He's saying that the games from the last 5 years use earlier concepts, not that the games use concepts from the last 5 years. For the record, there was a Lolo (I think; or at least it was something very similar) game for NES whose point was to reunite two characters by guiding both of them at once through asymmetrical labyrinth in every level.
I don't really believe that a sum of biased entities will give you an unbiased one as a result, at least certainly not on this scale. In fact, you might be able to use the gathered "unbiased" statistics to argue which of the two Stallone movies is better (which would be rather pointless, if not plain stupid; then again, you could say Cliffhanger was awful without gathering any statistics in order to make a point), but if you want people to say which of them they were more entertained by, you don't need any unbiased factors, nor will they help improving the statistics much. More so, for those people who don't really care about RCR and its runs, having either run on the site will be more ok with them than for people who care not having one they like more. I'm not saying we should purposefully cater to fans, but we could at least not ignore the possibility to publish a more potentially entertaining movie at hand.
I think you misunderstand. The point is not that the run was unentertaining or in and of itself without merit. Simply that without clearly defined objectives, it would be quite impossible to produce a 'better' run which would obsolete this one, should it be published.
First of all, it really amuses me when people start basing their arguments off something that hasn't been created yet, and with a certain possibility won't be at all, at least in the foreseeable future. Why did you let other entertainment-oriented movies such as MK2 (in its nth iteration already) slip then? They don't have "clear" goals except "complete the game" as well. In fact, MK2 movies have pretty much exactly same goals as this one here: to be entertaining at the cost of time, and to show off most quirks and maneuvers the game has to offer — at the author's discretion.
Posing the publication of this movie as a problem that compromises the site's goals is taking it way more seriously than you should (especially since entertainment and art is site's primary proposed goals). "This belongs here, and this doesn't" is an opinion, not a fact. If BoltR thinks this will open floodgates to people submitting playaround shit, then I'll welcome them to create something even a half as entertaining and well-made as this movie here — and that's coming from a person who first learned what this game was by watching Sleepz's run.
Also, asking adelikat questions like these:
BoltR wrote:
How many versions of each game do you want on the site? How many versions of 'play around' runs per game do you want?
…is kind of strange since he always was a person who kinda wasn't fond of too large a number of movies per game, and it's even kinda rare that he not only found a game he would be satisfied with having a playaround for, but also participate in making it himself.
Also, if you track the history of RCR runs, you might notice that the current published run, while much faster than the previous, has much lower entertainment rating.
Yeah, all movies by JXQ and adelikat so far has been clearly all goof-arounds and machinima, how long will this nonsense continue?! Come on, guys! What are you doing! Stop this bullshit and start working on actual speedruns, not this unentertaining shit!
It limits who can watch, actually (Kyrsimys being one of the few.) You need to have the game itself, and it's not something you can just download freely onto your computer and be right as rain.
Bzzzt! We don't download ROMs here, just as we don't download games. Stop implying that we do.
The style ever!
I didn't like all the fights, but that was to be expected. What I definitely wasn't expecting was all the stuff between the fights, and for a game like RCR, this is saying a lot. This is definitely the best run for this game so far, even though it doesn't aim for speed at all. 9 in entertainment; you guys rock.
Radiant Silvergun should definitely aim for speed, though, since max score would imply long sequences of milking, which isn't fun at all to watch. I'd go with max chain, max boss break rate, and fastest speed as priority hierarchy for such a run. Boss break isn't going to take long with a nicely upgraded radiant sword.
However, it's worth noting that RSG has one of the slowest moving crafts in history, which doesn't contribute well to entertainment in a TAS.
oh yeah, I've played a couple of the popular single player FPS as well, but I generally play them only once, mostly for the story. Sometimes I don't even bother playing them and just watch a speedrun.
Haha, same here. And I also liked CS in its early days.
Regarding Team Fortress, I had little experience with it, but it's certainly less about raw deathmatch fun and more about good teamwork, so that you are able to use the characters' different abilities to their full potential.
Quake 3 is the only FPS that's been installed on my system since the dawn of time. However, lately I'm leaning closer towards Half-Life series and related games (except CS, which I've always disliked).
