Ambassador, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(698)
Joined: 7/17/2004
Posts: 985
Location: The FLOATING CASTLE
Nice job Cheez, you may have gotten all you can out of normal mode. I think I've figured out just about all the tricks you use. I love your boss 5 kill the second time around, I may try to do a jump through the lasers if I can. My method is to jump off of those spikes under him, it works even without fireball. Also, I think boss 2 is faster with fireball in expert mode but probably not normal due to more hits for each cannon.
Ambassador, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(698)
Joined: 7/17/2004
Posts: 985
Location: The FLOATING CASTLE
The issue with the autofire is that 2 shots come out at a time unless you are both VERY quick and rather lucky.
Jed, do you know about the frame advance? It's all right, I didn't use it on my first run :). Anyway with this you can do all sorts of cool stuff including perfecting shot accuracy and pulling off some pretty freaky stuff. In this game it's an amazing help with the firebounce. Of course this makes doing the runs much more tedious but the results are worth it.
Your run is really good, but there are still a few problems. You could have been more aggressive fireballing through the lasers in level 5. Also, fireball with firebounce kills the first boss faster. On boss 3 why don't you just keep firebouncing? If you are using gun on boss 5 is faster to jump on the spikes, but it doesn't look like you use that glitch at all. I can also see some little movement optimizations but nothing big.
Anyway, I'll vote for this as it is, but I am producing an expert level run which will hopefully be the final word on this game.
Ambassador, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(698)
Joined: 7/17/2004
Posts: 985
Location: The FLOATING CASTLE
You are going to want the 'P' upgrade for that. Actually, the fireball isn't going to save you much, if any, time in stage 2.
From the normal mode it seems like this might be the case. However expert mode has more enemies which take more hits, forcing spots where you have to stop movement. In some places it's not possible to kill enemies with power gun without stopping. In addition, the slowdown can become profound in this game with too many enemies, especially if they shoot (see the test run I posted earlier.) Finally, items are very sparse in expert mode, particularly gravity fireball. I'll be sure to consider everything, but it just seems like all the factors point to fireballing through to the last possible P pickup (this is in level 6 on expert.) This may make the run more entertaining since it will show different strategies on the second fight with each boss.
Update: Finished level 2 using fireball. It did help as I was able to kill just as many enemies in the level, keeping things moving smoothly. It's also faster on the boss, though definitely harder to use.
Gravity fireball rules! I don't doubt now that boss 6 is the only reason to ever use anything else. I am somewhat unsure about the 4-1 subboss as it moves very fast in expert mode and will be hard to tag. The run I'm doing now is going very well, I'm going to finish and submit it ASAP.
Ambassador, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(698)
Joined: 7/17/2004
Posts: 985
Location: The FLOATING CASTLE
Ah, after starting a run with gravity fireball I see why Cheez and others rave about it. Though it's hard to use when playing normally it's totally sweet in a timeattack! I've only finished the first level, but it's clearly better than having power gun, even on the boss. I decided I would be a fireball the whole level and play tag with enemies. I'm able kill almost all of them even though I never fire a shot or slow down.
I'm certain fireball will be faster through level 2 though maybe not on that boss. Level 3 will definitely be fireball and it will do well on that boss as well. Level 4 will look more impressive with power gun and the bosses will probably be about the same. Testing will reveal more. My guess is that level 4 will be about the same either way but the deciding factor will be ensuring that I have fireball at the start of level 5. Level 5 will be all fireball, I think it will do fine on that boss as well. Then in 6 I will switch to power gun for the rest of the game.
So here's my guess as to what the final run will look like:
Start out with fireball. Maybe switch for a little while in level 4 but switch back before 5. Pick up power gun in 6 to finish things up.
Ambassador, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(698)
Joined: 7/17/2004
Posts: 985
Location: The FLOATING CASTLE
Well, I was really just going for kicks and testing, so I thought I'd see how few enemies I could kill. I continued this run up until the rematch with all the bosses, using only power gun as my item. Next I'll do the same with only gravity fireball. Then I'll know for sure what is best where. The final result will use this information to decide when to switch. One more thing, I need to figure out which bosses are affected by kamikaze attacks. I know it's effective on boss 4 but useless on 5. Boss 6 can only be gunned.
