Essentials

  • Emulator used: FCEU 0.98.16
  • Genre: Platform
  • Aims for fastest time
    • Takes damage to save time
  • updated: moozooh's suggested screenshot (the greatest screenshot in the history of the world)

Version Change

Note: This run uses the (U) version of Bionic Commando. The previous movie by Genisto used the (J) version.
The initial reason was to include the hilariously bad dialogue. It has been said that the (J) version is the "harder" version, but we have found that to be not entirely true. There are quite a few differences, some which made the (U) version faster, and some which made the (J) version faster.
Regarding a ROM version change, the Rules page states the following:
If there is already a published video, do not use a different ROM than what it uses, unless the new movie is obviously better for reasons that are not only caused by the version change, or the ROM is superior (or a language change), and you can show how it should be compared to the existing movie.
Since the previous run was done with the (J) version, a direct comparison of end times is not an informative enough way to measure the differences in play. So, we've separated the differences into four categories and totaled them up.
In-level difference - Gained 1463 frames
This is the (mostly) directly comparable improvement gained during each level. Time was gained from better technique for many sections, especially the bosses, as well as retracting more with the grappling hook, which moves the guy a bit faster at the exchange of slightly less distance and less landing control. Time was also gained by keeping the 3-way gun for Area 7 instead of restarting the level.
Some of the in-level difference was due to in-level changes between the two versions, such as different enemy or platform placement. A rough estimation of this difference is between 60 and 90 frames.
Text speed difference - Lost 3185 frames
The text boxes scroll slower and hold more words in this version.
Scene change difference - Gained 110 frames
Minor differences in the number of frames between two controllable scenes, such as the title screen and room transitions. This was usually faster in the (U) version.
Map route difference - Gained 1741 frames
Slower text changes the relative position of the trucks during a given route on the world map, because the helicopter does not begin traveling to another area until the text "Ok. We'll move." is fully displayed, but the trucks begin moving immediately after selecting "Transfer". This allowed for better route on the world map, with more direct routes to some areas, as well as playing one less overhead stage. (This same route in the (J) version will enter six overhead stages.)
Total difference - Gained 129 frames
If you'd like to see a complete spreadsheet of this data broken down for each segment, please ask.

Cardboard's comments

I HAVE PAID MY DUES

JXQ's comments

The Bionic Commando (J) run on this site has been one of my favorites ever since I've been here. It sometimes felt odd obsoleting it.
This game is remarkably stable to hex-edit in early improvements found into a run that is farther along. This game is remarkably unstable with FCEU while rerecording in a laggy area, such as 6, 9, 10, or 11.
Thanks to Cardboard for being my partner, and to Genisto for his previous run.

Truncated: This movie has a better route and much better playing in the levels than the previous movie.
In response to all the arguments about the version switch: I dislike version switches. If it was up to me, the rules would state that all movies be played on (U) versions, unless it didn't exist or (E) or (J) included a glitch or shortcut or game element not in the (U) version. That way we wouldn't have any of this nonsense, or people switching ROMs just because the intro or dialogue is shorter, which has no bearing on the quality of play.
Also because i dislike version switches, I'm glad that this movie has now changed back to the "real" version, which the first published movie was made with, before it changed to the (J) version for no good reason at all.
Bisqwit: I don't think we have reached a concensus about whether this should obsolete the J version or not. I'm putting it on delayed. And, I disagree with the assessment of "no good reason at all"; in my opinion, Feitclub's reasoning re: J version was good.
BoltR: Since there is no rush to make a decision about this movie, and it's just causing an argument; I am setting the status to Needs More Info. We can wait until the updated (J) version is complete and pick up the debate from there. Blame version changing.
Bisqwit: Setting back on accepted, and to obsolete the current J version. However, the question what happens when the next J version is submitted, is still open. Some say only U versions should be accepted from here on, and some say any faster version regardless of version should be accepted. There may be someone who also thinks the next J version should be published alongside, but it doesn't seem to be a likely option. Such decision however does not need to be made until such movie exists and is submitted. However, if this movie is still in the workbench at that time, it will be delayed because then also its fate is in question. (We don't publish movies that already have their obsoleter in the workbench.)
Bisqwit: Processing.


