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Xkeeper wrote:
If nobody says anything, try to ignite discussion.
Fair enough. I will reset it to delayed (assuming I can do this). I'll leave it for 1 week. Perhaps someone can change my mind in that time.
Despite recieving four yes votes over a long period of time, instead of attempting to ignite discussion of this, you simply vote no and reject it based on your feelings of this movie, which is of extreme interest considering all feedback on this movie so far (minus desync issues, which have already been answered) has been positive.
I believe to are misjudging about my reasoning:
1) I am a voter too, in which case it is 4 yes, 1 no. So this is not a unanimous decision. In addition, these are some chilly results being only 4 votes. This is certainly not a major point, but I bring it up because you make it sound like a took a popular, well received movie and rejected it.
2) You make it sound as if I came along and saw a movie that I disagree with and quickly rejected it. I assure you that it was not a hasty decision, but came after watching the run several times and thinking about it for awhile. (I first watched this run sometime after it was submitted but never commented).
3) My feeling had little to do with it. As someone already pointed out, fighter games of this type are poorly suited for TASing and as a result, are it is very difficult to make an impressive TAS.
Aside from too SF2 movies they are non-existant on this site. For solid reason. It hard to keep someone entertained by knocking the crap out of a cpu controlled character.
The ones that have managed to be published have met high standard in terms of showing off as many combos as possible and having a lot of "style". I think this movie didn't quite match up to this standard. The same combos were used quite frequently and the fights became predictable.
I think that this movieRejecting a movie like this is in keeping in within the rules and trends of this site.
A few threads that I feel back this opinion up:
http://tasvideos.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=810&highlight=street+fighterhttp://tasvideos.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1826&highlight=street+fighterhttp://tasvideos.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1833&highlight=street+fighter
3) I weighted the opinions that I read into this decision, but I am allowed to disagree with them.
Of the posted opinions I got this: (paraphrased of course)
a) xkeeper: "yes vote <- not informative, no reason as to why
b) xaphan: "these games don't really make good time-attacks, vote yes anyway." and "hard game made easy". Despite a yes vote, this one isn't a very good review in my opinion. He admits that he didn't particularly find such a genre interesting.
Also "hard game made easy" is a common yes vote in submission but a poor argument (sorry Xaphan). These are TASes, it is expected that the game look easy. That is not the point. The point is to take it a step further and show something extraordinary. As a result, I will not weigh a comment like this very heavily when making may descicion.
c) Fresh Feeling: "Fun to watch" <- fair enough, but I need more of these for it to change my opinion. These types of comment generally help when deciding "popular demand" which currently this movie fails in.
d) spocky: "this looked really good and you also brought some variation in your moves (except the first fight)." <- weighted heavily and a pretty informative post. He feels there was enough variation. OK, that helped the runs case, but it was the really the only one. This just wasn't enough to persuade me.
Well, perhaps my opinions will ignite the discussion you are looking for.
Emulator Coder, Published Author, Site Developer, Site Owner, Expert player
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Bisqwit wrote:
I was able to watch this movie (well, part of it anyway) thanks to an AVI recording Dehacked made. (My 3D setup is currently quite broken.)
But I'm not impressed. The maneuvers in this movie look too analog and approximate to me. It is completely lacking the accuracy I'm used to seeing in NES and SNES movies. It's as if it was not tool-assisted at all.
It would be sad if this were the last submission ever for this game, but based on what I saw, I wasn't entertained by the movie. I'm voting "no".
I agree with all of this. Good game choice, but the run needs more refining.
Voting No.
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P.JBoy wrote:
adelikat wrote:
My job as a judge is to follow the rules as closely as possible. If you want an exception to the rules it will require a green light from Bisqwit.
It already has
Rules wrote:
This rule can be bent only by special permission ― you must ask a permission beforehand before going to make a movie of a patched game. Currently these games have special permissions:
* Super Demo World version 1.00
* Super Demo World - The Legend Continues version 1.10
* メトロイドレガシー (Metroid Legacy) last update 2005-05-12
[/quote]
okay, okay
sorry, I got this game confused with Metroid redesign. This one of course could be published in accordance with the rules.
Emulator Coder, Published Author, Site Developer, Site Owner, Expert player
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Good luck. I will hold off "officially" accepting this movie. I will wait for your new one. If your new one is equal or better than this one I will accept it right away.
(when you submit it, go ahead and cancel this one)
I look foward to your new work :)
Emulator Coder, Published Author, Site Developer, Site Owner, Expert player
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moozooh wrote:
Hmm, that actually gave me an idea.
If some hacks eventually get allowed here as an exception, there must be a reason for it, right? I think Bisqwit should add a couple of lines to the rules that would justify the allowed hacks and also give us some space for deciding which of them comply to the defined criteria.
