TASVideos

Posted: 3/13/2010 12:24 AM

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Azorae

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Location: Florida

Captain Forehead wrote:

Well, I really like this WIP and I thought it was an extremely good route. Though I was a bit curious about the Chick-Tac-Toe game, it seems the second time that you hit him, you could've hit him a lot faster. Well, keep up with the TAS!

Like I said, I'm not going for full optimization until I know the route for the full game start to finish. I'm also VERY inexperienced with high-level optimization, so if I do go for a fully optimized run, it will take a lot of time and more than likely a lot of help. Clowney Island's route, along with Paint Misbehavin's, is very straightforward. Once I get to Mine Blowing, I may need to step back and do a bit of planning, and Arabian Flights will be nothing short of a nightmare...

Posted: 3/12/2010 9:27 PM

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Azorae

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Alright, I've decided to come back to this and at least hammer out a route. Previously I was rushing to get a full-game testrun done in a few days, and that resulted in rather low quality play and poor route planning. Since route planning was the main goal of the testrun, I decided to scrap it and start again. This time, I'm going to post an m64 at the end of each level and request input from everyone who can provide it. If you have an idea to improve the route or a trick that may help in the coming sections, please post it. Clowny Island's route has been completed for an in-game time of 0:06, despite less-than-stellar optimization. the m64 can be found at: http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/63825086/ClownyIsland.m64 A few notes about this level: - Doing BeeWare before the Midway saved roughly 12 seconds with text skips. - Hitting the Chick-Tac-Toe chicken causes him to make his move much faster. - It is possible to knock down two cats with each throw. However, I was not able to replicate this and decided to omit it. Again, if you have a comment about the route or know of a trick/route idea for Paint Misbehavin' or any other level, please let me know.

Posted: 11/26/2009 4:44 AM

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Azorae

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Joined: 9/27/2007
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Mitjitsu wrote:

A while ago we did a test run where we got the sword and used ESS to escape Kokiri. Sidehopped to Lake Hylia, got the golden scale and obtained the bottle and headed down Zora's River (after speaking to King Zora). It became dawn when we were halfway down ZR. Because of this I don't see how obtaining the golden scale is worthwhile, after all the distances in Lake Hylia and Zora's river is massive. I think it's best just to get the silver scale. The only question is where bugs will be obtained. Is there any good spots in ZR? If not it will either have to be obtained in the graveyard or in a grotto as AL.

You can get a bug from the rock behind the Skulltula House in Kakariko. It's pretty much right on the way out of town after getting the pocket egg.

Posted: 11/21/2009 6:42 PM

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Azorae

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Joined: 9/27/2007
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Well, the current WIP takes 2:38 worth of stopped time in Kakariko to get the bottle. We need to figure out whether or not we can spend less than that amount of time with time stopped to see whether Ruto's bottle really is faster. Climbing Zora's Domain, talking to the king, and exiting would take about 1:45 most likely, so if getting the silver scale takes less than 53 seconds, it would be faster. Another thing to take into consideration is the extra 20 rupees required to play the diving game. These can probably be found by jumping into the water for a short time while climbing Zora's River, which wouldn't cost game time, but if we need to collect them in Kokiri Forest, that's a huge hit to time. Another option is the gold scale. Time passes at an odd rate while fishing, I believe it's about 1/4 speed, so we would need to enter the fishing pond and exit within about 1:20, which is easily possible. We just need to see which route of all three takes the least in-game time. Another thing to factor in is that it may not be the best option to collect a Deku Stick, since there is only one owl text if Kakariko Village is never entered. It would definately be faster to skip it if time passes while the owl is talking.

Posted: 10/3/2009 4:07 AM

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Azorae

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Very cool. Unfortunately I had already finished Clowny Island in my route-run-thing, but it doesn't affect the route at all. I did, however, try to skip the 200-token-ticket dance by pausing right when I touched the last token, then save-quitting. It resulted in me having all 200 tokens in Clowny Island, but not the ticket. I also like the idea of save-quitting right at the beginning like that. I wouldn't have thought of that.

