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Zoizite wrote:
Play a little, then see who's got the fastest time to a certain point. Send the movie file over AIM or IRC or whatever. The other person sees if they can improve it. If not, keep it, and rinse/repeat.
Yes, that is what I was thinking. Should work well.
Truncated wrote:
I like the idea also - so who's up for a game which only requires two buttons at the same time? Unless it's for SNES, then I can togglify.
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Not really sure where to post this, but I was wondering if anyone would like to team up to time attack a game. I'm asking because it can get boring after a while working on a game. I don't have any particular game in mind but hopefully not a long one.
I think this would be more motivating, fun, and produce a faster run. Anyone interested?
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dcoetzee wrote:
1. When you dig up the flute, place the magic mirror portal such that you will be transported back to the Dark World *before* you are frozen by the Flute Boy's disappearance. (it can be done)
That is slower than what I did because it requires you to warp to the dark world and back, each way taking over 2 seconds, and you have to switch items to the mirror and then back to the flute, each time taking a second. I was aware of this method and I tried both ways, it was slower by a significant amount.
dcoetzee wrote:
2. Go up to the town square in the Dark World. Use the magic mirror, free the bird, then return and enter Blind's lair. This is considerably faster than going up to the portal in the Lost Woods.
You cannot do this because to walk up to the town in the dark world requires the titan's mitt which you don't have yet.
About the randomness, yes this time attack depends on manipulating randomness on many occasions. Almost all rooms with monster randomness were chosen as to get ideal behavior, and in addition almost all rupee/item drops were affected as well. I hadn't noticed it didn't get the manipulates randomness flag, but whatever.
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It takes no time to waste a bomb, and having the firerod allowed me to flick that switch later on faster, which saved about half a second. But then later the lack of bombs caused me to pick up a stone with a bomb under it costing about 1/4-1/3 a second so it really didn't save much. When I did it I thought it would save more.
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I was bored and interested how long it would take if you want to actually kill Ganon but with exploration glitches, so I made a trial run. Really far from perfect most of it is just me playing, almost all those rerecords are from the final fight with ganon, which is also far from perfect. Route really hard to figure out because stuff can be done in any order and its not intuitive at all. Although I had a plan when I started it, there were many things that just wouldn't work, exploration glitches are weird, so I had to improvise and sacrifice time. Anyways total time was 44 minutes, but that could be cut down to 35 easily in a time attack.
Lemme know if this is interesting enough to time attack.
http://wam.umd.edu/~darreon/zelda/bug1.smv
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That was cool, but I've never played the game so I couldn't really tell what was going on, could you explain it a little more?
Here's what my guess would be, you use some glitch that makes that fence of spikes take you through the roof to some boss (how's that work?). Then you abuse randomness to get something really good and unlikely from a card? And then same again for second form?
BTW it was funny watching the level up over and over wondering when it was going to stop. This game looks good from what I could tell.
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With being able to use this from stairs it turns out that there is even faster way to victory. When you enter hyrule castle, main room, go up instead of left, use the stairs in the throne room, go left a little so you don't hop into sewers. From here it is straight up to ganon, it works and should be about 10 seconds faster because there are 2 less screen transitions and less walking.
So I guess meh vote wasn't too bad because now you can do alot better, but it was nice looked very optimized and fast except that.
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Using the bombs was faster than flat out hammer, 1 bomb = 4 hammer hits. I hit with 2 bombs and the cost was virtually only switching items twice (2 seconds). While to hit 8 times with the hammer would take at least 3 seconds. As for arrows to finish him, 1 hammer hit = 2 arrows. Using arrows probably wouldn't be faster because the time to switch to arrows (1 second + 8 * 17 frames = about 3 seconds, while the 4 hammer hits took like 2-3 seconds?? I was running low on arrows too... I'll admit this fight might be able to be slightly improved, but not by much.
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At first I was excited to see that there were so many post for this topic, but....
Anyways, I think a 'time attack' of this game would be extremely interesting. The 7 bases with drone harassment is a good idea and be cool to watch, but there are other options.