For DM, look into Quake Wars. It seems on par with Q3 when it comes to fun value involved.
As for Touhou...though they'd be great TAS's, I have no idea how you'd implement input recording/playback and all that good stuff into a Windows game.
In fact, there is both a way to slow it down to frame-by-frame advance and a way to take/load a snapshot of the entire memory space occupied by the game, possible to script the actions and read the memory values, and provided the recording engine is built into the games themselves, it IS possible to create a full-fledged TAS of them — but the amount of effort needed to do it certainly isn't going to be worth it. As such, there won't be any real TASing for them in the foreseeable future, although I'd die to see perfect bullet stream grazing in stages like this.
georgexi wrote:
What are some of you guys favorite arcade shmups?
Well, I assume not everything counted as "favorite" would make a TAS entertaining to someone other than a fan of the game, or at least the genre… In fact most games likely wouldn't due to their well-known inherent features. It must allow:
1) to clearly differentiate between realtime and tool-assisted play (meaning it should have risk/reward-oriented score scaling, and inherent impossibility of a "perfect" result),
2) to show something relevant for this game in particular (as in, the TAS should probably obliterate the unassisted high score standards instead of being just a playaround or an as fast as possible run).
I've been thinking of that recently, and I'm looking out for the games that would fit well. Out of the titles I've played personally, DoDonPachi and GigaWing are well-emulated and have good entertainment potential (there already are some sub-par TASes available for them actually, which you might want to check), several SDA residents I've asked also name Raiden Fighters Jet (I guess I need to consult with Twiddle on this matter) and some of the other titles developed by Cave (Dangun Feveron, Progear, etc.). The exact goals for each of them are yet to be discussed, and probably belong to a separate topic.
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO, shmups.com has gotten to you moozooh.
Haha. :D
I'm not saying euroshmups are anything bad, though, they are often very fun to play casually. But in truth, I'd just rather see something like Psyvariar or DDP or anything Touhou been TASed, just because there is so much more detail to the actual gameplay process than in a game like UN Squadron; as in: getting 100% kills and not getting hit is something not really impossible for a human to achieve, while perfect chaining, powergrazing in ridiculous spots and weaving through really thick bullet patterns usually is.
So including the skipped battles would be too arbitrary. Who would decided at what level and with what items he would be allowed to fight the bosses (even for demo purposes)?
It doesn't matter since it's, right as you say, for demo purposes. He just needs to have just what is enough to demonstrate the new strategy (which is probably how it's going to be in skip-less run).
Either way, I'm fine with this decision, since I'm somewhat more interested in seeing the improved battles as well, rather than seeing them skipped.
Hmm, what if you make a submittable run using the skip and include the demos of everything you have skipped with it in the submission message? It seems that way you'll kill both birds with one stone: the run will be as fast as possible and all the new battle strategies will be easily accessible to everyone willing to watch them.
That's understandable, but I'm still having trouble figuring out how a damage taking run can exist when one hit kills the hero (assuming, of course, that the damage taking run is played on the same difficulty setting as AnS's movie.)
Right, in this case it's impossible, since any instance of damage taking will result in a OHKO death. A run should be done on lower difficulty in order to be able to take damage and not die.
Excellent run, very polished, and as usual, very enjoyable stylistic choices. I think no-damage restriction is alright for this game, I also played it on the pirate cartridge, since pretty much all cartridges were pirated in Russia (there never were any official NES sales here — stupid Nintendo lost a lot of potential income thanks to that).
mmbossman wrote:
However, how can you call this a no damage run when you die at least twice to do the warping to the bosses? I always figured that if a character died, they must have taken damage somewhere.
OHKO deaths like those by crushing or falling into endless pits usually don't count in cases with no-damage runs, because the nullify the life gauge rather than decrementing it.
As much as I love shooters, euroshmups aren't really my cup of tea. Nevertheless, this was an entertaining enough watch; I liked the ammo management (too bad you always had more money than you could spent, haha) and the antics the craft's small hitbox allowed you to perform in the later stages, so I'm giving it a mild yes vote.