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TASVideoAgent
They/Them
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This topic is for the purpose of discussing #1513: Cardboard & JXQ's NES Bionic Commando in 14:03.38
Editor, Active player (297)
Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 7469
Location: Arzareth
I think, "to include hilariously bad dialogue" is not a good reason enough to switch the version. And, if the screenshot you included in the submission is a sample of that "hilariously bad" dialogue, I disagree on that assessment on the kind of that dialogue.
JXQ
Experienced player (761)
Joined: 5/6/2005
Posts: 3132
Well the Rules do say "or the ROM is superior (or a language change)". There are several other places with oddly translated dialogue as well that is pretty humorous. Edit: Example of a version/language change that was accepted.
<Swordless> Go hug a tree, you vegetarian (I bet you really are one)
KennyMan666
He/Him
Joined: 8/24/2005
Posts: 375
Location: Göteboj
Let me cast the first Yes vote! Great movie, this game really does lend itself well to TASing.
Det man inte har i begåvning får man ta ut i energi. "I think I need to get to Snoop Dogg's level of high to be able to research this post." -Samsara Read my fanfic, One Piece: Pure Corruption
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Bisqwit wrote:
And, if the screenshot you included in the submission is a sample of that "hilariously bad" dialogue …
I have a much better (worse?) example (frame 47622): *runs away* *returns to cast a yes vote, runs away again*
Warp wrote:
Edit: I think I understand now: It's my avatar, isn't it? It makes me look angry.
Banned User
Joined: 12/23/2004
Posts: 1850
Thank you for making me fall over laughing. Honestly, that's the best screenshot ever.
Perma-banned
Former player
Joined: 4/16/2004
Posts: 1286
Location: Finland
I have to agree, pure awesome moozooh. I'm glad the version was changed to the one that most people are familiar with. Watching later.
Skilled player (1605)
Joined: 6/11/2006
Posts: 818
Location: Arboga, Sweden
moozooh wrote:
Consider it done <Cardboard> So it's faster, understandable, AND the input file has a good rom checksum. <Cardboard> I think I'm gonna post and ask why Bisqwit finds that to be a bad choice. Posting that ^
Warp wrote:
omg lol this is so fake!!!1 the nes cant produce music like this!
Shingen
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Joined: 11/23/2004
Posts: 68
Location: Urf
My opinion of what the screenshot should be: "What, you're going to fight against me? You damn fool."
Skilled player (1410)
Joined: 5/31/2004
Posts: 1821
Wow, never expected this run to be done already. Voting yes, game is perfect for a TAS.
Player (89)
Joined: 11/14/2005
Posts: 1058
Location: United States
pretty sweet run, vote = yes. Wasn't there more nazi propaganda in the J version? Either way, it is better to use the English version, mainly for the hilarious dilaogue. I especially love the 4 animated frames of hitler's head exploding, priceless.
They're off to find the hero of the day...
Player (150)
Joined: 11/27/2004
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hero of the day wrote:
I especially love the 4 animated frames of hitler's head exploding, priceless.
I have no idea how they got that past the NoA's censorship.
Nach wrote:
I also used to wake up every morning, open my curtains, and see the twin towers. And then one day, wasn't able to anymore, I'll never forget that.
Player (224)
Joined: 10/17/2005
Posts: 399
Oh gosh. I truly love this. Cardboard, your awesomeness is raising all the time.
<adelikat> I've been quoted with worse
Active player (437)
Joined: 4/21/2004
Posts: 3517
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
*High-fives Cardboard and JXQ* Super run. Enjoyed it a lot. The use of the grappling weapon was really fun to watch :) Voting yes.
Nitrogenesis wrote:
Guys I come from the DidyKnogRacist communite, and you are all wrong, tihs is the run of the mileniun and everyone who says otherwise dosnt know any bater! I found this run vary ease to masturbate too!!!! Don't fuck with me, I know this game so that mean I'm always right!StupedfackincommunityTASVideoz!!!!!!
Arc wrote:
I enjoyed this movie in which hands firmly gripping a shaft lead to balls deep in multiple holes.
natt wrote:
I don't want to get involved in this discussion, but as a point of fact C# is literally the first goddamn thing on that fucking page you linked did you even fucking read it
Cooljay wrote:
Mayor Haggar and Cody are such nice people for the community. Metro City's hospitals reached an all time new record of incoming patients due to their great efforts :P
Joined: 5/22/2006
Posts: 58
Location: Denver, CO USA
awesome movie, definite yes vote
What would Mr Belvedere do? Probably eat some butter.
Active player (411)
Joined: 3/16/2004
Posts: 2623
Location: America, Québec
Tas authors wrote:
It has been said that the (J) version is the "harder" version, but we have found that to be not entirely true.
I remember watching the old Bionic Commando then Feitclub had submitted Hitler No Fukkatsu and differences were noticeable. J version is harder. So please explain why it's not true. Btw, changing version just because of "hilariously bad dialogue" is not an excellent reason.
