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I think maps, compasses, and boss keys should count for 100%, although I dislike the idea of adding 30 seconds per dungeon of 'you got a thing' cutscenes.
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jlun2 wrote:
Spikestuff wrote:
For example most of the Super Mario 64 tas had to be tweaked due to a ton of desync.
Uh...not exactly. According to this post, SoulCal only changed the format to make it work with the bot. Otherwise, the frame count and button data is exactly the same:
SoulCal wrote:
However I did have to modify the hell out of the m64 to play it back right, but all frame and button data is the exact same (just some formatting).
Since then, I have modified the Droid64 to accept .m64 files directly, so it's 100% the original author's content.
However, 1 game I tested, Mischief Makers, polls differently for the first 2 frames, then it polls at 60Hz. To compensate I added in 1 blank frame to counter the variable pollrate at startup. Possibly with SNES when starting up Super Mario World or the console itself, the extra frame is introduced in a similar manner. I would think that since the TAS synced on the All-Stars cartridge instead of doing a playback on the original SMW, it had to clear the SNES ram when loading SMW, and maybe clearing ram takes a frame.
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Phallosvogel wrote:
Awesome, looks really entertainig even to someone who has never played the game. One thing: Can you explain how you did get out of bounds, like at around 54:00? And how much time do you safe/what does it skip?
The ditman glitch causes some weird effects in the game. Going on that zip line twice with the glitch active for some reason makes Leon go OoB. It skips a boss fight containing two of those giants. The time saved really isn't that much, cause if I had a rocket launcher there, the fight would be over in seconds. If I didn't use the RL in the previous room, I'd have to clip OoB in that room, and that is slower.
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Have you tried both builds on your end to see if there is a difference in the "frame" and "VI" values when you run a game? Maybe it's just RE4 being iffy? I'll try some more hexing in my dtm, but if the numbers don't match up I don't see it syncing. If we can't get a proper encoding emulator, then I don't see my run getting accepted. :(
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RachelB wrote:
Here, should be what you need. Don't tas with it, but it should sync your movie.
rachelB, this AVhack build of yours has the same flaw as the 383 build, where the "frame" value is 2 or 3 units off, and it won't sync. Does something mess with the timing of the emulator?
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I'd like to see Gameboy/GBC/GBA handheld verifications. Those would be the easiest to make a bot for I would think. How accurate is gameboy emulation? Since the GBA plays GB and GBC games, wouldn't a bot on GBA be the best, or are there issues with how GBA handles older games (less lag, faster processing, etc?)
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I am able to get my run to sync on 3.0-371, which is odd because one of the builds on the 1st page uses 3.0-383, and my TAS uses 389. What happens in the 383 AVhack build is the "frame" indicator being 2 units higher than it should be when I do a playback. On the first input (VI = 1) in 371 and 389, the frame amount is 5, but on 383 it is 7.
If anyone is able to, I could use a modified build of 371 with the AVhack. I don't know if 371 has any of the TAS improvements, but disc change does work.
http://www.dolphin-emulator.com/download.html?list=17
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So about this image I made. Ilari is saying I should minimize VIs (real VIs, not the image representation) but in this image frames and VIs are flipped, so I should minimize frames (the bigger number which is VIs)? I've been trying to minimize the VIs (the image version of VIs, or screen drawn) up until this point. This doesn't really account for much until I got the Ditman glitch, because as previously mentioned, there are situations where minimizing one increases the other, and it's due to the abundance of pausing to equip weapons. If I have been wrong, I have lost about 2-3 seconds so far since I got the Striker. It's just weird though because when I compare AVI files, when I minimize the left value the movie file is shorter.
Well that's odd. I guess I'll ask the all-mighty RachelB to help me. He provided me with the version I'm using (by recompiling an existing version with the disc change). Maybe he has the source code? Rachel and a dozen others deserve a a box of cookies for all the help they give me on this site.
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Could anyone provide me with an AVsync build for 3.0-389? I tried the first download on the 1st page, and it sync but runs the game at about 3fps. The next build on there won't playback correctly. RachelB provided me with the current build I'm using, as it has a disc change option.
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GhostSonic wrote:
I thought I'd share my attempt at creating a Genesis Bot here. Tried testing it using Aglar's Sonic 2 run, but unfortunately it desyncs at the end of Chemical Plant Act 2,
and I can't see any way to fix that. There is some slowdown that doesn't occur on gens, it's hard to notice but it occurs at 2:52-2:54, though it's not until the boss that it actually desyncs.
I would check to see if the Genesis has a constant poll rate, or if it varies based on slowdown. I only got Mario64 running (and some of Mischief Makers) only because those 2 games slow down the poll rate when the console lags, while other games don't. Also check if you're using the correct version number (like V1.0 vs V1.1 or whatever Genesis uses). Also try some of the obsolete runs too, to see if those sync better.
Another idea is to check the input file itself at that spot in the run. I could get more and more of Mischief Makers played back by deleting or adding frames here and there. The reason is because sometimes the game didn't poll on some frames, and sometimes it polled twice (which I didn't write code to compensate for). Try deleting or adding an input around the boss section before Sonic dies to see if you can recreate the console playback on the emulator. If you can recreate it, then you found the input you need to edit.
Welcome to the verification club! :)
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RachelB wrote:
Lastly, can I manually change the text displayed in Dolphin to be correct, or would I have to edit and recompile the source code?
What text?
Ilari and I seem to have come to the conclusion that the text that says the VI and frame seem to be mislabeled. In my build, VI is actually the screen draws, and frame is the input.
