but still never made it.
I only find that roll jumping is faster when trying to gain distance, in this situation it would just put me further across the platforms that are small anyway and because they are tractionless it means that the second jump will be worse (i.e. pissweak because of small build up or extended 'slipping on the spot' due to greater distance to turn and momentum to overcome).
Well, that was my thinking behind my actions, and my testing backed me up. I could still be wrong of course.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Skilled player
(1091)
Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom
Raiscan wrote:
I noticed you paused slightly after you climb up that place just after exiting the cave with the Lens of Truth. Any particular reason you did this?
If I pull back on the joystick too early Link will run off the ledge. I have to delay movement until a certain point until I can backwalk. Well spotted though.
Raiscan wrote:
Also after you go back to the area with tingle in it, you walk forward and hop off onto the frozen lake, then Z target and continue. if you Z targeted, backflipped off the bridge then continued would it be faster?
If I backflipped I would drop too close to the bridge. A normal jump would gain more distance and backwalking beforehand wouldn't really save any time.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Skilled player
(1091)
Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom
Hmm...interesting views, but i'll have to disagree on most.
Sidehops aren't as much of a godsend as you'd imagine. They are only beneficial if you are moving 90 degrees to your current position, otherwise you have to adjust yourself. Rolls get you just about anywhere.
The slopes in Goron village you are reffering to are probably those for use when you have the Goron mask.
You may be right, of course and I respect your input. Let's see what the rest of the gang think.
http://files.filefront.com//;6467193;;/
^^^^^^^MOVIE RIGHT HERE ^^^^^^^
EDIT -- Just noticed the name is a super typo. Ignore it. I was in a rush :(
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Skilled player
(1091)
Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom
I agree with Zurreco on the following runs --
SMB2 -- I never realised this had a star until you mentioned it. A good run, but it doesn't really offer much that SMB doesn't (which is without a star although it is considered frame perfect).
Gimmick! -- Nitsuja's run is worthy I feel. It would be good for potential TASers as it demonstrates a prime example of a TASable game. Colour, variation, fast movement, it's all in there.
HnF -- The only reason I think this got a star for is how good the movement looks, however, this same style of movement is already shown in a much better form in Umihara Kawase.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Skilled player
(1091)
Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom
I agree entirely with JXQ. Being dickish doesn't do anyone any good.
Most people fail their first attempt, Goldude, don't let it discourage you from making future runs. Hopefully you will :)