Joined: 10/3/2005
Posts: 1332
Genisto's HnF run was one of my favorites. It's nice to see it moving a little faster and digging into the boundaries... not to mention the aiming at the cock. Yes vote.
adelikat
He/Him
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The discouraging of J & U rom changing was probably a good idea back in the pre-advance days. Perhaps we should update it a bit for "modern" times. I think J and U should be able to obsolete each other freely and be used at the discretion of the author provided that a) There is an actual improvement beyond the rom differences b) care is taken in calculating the exact differences of the rom and changes c) posting clearly in the submission the ACTUAL improvement. So I vote yes on this run, it is very entertaining and a nice 25secondish improvement (factoring out rom differences). If someone were to improve upon this run but use the J rom it should obsolete this one.
It's hard to look this good. My TAS projects
Skilled player (1605)
Joined: 6/11/2006
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Location: Arboga, Sweden
Phil wrote:
I remember watching the old Bionic Commando then Feitclub had submitted Hitler No Fukkatsu and differences were noticeable. J version is harder. So please explain why it's not true.
While it is true that J mostly has more enemies, it is not entirely true that it is "harder". In U, for example, we do not have a moving platform at the end of area 6 to save us from a falling death, we, overall, seem to have less platforms. Also during area 10, only one sludge is spawned at the same time, and towards the end of area 10, there seem to fall lawn mowers - uh, sorry, I forgot that jokes are not allowed here - some kind of rolling enemies (some FAQs reffer to them as MINI TANK), as opposed to J, where there is one enemy just outside the door, on a platform above the player, not doing anything. Here, both JXQ and I, during completely different playthrougs, had to actually stop to kill an enemy to prevent losing more time, unlike J, where all you have to do is run. Area 12 is a good example as well. In U, the sparks when going towards the boss cores appears faster, with a different timespan, and not on the same ledges in both zig zag-rooms as in J, and in the second one, while J contained one big guy just as you entered the room, we got one indestructable Iron Ball in U. More enemies does not necessarily mean that it is a harder game, even un-tool assisted. With DIFFERENT enemies, (Might make it harder in real time) MORE platforms, (Might make it easier in real time) please, instead of just saying "J is harder", explain why that is the case. EDIT: No, the spider in the room with the yellow radio is not a good example.
Warp wrote:
omg lol this is so fake!!!1 the nes cant produce music like this!
Joined: 8/3/2004
Posts: 380
Location: Finland
Coolness. Bionic Commando is always nice to watch for the swinging action present in the movie. :) In any case it's an improvement done in unmatched style so a clear yes.
"Kids! Bringing about Armageddon can be dangerous. Do not attempt it in your home." ( Pratchett & Gaiman: Good Omens )
Joined: 2/1/2007
Posts: 245
Location: Israel
Sure, if you take a line out of context it can be 'hilariously' bad, but when you actually watch the run and see that it's 'aim at the cock-pit blah blah blah', it's suddenly not funny at all. Still voting yes since I enjoyed the run though.
Joined: 4/25/2004
Posts: 498
PI PI PI... WE HAVE FOUND AN AWESOME TAS. WE ARE GOING TO VOTE YES.
jaysmad
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Experienced player (932)
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Funny as hell thanks to that hilarious screenshot but also Hitler's head exploding at the end made my day:D Definite yes vote! It was obviously very well played. Cardboard & JXQ, how could it not be good :) Definite yes. Oh! btw, nice swinging you guys, it looked very well done. Edit: Please leave the screenshot, it is the reason i have watched this movie. Without it, this movie is nothing... Unless you put Hitler's exploding head... An animated screenshot! Now that would be awesome:D
Active player (411)
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I've noticed many people voting yes because of those screenshots...
Skilled player (1605)
Joined: 6/11/2006
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Location: Arboga, Sweden
No Phil. People are not voting yes because of the screenshot. As a matter of fact, the screenshot seem to disappoint at least one user, who writes that "Sure, if you take a line out of context it can be 'hilariously' bad, but when you actually watch the run and see that it's 'aim at the cock-pit blah blah blah', it's suddenly not funny at all. ", but still voted yes, because of, "I enjoyed the run though." Also, let me add, that if a screenshot actually makes people want to watch the run, how is that bad?
Warp wrote:
omg lol this is so fake!!!1 the nes cant produce music like this!
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