The biggest problem with making of a vid of this game would be deciding what exactly to make the video of? The last level would be interesting, or one of those built in use map settings maps (under scenario or something).
The next problem is that although the game supports recording and saving/resuming(rerecording). It has to be battle.net online game? Well this can be hacked so that its not the case. Also it could be hacked to run at extremely slow speeds as well.
Beating some scenario extremely fast would be really cool, the perfect mix of strategy/planning and extreme micro management to pull off impossible battles. I haven't thought much about it yet, but I will be.
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All that info is correct. I don't know for sure about dashing a diagonal either, except that it is indeed fast :)
While holding a pot wobble = same as regular wobble.
While holding sword out wobble = same as regular wobble.
Some slow terrains (water, grass?) wobble = same as regular wobble.
Although sword out + in shallow water + wobble = slow.
Most of the time I didn't really calculate which method for a situation is faster, I just try both ways if its close.
If you are interested there might be a way to wobble in a non up + left direction if you have to walk a slight diagonal. I couldn't get this to work but more experimenting should be done. Walk diagonal one frame then right 1 frame repeat.
Omni wrote:
Don't worry, I'm not going to slavishly follow your path. ^.^ Unless, of course, if happens to be the fastest one (Doubtful, but possible).
Ut oh, I guess I'll be seeing my path then kekeke. Well I guess there's always a chance I missed something.
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Yeah, I am not sure but Ganon might be able to be defeated just as fast with the tempered sword. The first phase takes 6 hits and 7 hits for second from the gold sword. I assume it is just double with the tempered sword. It was asked wether you need to hit with spin attacks with tempered, and the answer is no. So thats probably still possible to do in 1 round. In turtle rock though its not just the boss, those orange guys of 4 balls... You have to kill 4 of them and they are pretty easy with gold sword, but I know its harder with regular.
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I feel kinda bad for making this run while Omni was already working on it. But I had to do it because this is my best game. I hope Omni keeps working on run. It will be nice to see how different routes/methods work out. I only hope his run isn't very influenced by my run because this way he is more likely to find out new cool stuff and then the best of both runs can be comined forming a super run. Although I don't want to be the one to combine, it took so long to do in the first place :) :)
Feel free to take the wobble though, there's no reason not to except consistancy/pain.
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You have to rescue the smithy's partner as one of the conditions to enable super bomb for sale. So it is clearly faster to get the tempered sword which only cost a small amount of time in addition to this and pays itself off in nearly any single boss fight.
The only thing I would question swordwise is wether or not to get the gold sword, you are already there to get silver arrows, and it doesn't take much more time to get. But it really only helps in the 7th crystal dungeon and the final fight with Ganon. It probably does save time to get the gold sword, but if it doesn't if would save almost nothing. I will look into this more...
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Hey Omni, thanks. But believe me sometimes I wish I hadn't discovered that wobble, you know how many times I had to press the damn buttons! There was no turbo option for directions like regular keys grrr.
I got kinda lucky discovering it anways I was just starting and thought it would be cool to wobble while I walk to make it look cooler, but noticed it also sped me up.
Can you get on irc, so we can talk about mistakes and stuff please?
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He has 4 phases (spear throw, fire bat throw, jump/platform disappear, dark/blue), once you hit him enough for him to go into the next phase it doesn't help to hit him more, you have to just wait it out.
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Kyrsimys wrote:
sometimes you walked diagonally up+left even though you just said it's not profitable.
It's not profitable, but its not costly either, same exact speed (2 pixels in a favorable direction per frame), I use which I think will be easiest in the situation.
'In Turtle Rock you sometimes used the cane to cross gaps, other times you levitated across them.'
The cane travels the same speed as levitation (1 pixel per frame) if you wabble or diagonal it. But the cane is slightly faster because the getting on and off. But the reason I didn't use it in all parts was because it takes time to switch to it. And sometimes the cane's path isn't very good.
'After you flew to the swamp using the bird, did you first grab and throw the wrong stone and then the right one?'
Yeah, after you use the bird you are blinking (invincible and you can't teleport while you are invincible) so I had time to kill.
I'm happy you all are liking it!