Posted: 10/2/2009 11:51 PM

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Azorae

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It's great to see this game getting some interest. I had poked around in it a little, having loved it when I was younger, and found a few things including double jumping with a box, with seems to have been shaped into something that can truly be game breaking. Possible uses include skipping painting yourself to fool the guard in Paint Misbehavin' and a few other small breaks that I'll try to find. I have a couple preliminary routes in my head and if I can find a way to get them here I will. Perhaps an m64 of my 100% route with all of the tricks I have found that may save time, though that may take a few days. I think it can make a cool full game run, although it won't have anything amazing that will rope in more than this game's small fanbase, which is unfortunate because I have been looking for a speedrun of this game for years.

Posted: 8/29/2009 4:58 PM
(Edited: 8/29/2009 6:08 PM)

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Azorae

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Wow, thanks for the quick reply Phallosvogel. I'll try that out. EDIT: Synced all the way through with no problems. Everything looks excellent, I was surprised the rupee collection went so smoothly and the Ikana Canyon strategy was a nice surprise. Can't wait for the next WIP should you choose to release more.

Posted: 8/29/2009 4:45 PM

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Azorae

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Can't wait to see the progress. Trying to get it to sync on a non anti-DS version of Mupen, just in case it doesn't, where can I find a link to download anti-DS Mupen? Thanks in advance.

Posted: 6/22/2009 6:22 AM

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Azorae

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Joined: 9/27/2007
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MrGrunz, the GBT run was very cool. Only one minor question: Would it be possible to use two bombchu hovers and then a superflip when crossing the first gap to be able to maintain an ISS after landing, making the travel time to the Out of Bounds spot somewhat shorter? Also I think it's pretty cool that you have basically the entire game TAS'ed now (all the temples and Pirate's Fortress) I'm sure if you take up the game time run you'll do great.

Posted: 6/12/2009 6:49 PM

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Azorae

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Alright, I think I've come to a conclusion. Unless I'm mistaken, it takes 9 extra pauses to duplicate a bottle over an empty C-slot (26 pauses with 2 available slots vs 17 pauses with 3 slots.) Each pause takes about 2.5-3 seconds (depending on what is equipped), meaning an extra 24-25 seconds of pause time. The best time to get the Bremen Mask would be right before duplicating the bottles, which hopefully means it is past 6 PM when we finish Woodfall. If it isn't, that means that we would need to play the SoDT no matter which route we're using. If it is, we don't have to use the SoDT for either, so the time to play the SoDT should not be accounted for in the difference. Keep in mind that if the SoDT is required it is better to play it early, around the same time as you play the Song of Healing for the Zora Mask. This prevents the withdrawl fee at the bank and lets us enter the shop without using bombchus. Therefore, to find out which is faster we: Take the difference in times between going straight from the owl after warping and going to the Curiosity shop to find the total time lost for collecting the Bremen Mask (Owl -> Bremen Mask -> Curiosity Shop) minus (Owl -> Curiosity Shop) I believe the difference to be very close to 25 seconds Take the total time lost by pausing and equipping items 9 extra times. I again believe this to be close to 25 seconds. Whichever route loses the least time is obviously the faster one. The routes are within seconds of each other, which makes this all the more difficult. More accurate numbers and tests can be a definate help.

Posted: 6/7/2009 8:31 PM

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Azorae

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Joined: 9/27/2007
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Since there's no confirmation message like the sale finalization in the curiosity shop when you give the postman/Madame Aroma the letter, you can't pause and switch after selecting it. So no, you can't use duplication to skip the fourth cycle.

