It would probably be reasonably cool to see this game TAS'd. Last I checked the DOS version doesn't have fixed AI for enemy dungeon keepers though it does have a patch addressing memory or save game issues (included on my install disc as a separate install). The Windows 95 version with the patch applied (Same patch installer applies changes to both DOS and Windows versions) fixes the AI so that enemy dungeon keepers would properly build rooms etc. and actually posed a moderate threat to an unwary player. (without the patch their prone to building rooms smaller than 3x3 which is pointless)
Perhaps include the many secret levels too?
Joined: 8/14/2009
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Location: The Netherlands
The AI is not something to be worried about, it usually is incompetent enough to do anything anyway.
I think a TAS of this could be pretty interesting.
http://www.youtube.com/Noxxa
<dwangoAC> This is a TAS (...). Not suitable for all audiences. May cause undesirable side-effects. May contain emulator abuse. Emulator may be abusive. This product contains glitches known to the state of California to cause egg defects.
<Masterjun> I'm just a guy arranging bits in a sequence which could potentially amuse other people looking at these bits
<adelikat> In Oregon Trail, I sacrificed my own family to save time. In Star trek, I killed helpless comrades in escape pods to save time. Here, I kill my allies to save time. I think I need help.
Yeah, but it really wouldn't be that impressive beating them when all they do is build rooms that are insufficiently big enough to benefit them in any way because you'll always be able to lure significantly more monsters to your own cause. Only the levels which involve puzzles or humans would be of interest on any version but the patched Windows version.
Joined: 8/14/2009
Posts: 4083
Location: The Netherlands
Against AI keepers, luring more monsters is not needed. All that's needed is a way to quickly get some creature (higher leveled, from the stage if possible) and smash down the enemy Heart with it. There probably wouldn't be much, if any conflicts with enemy creatures.
http://www.youtube.com/Noxxa
<dwangoAC> This is a TAS (...). Not suitable for all audiences. May cause undesirable side-effects. May contain emulator abuse. Emulator may be abusive. This product contains glitches known to the state of California to cause egg defects.
<Masterjun> I'm just a guy arranging bits in a sequence which could potentially amuse other people looking at these bits
<adelikat> In Oregon Trail, I sacrificed my own family to save time. In Star trek, I killed helpless comrades in escape pods to save time. Here, I kill my allies to save time. I think I need help.
Joined: 8/14/2009
Posts: 4083
Location: The Netherlands
That's just one option. It'd depend on whether it would be faster to spend time reaching the Transfer Creature, or just moving on and finding/getting something in the next stage. For example, in stage 6 you can easily get a level 4 Mistress from the start, but to transfer it you'd need to build a dungeon up to getting a bridge - something I'd not be sure whether it's worth it.
Do remember that with possession and TAS dodging skills practically any creature is viable for completing the stage's objectives. Of course, creatures with higher walk speed or killing speed are better for that.
http://www.youtube.com/Noxxa
<dwangoAC> This is a TAS (...). Not suitable for all audiences. May cause undesirable side-effects. May contain emulator abuse. Emulator may be abusive. This product contains glitches known to the state of California to cause egg defects.
<Masterjun> I'm just a guy arranging bits in a sequence which could potentially amuse other people looking at these bits
<adelikat> In Oregon Trail, I sacrificed my own family to save time. In Star trek, I killed helpless comrades in escape pods to save time. Here, I kill my allies to save time. I think I need help.
Oh true I wasn't thinking of it in a TAS sense, you can just possess a creature and walk right in etc.. I would rather an attempt at quickly finding/obtaining all the ? powerups on each level or kill every enemy.
Would help keep it more interesting.
I would love to see a TAS of this game too, I'm just not sure how much faster this would be than a regular speed run since there is a lot of waiting for scripted or timed events. But these things have never stopped a true TASer ;-)
A good deal of information is available in the description of this speed run: http://speeddemosarchive.com/DungeonKeeper.html
The first few missions are based around waiting out timers - for example, in the second mission so many rounds after you build a slab of training room, the Dwarves on the right side of the map spawn. After mission 4 (I think) the only time you really need to wait for before the assault is the Bridge research.
Though in fairness, I haven't personally completed the second leg of the campaign (the ice stages) so I don't know for certain. I keep getting stuck in the "here's your dungeon, survive for twenty waves" one where you get a tiny pre-built dungeon and practically no room to expand.
Though in fairness, I haven't personally completed the second leg of the campaign (the ice stages) so I don't know for certain. I keep getting stuck in the "here's your dungeon, survive for twenty waves" one where you get a tiny pre-built dungeon and practically no room to expand.
The game design is pretty unbalanced against the AI (In your favour) even when the AI is working correctly, there are many ways to manipulate the enemy to make difficult encounters easy however it has been a massively long time since I last played the game that I can't remember them.
I also updated all my previous posts in this topic so they aren't written so poorly (spelling, grammar sentence structure etc). I forget if I originally posted this in the DOS section or if it got moved there, I'd prever to see a patched copy of the Windows version TAS'd than the bugged DOS version.
Joined: 8/14/2009
Posts: 4083
Location: The Netherlands
XkyRauh wrote:
Is this the game where you can possess one of your units and go first-person with it? I recall that making combat ridiculously easy.
Yes, it is.
http://www.youtube.com/Noxxa
<dwangoAC> This is a TAS (...). Not suitable for all audiences. May cause undesirable side-effects. May contain emulator abuse. Emulator may be abusive. This product contains glitches known to the state of California to cause egg defects.
<Masterjun> I'm just a guy arranging bits in a sequence which could potentially amuse other people looking at these bits
<adelikat> In Oregon Trail, I sacrificed my own family to save time. In Star trek, I killed helpless comrades in escape pods to save time. Here, I kill my allies to save time. I think I need help.
