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Zowayix wrote:
Sorry if this is a dumb question: Why is it necessary to wall jump up the elevator shaft then fall back down to BLJ? Is it possible to begin BLJing without first getting to the top of the elevator?
it's not neccesary, it's just that you have to wait for the elevator to be on a certain height anyway so I just wallkick up the elevator since I can.
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I just found the 2 frames that I think snark saved. One was while in the PU, and the other one was during the pausing to change camera. I didn't know you could press right and start at the same time lol.
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And finally BitFS was improved with new strat :D
Link to video
Mupen64 sub 5 confirmed, now hopefully we can get moat skip fast enough for sub 5 console.
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jlun2 wrote:
2. Given that this is a new void route, how did you figure out where to go?
Since I haven't completed the info yet I'll answer this directly and then hopefully if I have time add a bit more info in the description.
First of all the void doesn't change at all, eventhough I'm entering from another house. The void is always the same. It only slightly changes if you have previously saved but I didn't.
Now, the way I improved it: there's an horizontal set of tiles that let you get to the first hall of fame trigger. Can't remember the length of it, but the old route was entering from the left of it, while my new route enters from the right, being faster. I guess old route happened because people didn't find a way to enter from the right cause there's a lot of walls close to that.
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jlun2 wrote:
1. Loved your attempt to turn to the music at the last part of the void. lol
2. Given that this is a new void route, how did you figure out where to go?
3. I know the void in platinum has walls that block you, but at the south section of any void I've been there, there's a small part that seemingly changes a bit. Is that manipulate-able as well? If not, then hey, at least anyone wanting a relatively glitchless route can try TASing that game. :P
Yes vote.
2. Will try to explain it soon in the submission, I still have to improve it a bit hehe. I'll post again when I do.
3. It changes a bit if you previously save, and yeah that can make you walk through the void a bit, but iirc that's just because the map is 32x32 blocks, so I think you wouldnt be able to go down more than 31 steps in the void. Anyway I haven't tested platinum a lot but I'm pretty sure you wouldn't be able to do much there.
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I will try to complete / improve the submission description later, but for now I think it explains more or less the stuff that is needed to understand the run.
Also, about the void glitch, I know I'll get complains about it being boring, not being entertaining. I know this would happen but unfortunately it's part of the run. Just in case anybody wonders why I didn't use Poketch to make it more entertaining, this was discussed in this game's thread, and the only possibility to make that section more entertaining would be getting a drawing app located in jubilife city. That would cost me 30 seconds, and the app doesn't allow me to draw really fast:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P5sZIPOgKNk
So, I asked what were people thoughts of this, and in the end we all decided that it wasn't worth getting it.
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Zowayix wrote:
Just saw the Youtube video you uploaded about performing the Vs Seeker skip non-TAS. How's the TAS submission going?
So I found some improvements lately on the tweaking part of the run, including the void glitch.
I found a fastest method to enter in the void, which is by tweaking in Oreburgh Town. This is probably the fastest possible method, as it's impossible to do it in Eterna City.
I found a timesave in the void, improving the optimal route to the hall of fame by 69 steps.
In total I saved around 20 seconds over my previous file. Now I'll try to start working on the video and then on the submission, I wanna try to explain everything the best I can.
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Zowayix wrote:
If you're at the part where you've entered the void and everything from there on is more or less identical to the real time run, then could we expect a final run soon? =3
I finished the run already. I just need to find time now to complete submission and encoding the video. ive prepared a layout already similar to my pokemon firered tas video.
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ALAKTORN wrote:
mkdasher wrote:
I'll try to release the script in the future. It works but it's a bit unstable at the moment. I want to fix it before I release it.
But how does it determine which lines are red?
Maps are made of 32x32 blocks, and loading lines are just in the middle of them, so for example you would find a loading line next to X = 16, Y = 16.
So I just search the X / Y Position on memory and then I draw a grid, making red lines where the loadlines are.
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ALAKTORN wrote:
How does that even work?
This is pretty much what the lua does.
I'll try to release the script in the future. It works but it's a bit unstable at the moment. I want to fix it before I release it.
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grassini wrote:
where do i find all the setups and routes for the gen4 tweaks?i want to do them on my own in the DS,but i haven't found info like"tweak here,in the void walk north 100 steps" blabla
For the void I haven't explored anything but Hall of Fame, so I can't really tell. For this one, I used as a reference a video that is on this thread like 2-3 pages ago, where Hall of Fame route is explained.