Posted: 6/4/2009 6:27 PM

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Azorae

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The Bremen mask takes an extra 35 seconds to get (including SoDT). The only time you can get a Deku Stick without wasting this much time is after Snowhead when you go on the bomb run before STT. So duplicating over the deku stick would be: - An extra Red potion sale for money - A longer Wizrobe 1 fight in SHT - Entering the general store and buying two Deku Sticks after buying bombs and chus for STT. If that combined takes less than 35 seconds, duplicating over the Deku stick is a better choice Also, this is definately important: If we get the Bremen Mask, you need to have 204 rupees in the bank due to the nighttime withdrawl fee. Either that or withdraw 196 at the beginning and collect 4 more rupees somewhere in the route.

Posted: 6/4/2009 2:34 PM

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Azorae

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The thing is, we have exactly 0 extra rupees. After getting the bottle, we need to use Deku Sticks on Wizrobe 1 and the Garo Master, plus th extra for Infinite Deku Stick, so we need to get 30 more rupees.

Posted: 6/3/2009 8:40 PM
(Edited: 6/13/2009 10:09 PM)

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Azorae

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (98)

Joined: 9/27/2007
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First Cycle get 2R in pre-Clock Town area (2/0R) Grandma's Stories to Day 3, Dance with Scarecrow to Night 3, deposit 2R (0/2R) To ECT, do a full run through termina field to WCT (99/2R) Deposit 99R, go to ECT, get Stray Fairy, run through Termina Field to NCT, get 99R, get Magic Meter, deposit 99R (0/200R) Backflip to Clock Tower, get Ocarina and SoT, Play Song of Time Second Cycle Withdraw 200R, Buy Bomb Bag + 20 Chus (20B) (20C) (70R) Exit to West Termina Field, ISG-ISS to Fence, Pull out bomb while Sliding, hover over fence with bomb and chu, Slide to GB (17B) (19C) ISS to water, hit Owl, get Zora Mask, Leever Slide to South Bay (16B) (19C) Flying Zora to Fountain, blow up rock with chu, Fairy Fountain warp to Ikana (12B) (10C) Slide to and hit Owl, 5 Bombs from Plant, Recoil Flip with bomb down to water, swim to Swamp and enter Lost Woods (15B) (10C) Get 10R and ISS from Bombchu, Get Bottle (15B) (9C) (80R) Zora ISS to Octorok, sidehop to Deku Palace (take 1 and 1/2 HP Damage) (14B) (9C) ISG-ISS past guards and climb the Palace, Get Sonata + SoS (10B) (10C) Get 4 Deku Sticks on the way to Woodfall Temple and enter Superflip Hover past Gap, kill Lizalfos and get Bow (8B) (9C) Recoil Flip to get OoB, 8 Superflip hovers to boss room, Kill Odolwa (0B) (1C) Warp to CT, ISS to Bremen Mask, Duplicate bottle over Deku Nuts, Deku Mask, and Bremen Mask and sell Red Potion (0B) (0C) (160R) Buy 20 Bombs and 20 Chus (20B) (20C) (20R) Warp to GB, Swim to Pirate's Fortress Superflip past gap, Get Hookshot and first Zora Egg, bombchu recoil flip to second Zora Egg (18B) (18C) Hookshot to target, jump around slope to third Zora egg, hookshot to target and skip the Pirate Battle for the fourth Zora Egg, warp to Great Bay (15B) (14C) Deposit Eggs, swim to Pinnacle Rock and get the last 3 Zora Eggs Warp to Great Bay, deposit Eggs for NWBN and swim to South Bay Play Zora Pots Game once, go to South Bay Owl, Get 5 Bombs, and enter GBT (120R) (20B) (14C) Superflip past gap and ISS to Flywheel Room (17B 13C) Boss Key Skip, Kill Gyorg, get 5 Bombs from pot (18B) (10C) Zora Grab Ledge and Hookshot to Fairy Fountain, Fairy Fountain Warp to Snowhead (14B) (2C) ISG-ISS up to Snowhead Temple (13B) (2C) Block Skip, Bomb Long Jump in Bridge Room (1/2 Damage) and kill Freezard with sword (12B) (2C) Scarecrow's Song Skip, 2 Bomb recoil Flips to Wizrobe, Beat Wizrobe using Infinite Deku Stick from Bomb Damage, Get Fire Arrows, Hookshot to torch (9B) (2C) Hookshot other torch, superflip hover to snowballs, ISS through the snowballs with a bomb (6B) (1C) Superflip hover to Boss Door, Boss Key Skip, Kill Goht with Superslide into cutscene (2B) (0C) Get 5 Bombs from plant, Warp to CT, Buy 10 Bombs and 20 Chus (17B) (20C) (0R) Warp to Ikana, Pull out Bomb while walking to plant, Get 5 Bombs, ISS up to Stone Tower (20B) (20C) Climb Stone Tower with Mega Flips, enter ST (11B) (13C) HISS over to door, Bomb Staircase + Sidehop strategy past Sun Block (8B) (9C) Get small key and minimize Magic Meter to 4 Fire Arrows and 1 Light Arrow Bomb Staircase + Zora Grab past Sun Block, Get 10 Bombs from Nejirons and take 1/2 Heart of Damage (16B) (6C) Recoil Flips in Updraft Room, Kill Garo's Master with Infinte Deku Stick from Bomb, get Light Arrow and deathwarp (13B) (5C) Invert Stone Tower with Bombchu Recoil Flip and enter Inverted Stone Tower (13B 4C) Bomb Long Jump past first room, Boss Key Skip (8B) (1C) Kill Twimmold with Fire Arrow Strat Warp to CT, Clock Tower early (5B) (0C) Slide to Majora Kid, kill first two cycles of Majora normally, kill 3rd cycle with Infinite Deku Stick from Bomb (3B) (0C)