Agreed.
Though I still exercise my right to not judge any of them ;)
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Becuase I agree with the rules of this site.
Rules wrote:
The games must be real
The movie should look like it could have been played with an authentic hardware. This makes it more familiar to the audience.
This details to the following points:
Hacked and homebrew games are not allowed
Generally, we only accept hacks which only make the game playable on an emulator. We do not accept hacked games (gfx hacks, level hacks, music/sound hacks, dialog hacks and so on).
Emulator Coder, Published Author, Site Developer, Site Owner, Expert player
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I am also unqualified to judge this hack:
1) I haven't even played SNES metroid games
2) I am biased against hacks being published on the site (except for bugfixes & possibly translations).
Emulator Coder, Published Author, Site Developer, Site Owner, Expert player
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I found this run to be rather uninteresting. Fighter games like this usually don't make good TASes. The street fighter series is the only one to get onto this site (mostly due to popularity).
This game seems to have a limited amount of moves which made it repetitive. You (obviously) beat each opponent into oblivion which isn't an impressive apsect since it is a TAS (these types of thing are expected). Beyond that it doesn't offer anything particularly interesting. The characters were amusing but that isn't enough to make this game publishable.
Voting No.
Emulator Coder, Published Author, Site Developer, Site Owner, Expert player
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Voting No for the reasons already stated
Due to being a slow paced auto-scroller this game isn't suitable for TASing. In addition the run has a lot of places for improvent. Not getting money & bonuses alone could shave a minute off the in-between level animations.
The spinning was cool in the boss fight with the giant baseball. Everywhere else it got old fast. Use things like that sparingly.
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Are you planning to finish this run, and do you plan to cancel the current submitted run?
I've watched the submitted one, and I highly question the decision to do minigames/secret levels or whatever. This game is a bit too repetitive. Keeping it short is the key.
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Good job. This game is pretty fast paced and interesting to watch. I agree the "plant the bomb" levels are a bit repetitive but not enough to take away from the run.
Yes vote.
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Diman wrote:
I think its really sad that people voting "no"
because the game is bad.
That is a perfectly valid reason for voting no. Like the Guidelines say to pick an interesting game. Not all games will be represented; only the ones that are deemed entertaining. Showing the fastest completion of all video games is NOT the aim of this site.
Two good examples for this is, Phil's NES Donkey Kong in 01:18
and, Ferret Warlord's NES Donkey Kong Jr. in 01:13. They both play their
games fantastic but is their choices of games good? Personally, I watch
their movies cause the gameplay and not for their games.
Just because a game has poor graphics or is very primitive in gameplay doesn't make it a bad game. The Donkey Kong games do offer something interesting in aspects such as luck manipulation. At least there is some interesting strategy involved that makes the TAS unexpected and/or novel. These are the qualities make games publishable.
Popeye doesn't offer these elements. It can't even aim for a fastest completion. It is just a 3 minute playaround of a rather dull game. Playing with death and showing off cool stuff HELP make a TAS better, but they aren't enough to stand alone as the sole value of the run. There needs to be SOMETHING else involved.
Voting No. It seems like you put some effort into this game but I think this game is a lost cause. Unfortunately I don't think anything can be done to showoff something interesting in this game.
I know putting hard work into something only to be rejected must be tough. I am sorry for this. Honestly, I think your insistance of TASing this game is due to your lack of confidence in making a good TAS of a more difficult game. This is unfortunate. You have submitted many TASes to this site and this point, I believe you are capable of attempting more difficult (and interesting) games. Rather than focusing on quantity, focus on quality. This game takes little time to TAS since there is no aiming for fastest time or difficult stunts. This is a lazy reason for picking a game, and it will invetibably show in your work.
Plan on a run taking many months to perfect. Typically, a run that can be made in an hour or two will not look very impressive (unless the game is unusually short, such as Monopoly). Pick a game that challenges you to explore and learn new tricks and pushes your own ablities to the limit. It will be hard work, but you will no doubt be far more proud of what you have accomplished.
Since this run was submitted, I have seen you post wip's in the forum. This is good, and will allow you to get an idea of what games are good choices. Thus, all I have to say is good luck on your future TASes :)
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Truncated wrote:
This seemed to be very well planned and executed. Unfortunately I think the result is still less than not very funny to watch... I didn't find the other levels except for the warehouse very interesting either.
Agreed.
Level 4 is quite boring, but I wasn't really entertained by the previous levels either. It looks like to did your homework on the game and there seems no doubt that the TAS quality is high. However, I personally don't feel like it is a good game choice.
Voting No.
BTW, I really liked how you "grooved" to the music while skating. It showed some serious style ;)