For overworld tweaks, I haven't searched for any documentation, as I have enough knowledge myself (probably the most right now?). I have made a lua script that maps the loadlines in the game so I can easily tweak in every spot I can, which is why finding the mart tweak wasn't even hard.
Now I'm worrying about entertainment for void part. I know I asked for suggestions a while ago, but now I need them again. I have a 3 possibilities and I like none of them:
- Making no entertainment at all: to be honest it's the one I prefer most, as I don't like the other 2. Would be just going across the void for a few minutes at the end. If the viewer gets bored he can just skip that part, lol.
- Using calculator, step counter as entertainment: don't really know what I could do with the step counter other than resetting it lol. With the calculator I can just make fast calcs and making a few Pokemon noises. Not sure if worth it, and it would be annoying to do that for over 3 minutes in my opinion.
- Buying draw app: wastes more than 20 seconds. As a speedrunner I don't like the idea of entertainment trade-offs, specially knowing that my ingame time would be 1 minute slower if I did that. However it sounded like a good idea for me since I thought I could do a lot of things with that.
Unfortunatelly, it's really slow to draw with that app. This is a test I made:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P5sZIPOgKNk
It's quite slow that I don't like the idea anymore, but I guess if people still want it I could still make stuff like this during the void.
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GoddessMaria15 wrote:
Great work, mkdasher! Do they go the same route/direction or do they differ in some way?
Exactly the same route, which seems optimized.
I noticed the void changes completely if you previosly save in the overworld somewhere, but unfortunately I havent found any way to get a faster route with it.
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Found a 2 second save for the tweak set up.
Link to video
I've been testing and it looks like the movement will be equivalent on the void, so doing this new setup is faster.
jlun2 wrote:
1. Not needing to walk 5 minutes would be nice lol.
2. The ability to get to the void in a sooner building..
Unfortunately I can't do this.
1. Looks like I'm forced to walk that amount, I need to get to that trigger in the 2nd save, which is far away from initial position, and it seems like no matter what building you enter, it will take the same to get there.
2. It's not possible to get into a sooner building. Unlike void area, I have a full understanding of how tweaking works, and I'm safe to say it's not possible to get a useful tweak in Eterna or Oreburgh City to get into a building there. I'll explain this more with details in the submission, if I manage to finish this run now.
[/quote].
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Zowayix wrote:
What's the progress on this like so far?
Its pretty much done, however I do not want to submit a run until I have understood how void glitch works. Im currently adapting the fastest known route, which is probably the fastest possible. However, its possible to do the void glitch by entering in some other different buildings and I dont think those have been tested a lot.
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Zowayix wrote:
Do you know of any actual ones then? If not then I'll fall back to being able to enable Mystery Gift before the first badge in DPP.
Snorlax bypass in heartgold maybe? Anyway theres a biking tweak variant that works exactly the same way as running tweak, which is doing the same pattern with it than when you run. This method also creates a void but doesnt change the solidity of the map so its completely equivalente to the running tweak. So im guessing theres no such a thing as running only tweak.
By the way swimming tweak is equivalent to running tweak as well.
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Fortranm wrote:
http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Tweaking
This page says "an example of a shortcut using this method is being able to complete the Azalea Gym and therefore use HM01 (Cut) to proceed through Ilex Forest without having defeated Rocket Executive Proton in Slowpoke Well," but I haven't found a video of it.
This information is wrong though.
It is true there is a tweak to complete Azalea Gym before Slowpoke Well (which is the video jlun linked after this message). However, you still need to complete Slowpoke Well to trigger Rival 2 fight and Farfetch event inside Ilex Forest (only after that, you get the HM01). Which means this tweak only woud skip Slowpoke Well if you got a Pokemon with cut via trading.
I did some speedrun attempts and improve a few of the tweaking setups, so I thought I'd list some here:
(Running tweak being faster than biking tweak)
Link to video
(Fastest Slowpoke Well entry)
Link to video
(Route 29 tweak. Disables a bush and saves a few seconds)
Link to video
(Viridian tweak, comparison)
Link to video
(Goldenrod tweak, comparison)
Link to video
I'll try to release the script in the future. It works but it's a bit unstable at the moment. I want to fix it before I release it.