Posted: 6/3/2009 7:05 PM

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Azorae

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (98)

Joined: 9/27/2007
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alright, Bremen Mask seems to be fastest. Here's what I think we have now: First Cycle get 2R in pre-Clock Town area (2/0R) Grandma's Stories to Day 3, Dance with Scarecrow to Night 3, deposit 2R (0/2R) To ECT, do a full run through termina field to WCT (99/2R) Deposit 99R, go to ECT, get Stray Fairy, run through Termina Field to NCT, get 99R, get Magic Meter, deposit 99R (0/200R) Backflip to Clock Tower, get Ocarina and SoT, Play Song of Time Second Cycle Play SoDT, hit Clock Town Owl, get Bremen Mask Withdraw 200R, Buy Bomb Bag + 20 Chus (20B) (20C) (70R) Exit to West Termina Field, ISG-ISS to Fence, Pull out bomb while Sliding, hover over fence with bomb and chu, Slide to GB (17B) (19C) ISS to water, hit Owl, get Zora Mask, Leever Slide to South Bay (16B) (19C) Flying Zora to Fountain, blow up rock with chu, Fairy Fountain warp to Ikana (12B) (10C) Slide to and hit Owl, 5 Bombs from Plant, Recoil Flip with bomb down to water, swim to Swamp and enter Lost Woods (15B) (10C) Get 10R and ISS from Bombchu, Get Bottle (15B) (9C) (80R) Zora ISS to Octorok, sidehop to Deku Palace (take 1 and 1/2 HP Damage) (14B) (9C) ISG-ISS past guards and climb the Palace, Get Sonata + SoS (11B) (9C) Get 4 Deku Sticks on the way to Woodfall Temple and enter Superflip Hover past Gap, Kill Lizarfos with Jumpslash Strat, Get Bow (9B) (8C) Recoil Flip to get OoB, 8 Superflip hovers to boss room, Kill Odolwa (1B) (0C) Warp to CT, Duplicate bottle over Deku Nuts, Deku Mask, and Bremen Mask and sell Red Potion (160R) Buy 20 Bombs and 20 Chus (20B) (20C) (20R) Warp to GB, Swim to Pirate's Fortress Superflip past gap, Get Hookshot and first Zora Egg, bombchu recoil flip to second Zora Egg (18B) (18C) Hookshot to target, jump around slope to third Zora egg, hookshot to target and skip the Pirate Battle for the fourth Zora Egg, warp to Great Bay (15B) (14C) Deposit Eggs, swim to Pinnacle Rock and get the last 3 Zora Eggs Warp to Great Bay, deposit Eggs for NWBN and swim to South Bay Play Zora Pots Game once, go to South Bay Owl, Get 5 Bombs, and enter GBT (120R) (20B) (14C) Superflip past gap and ISS to Flywheel Room (17B 13C) Boss Key Skip, Kill Gyorg, get 5 Bombs from pot (18B) (10C) Zora Grab Ledge and Hookshot to Fairy Fountain, Fairy Fountain Warp to Snowhead (14B) (2C) ISG-ISS up to Snowhead Temple (13B) (2C) Block Skip, Bomb Long Jump in Bridge Room (1/2 Damage) and kill Freezard with sword (12B) (2C) Scarecrow's Song Skip, 2 Bomb recoil Flips to Wizrobe, Beat Wizrobe using Infinite Deku Stick from Bomb Damage, Get Fire Arrows, Hookshot to torch (9B) (2C) Hookshot other torch, superflip hover to snowballs, ISS through the snowballs with a bomb (6B) (1C) Superflip hover to Boss Door, Boss Key