Already I can say pretty confidently that from stage 6 on will be all power gun. I haven't seen Cheez's run, but he reported two minutes for boss 6 which is about twice as long as it took me, a time difference which dwarfs any other points. Gravity fireball can save quite a bit of time in stage 5, so it's likely to be used through there. In earlier levels the difference will be more subtle, hence the testing. In general, gravity fireball would be faster through the levels as it would minimize any need to stop forward movement, while power gun will kill most bosses faster.
As a bonus I've discovered the secret to jumping off of spikes. This is an impressive and useful glitch and makes boss 5 much faster.
One thing I want some input on is whether or not it will be allowable to start with a powerup. I am leaning towards doing this, and it will of course either be gravity fireball or power gun. Obviously it gives an advantage, but the code has to be used anyway, and it's not a really that big of a deal. If you had beaten the game in normal and went on to expert you would have your weapon starting out. Just something to think about.
Ambassador, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(698)
Joined: 7/17/2004
Posts: 985
Location: The FLOATING CASTLE
I don't really see it as worth publishing. The beat-em-up adventure is really what golden axe is about anyway, but there is already a nice run of that. Now if someone wants to do a full run through Golden Axe 2 or 3 I might be interested.
Ambassador, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(698)
Joined: 7/17/2004
Posts: 985
Location: The FLOATING CASTLE
Yeah, Blechy's probably right, at this point I probably know what I need to do much better than anyone else. Posting that last run was more like giving a preview than asking for help. But hey, there are a zillion little details that someone is probably going to ask about when I publish so if anyone has a question now, go for it. For example, I have to walk out of Oak after talking to the villager for the first time before warping. Otherwise Stom won't be ready to fight. There are quite a few little quirks like this.
One thing I just realized is I can save a few seconds by waiting until Brynmaer to buy the warp boots. I'll skip the starting money entirely. I can get the boots free in Brynmaer using the shopping glitch so money is no problem. In fact, I can do all the shopping I need to do in one trip this way since I can also get a medical herb for free here. Again, as Blechy pointed out, I'm probably the only one familiar enough with the game to see this.
Hopefully it won't be too long before I have the final version done, but I am taking a little break to mess around with Metal Storm.
Ambassador, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(698)
Joined: 7/17/2004
Posts: 985
Location: The FLOATING CASTLE
I also noticed the differences and wow, this was just amazing. Ever since the first run of this game was posted I've been fascinated with it. Great job!
Ambassador, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(698)
Joined: 7/17/2004
Posts: 985
Location: The FLOATING CASTLE
I liked this one better than Haze Rever's. Definitely a little smarter. However, you fail to use the armor on the fourth boss, it kills him in one hit.
At any rate, I started an expert level run and though it's definitely slower than normal it's far more entertaining. My current work isn't going to be submitted but I think I can get it down after another time or two through. The insane difficulty makes for a nicer show.
Ambassador, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(698)
Joined: 7/17/2004
Posts: 985
Location: The FLOATING CASTLE
After seeing the latest run I thought I would give this a try. Really fun for sure. I used the password at the end of Haze Rever's run so I start out with power gun. Expert mode is where it's at for sure, but it will result in a longer run. I've done two and a half stages and wow, the level of difficulty is insane. I don't know how much gravity fireball would help, the power gun is definitely better in some situations, particularly if you are precise enough to stay right next to the boss.
I show off by killing as few enemies as possible and making some tight squeezes. This looks really impressive in places, though sometimes the slowdown is painful. I think I was faster than Haze Rever on 2-2 with the flipping gates and green squeezing things.
One little glitch when entering the password is that the letters displayed aren't necessarily what is going to be put in. But after I figured it out and was able to put the password in really fast.
Oh, and I haven't missed a shot so far. :) It's actually pretty tough to pull off.
I'd really like to see Cheez's run for comparison but the link is broken.
http://home.comcast.net/~f_amoroso/Metal_Storm-TheAxeManv0.1.fcm
Ambassador, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(698)
Joined: 7/17/2004
Posts: 985
Location: The FLOATING CASTLE
This run was OK. However, it could be faster by using kamikaze attacks on the bosses (with the armor). This kills some of them instantly. Also, it's possible to put in the password for difficult mode in the beginning. It adds a lot more enemies and could be more interesting. I don't know if it would be better or not since it's so tough I've never made it through...
So I think this is an entertaining and promising run, but needs another time through to get a yes from me.