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RachelB wrote:
SoulCal wrote:
As for being picky about adding/dropping frames, it just seems like a lazy way of fixing the issue to me.
Yes, that was the entire point. The option just makes it so everything works without needing to even edit the output. This can be disabled, and instead dump each frame, along with timecodes for when they should be.
I'm guessing the AVhack has the "easy but slightly inaccurate way" and the "difficult but accurate way". I am in no way a video editing guru, so I guess I'll just leave it to the encoders.
Anyway, the whole thing about "screens drawn" stopping during loading still doesn't make sense to me. If frames aren't drawn, then those black load screens wouldn't exist in the AVI file, right? It just seems weird, cause when I worked with the N64, polling stops for load screen but on the GC it's the opposite? (sorry, beating a dead horse here)
Lastly, can I manually change the text displayed in Dolphin to be correct, or would I have to edit and recompile the source code? If I need to recompile it then I might as well add in the AVhack in too, which I have no idea how to do that.
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Ilari wrote:
Build being able to dump the sound into AVI file is pretty much a dead giveaway of AVhack.
As for the reason to duplicate/drop frames: To keep the video synced with the audio.
My build does not put sound and video together. As for being picky about adding/dropping frames, it just seems like a lazy way of fixing the issue to me. It would make sense to me for each frame to be accounted for equally. The only time the audio desyncs in my build is during pausing and loading, so adding/dropping frames during entirely black screens wouldn't be a visual issue.
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Ilari wrote:
Are you using stock dolphin or AVhack one (the stock dolphin has really bad A/V desyncs)?
- The stock dolphin emits one frame per what is shown as VI (that is, drawn frames).
- The AVhack dolphin if dumping internal sound duplicates and drops frames as needed to keep video framerate constant.
- The AVhack dolphin if dumping external sound emits timecodes file that shows when each frame is supposed to appear.
RachelB gave me the build I am using, but I'm fairly certain it does not have the AVhack. My next question is what would be the advantage of the AVhack if it is adding and deleting frames all willy nilly? Wouldn't that cause inconsistency from what the AVI file should be if every drawn frame isn't accounted for? When I've been doing encodes for YouTube, all I do is delete 1-2 seconds in the audio between load times (since it is nothing but silence) and it syncs up.
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RachelB wrote:
It's a 30 fps game, and the controller is always polled at 60 hz. Small variations in that can probably be attributed to lag.
I think it is polling at 30hz, since the inputs in the dtm files are always doubled. Like if I were to alternate A,B,A,B the dtms would show A,A,B,B,A,A,B,B
And RachelB, how do I use the disc switch function? Do I just need to pause Dolphin on a certain frame and select "Change Disc" then resume playback?
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What I noticed in the dtm files when hexing is that each input seems to be doubled. I assumed from that the framerate is double the poll rate, which sounds incorrect from what you described.
I checked in VirtualDub how many frames both of my AVIs took for minimizing VIs vs minimizing frames. You were correct Ilari, that minimizing VIs is faster although it results in a higher frame count in Dolphin (but you established that as incorrect). What confuses me is that the gamecube seems to be acting the opposite of what I am thinking. If you're saying it should stop producing frames (by stopping the frame counter) during loading screens, then how do frames exist in the AVI files to show load times?
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So about this image I made. Ilari is saying I should minimize VIs (real VIs, not the image representation) but in this image frames and VIs are flipped, so I should minimize frames (the bigger number which is VIs)? I've been trying to minimize the VIs (the image version of VIs, or screen drawn) up until this point. This doesn't really account for much until I got the Ditman glitch, because as previously mentioned, there are situations where minimizing one increases the other. This affects my current WIP in some areas, and may have to redo some sections. :(
Link to video
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I am redoing the mine cart area, and I managed to save 2 frames, but am "slower" by 19 VIs. My improvement is by not using the Ditman glitch after the spike ceiling area. RE4 continues the frame count during loading and pauses, but stops polling the controller. The obvious answer would be to minimize the frame count, but TASvideos uses the number of VIs to determine the movie length. I submitted a dtm to the new WIP section, and it displays the VIs as the # of frames, and that's wrong. Using VIs as the frame count would result, so far, in a movie 3 minutes less than it claims to be.
To conclude: when (or if) the run is finished, we should use the frame count in Dolphin as the movie length, and not controller polls. All in favor? All that oppose?
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itsPersonnal wrote:
no, I can't remember the numbers but I know MilesSMB would, you need something like 1000 or more speed to go though walls, the video on the left got to 23 speed.
How many speed units are gained per jump? What's Samus' normal sideways speed? If you ended that video with 23 speed units, I'm guessing it would be "23 = starting speed + (speed gain per jump) x (# of jumps)."
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Chapter 4 WIP. I will redo some areas to get more rifle ammo, as I underestimated the amount I needed. And RachelB, if you read this, how do I use the disc switch function? Do I need to pause the emulator on a certain frame to select "change disc" in the file menu, or is there a way for Dolphin to change discs on its own?
Link to video
So about this image I made. Ilari is saying I should minimize VIs (real VIs, not the image representation) but in this image frames and VIs are flipped, so I should minimize frames (the bigger number which is VIs)? I've been trying to minimize the VIs (the image version of VIs, or screen drawn) up until this point. This doesn't really account for much until I got the Ditman glitch, because as previously mentioned, there are situations where minimizing one increases the other, and it's due to the abundance of pausing to equip weapons. If I have been wrong, I have lost about 2-3 seconds so far since I got the Striker. It's just weird though because when I compare AVI files, when I minimize the left value the movie file is shorter.