Ambassador, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(698)
Joined: 7/17/2004
Posts: 985
Location: The FLOATING CASTLE
Ok, happy new years everyone:
http://home.comcast.net/~f_amoroso/Crystalis-TheAxeManv0.5.zip
My second full pass for Crystalis, now down to 43:39, much faster than I ever expected. However, there is still some room for improvement which I will address in the final version. This is almost there though, so you get a pretty good idea what it will look like. With a few improvements I think I can get maybe another minute.
There are quite a few reasons for the improvement:
-Some improvements to warp pattern including more usage of warp boots.
-Instead of building to level 13 in Styx I do it on the first level of the Goa fortress. I need level 12 for the first Mado fight and 13 for Kelbesque.
-Kills more enemies as I go, reducing time spent on pure buildup. I almost always hit the needed level at the last possible moment. This was a huge improvement when combined with some of the other items on this list.
-Switching swords to kill more enemies as I go. I can get in and out of inventory in less than a second so sometimes it's worthwhile even for just one enemy.
-Better combat when building up.
-Bosses are a little faster
-I take more hits though I still can't afford to take many. Mostly used on bosses and in the tower.
-I equip the Psycho armor and Sacred shield (though the shield is useless). This lets me take more hits as I get increased defense and HP recovery.
-The tower is done 17 sec faster due to aggressive close-quarter combat.
-Only need to shop for warp boots twice, once in Leaf (buying 2 with the glitch) and again in Portoa (buying 3). I don't buy anything else. However, in my next version I'll buy the medical herb in Portoa instead of getting it from the chest in the sealed cave.
Ambassador, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(698)
Joined: 7/17/2004
Posts: 985
Location: The FLOATING CASTLE
I'm working on a second run-through and I just entered the Goa Fortress. It's looking pretty good so far. I am definitely faster on the level building everywhere. I also do much more killing as I move through some areas, making it faster and more interesting. Sometimes this means I have to switch swords more often. I aim to get each levelup at the last possible moment before I need it and hit this mark pretty well. In particular, I get level 5 right before fighting the giant insect, level 9 on the last enemy in the kirisa cave, and level 12 right before picking up the thunder sword.
Right now I am working on level 13 in the fortress. This will be much faster and more entertaining as I don't have to spend a few minutes killing one stationary enemy over and over. However, I am still figuring out the best way to do it. I can't say when I'll be done with this version, but probably a few days into the new year. It should end up a few minutes faster. I'll be sure to post when it's done.
After that I'll start over and go for a perfect run. I have the game mechanics down pretty well now, so the finished version is going to be tight. Still, about 35% of the run will be level-building, including 5 mins of ice zombies.
Ambassador, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(698)
Joined: 7/17/2004
Posts: 985
Location: The FLOATING CASTLE
Ah, this game+multitap+some buds+lotsa alcohol(to level the field) = a good night of gaming
But you make the single player mode look interesting as well. Though it's still better while drinking... Anyway, nice job. Sure it may be improvable, but it's quite entertaining, great job especially for a first timeattack, you get my vote.
Bomberman kicks ass--but gets his Wario gets the last laugh later on. When are we gonna get rerecording on VisualBoyAdvance???
Ambassador, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(698)
Joined: 7/17/2004
Posts: 985
Location: The FLOATING CASTLE
Excellent start, I love it already. In particular, I loved how you cancel out the enemies shots while skipping on water. I noticed you skipped that cat thing, I hope you have enough money.
Ambassador, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(698)
Joined: 7/17/2004
Posts: 985
Location: The FLOATING CASTLE
Well, I watched your run though I've never seen this game before. It was ok, I think a perfect run would be much more interesting. There is some good action in this game, though spiderman and gambit seem much more interesting than the rest. However, I have to say that the absence of decent music makes this game pretty lame. :(
Ambassador, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(698)
Joined: 7/17/2004
Posts: 985
Location: The FLOATING CASTLE
Good idea about taking out the level 5 guy, but unfortunately this requires resetting, which is unrecordable. You really do only need gold, and only so that you can acquire magic. Once you are magically very powerful, it's time to kick ass! With 25 starting stats, the most you could ask for is 7400 a person, which is a lot. All the magic is acquired at stat level 75, which would mean 5K a person. According to some faq I read, you can get a ship at level 3. Here's a crazy plan, some of these items may be reordered:
-The party is three wizards and a cleric. Race isn't crucial since stats won't be maxed out. Initial stats are 25 int/25 dex for wiz, 25 wis/25 dex for cleric. We won't be attacking, so dex is the only other useful stat. Actually, it may be better to have 2 clerics, 2 wiz, there are some tradeoffs.
-Beat on the runt enemies with repel and undead. One person gets all the kills, preferably the cleric. Get enough xp to get to level 3, and max out gold drops.
-Buy keys with the money you get.
-Get Pray, though not all party members may make it past the lava. Get the silver horn too.
-Acquire a ship. Hopefully pirates can be beaten with the wizard's magic, especially if a small battle is manipulated.
-Go to Death Gulch and load up on money. Manipulate luck to avoid getting caught. It might be a good idea to get mark of fire before this so you don't have to worry about healing everyone. On the other hand, maybe you can afford to let everyone but the cleric die. Whatever, just get all the money you need here.
-Ambrosia:
-Shrine of Wisdom is easy to reach, so power up the Cleric first. You can then revive any dead party members.
-Next hit shrine of intelligence and finish powering up. Suddenly the party is extremely powerful.
-Pray at all the shrines to get the cards, then leave Ambrosia.
-Get anything else needed from dungeons. This needs to be determined. If the mystic armor and weapon aren't strictly required, then forget about the pick. I doubt you need to talk to the time lord. Marks of snake and force will be needed I believe. Dungeons will be fast, descending and ascending with magic.
-You now have everything you need to beat the game. Enemies can be avoided or easily defeated with badass magic, even the mighty floors. Use the cards, beat exodus, and go on the quest of the avatar :).
Ambassador, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(698)
Joined: 7/17/2004
Posts: 985
Location: The FLOATING CASTLE
Watched your run, it looks like you've done about the best you can. I know I've played through this game, but I barely remember it, I don't think it was anything real amazing. This beginning part looks kinda lame, but it should get better. I'm definitely interested to see if you can stick this out, so good luck!
Ambassador, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(698)
Joined: 7/17/2004
Posts: 985
Location: The FLOATING CASTLE
I had an idea about getting money, it involves that strange cat which you get some money out of after beating Gahz. How much could you abuse him? With a jet pack, could you position yourself so that your shots hit him immediately and you immediately grab the money he drops? This would get loads of money real fast, fairly early on, which would hopefully solve money problems for the rest of the game.
Ambassador, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(698)
Joined: 7/17/2004
Posts: 985
Location: The FLOATING CASTLE
First off, I totally wouldn't object to putting a star on BoltR's run. All the Ninja Gaiden videos are very impressive, these games feature so much fast action which we run through very quickly. It's really what this site is all about. Obviously the original is a classic, but I think the second and third in the series have more interesting elements for a timeattack. Most of the NG1 timeattack is just running through, jump slashing when in trouble, and then almost every boss is killed in one shot. Yes, I'm oversimplifying a bit, but compare it to other games in the series: in particular, the NG2 run which FunkDoc is now improving features many more bugs, uses a much greater variety of moves, and the game just has more factors that make the run interesting, like the wind, water, darkness, ice, etc. NG3 features some of these and the use of the ninja magic really stands out, since I don't have jump slash or shadow doubles. I found a few little bugs, but nothing was as mindblowing as that wall-passing trick in 2. Still, I think it makes a more interesting show than the original.
So whatever happens is fine, but I really do think that one of the NGs should get a star. It might be a good idea to wait until we have the full trilogy ready. NG2 would probably be my pick, Josh has really done an amazing job.
Ambassador, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(698)
Joined: 7/17/2004
Posts: 985
Location: The FLOATING CASTLE
You're welcome :)
I guess this was a no-brainer in NG3, when playing normally you would climb the wall and do a forward jump off so you wouldn't have to do a back/forward thing. Since you can't just climb all the walls in NG2, the presence of this move is less obvious. When timeattacking, I was usually looking to move horizontally when I got to the top, so a forward jump-off at the top was the best way to end the climb. There was at least one occasion in a vertical area where I did an back/forwards jump to land just on top of a wall so I could jump again right away.
Yes, I also admire your dedication, there is spot where I know I can cut a frame on my NG3 run but at this time I don't have the desire to do everything over for that one frame.