Skip, Kill Goht with Superslide into cutscene (2B) (0C) Get 5 Bombs from plant, Warp to CT, Buy 10 Bombs and 20 Chus (17B) (20C) (0R) Warp to Ikana, Pull out Bomb while walking to plant, Get 5 Bombs, ISS up to Stone Tower (20B) (20C) Climb Stone Tower with Mega Flips, enter ST (11B) (13C) HISS over to door, Bomb Staircase + Sidehop strategy past Sun Block (8B) (9C) Get small key and minimize Magic Meter to 4 Fire Arrows and 1 Light Arrow Bomb Staircase + Zora Grab past Sun Block, Get 10 Bombs from Nejirons and take 1/2 Heart of Damage (16B) (6C) Recoil Flips in Updraft Room, Kill Garo's Master with Infinte Deku Stick from Bomb, get Light Arrow and deathwarp (13B) (5C) Invert Stone Tower with Bombchu Recoil Flip and enter Inverted Stone Tower (13B 4C) Bomb Long Jump past first room, Boss Key Skip (8B) (1C) Kill Twimmold with Fire Arrow Strat Warp to CT, Clock Tower early (5B) (0C) Slide to Majora Kid, kill first two cycles of Majora normally, kill 3rd cycle with Infinite Deku Stick from Bomb (3B) (0C) MrGrunz and Slowking, if you want to look this over and correct mistakes, feel free.

Posted: 6/3/2009 5:15 PM

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Azorae

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (98)

Joined: 9/27/2007
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I was playing through the current any% route with the new bottle duplication trick. Everything is great except that if we dupe over the bow and the deku mask, we cannot drop the bee's nest and can't get the hookshot. We need to keep at least one (the bow obviously), so we need to find a different item or mask to get a fourth bottle. Possibly Kafei's Mask?

Posted: 4/7/2009 5:30 AM

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Azorae

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Two questions, and they're both minor. 1) After Snowhead, we get 1 bomb drop from the grass. I'm assuming you mean the large clumps of grass, and it should be just as fast to get 2 drops. This would avoid the small detour in Ikana to get the bomb drop near the tree. 2) Though I'm not quite sure, I would imagine that the enemies in STT would do 1/2 damage when they explode, like most explosives. It would probably be better to take a full heart of damage here and skip taking damage from the Leever. Other than that, it looks perfect.

Posted: 4/6/2009 4:49 PM

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Azorae

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Joined: 9/27/2007
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Looks beautiful so far. One problem I spotted though is that you marked the FFWW to Snowhead and ISG-ISSing up to the temple as 4 bombs, when it takes 5 (2 for the staircase, 2 for the superflips, 1 for the ISG-ISS) That means we're a bomb short for STT, but doesn't matter since if we're getting a bomb drop after Snowhead, we can just get a second one as well. This would also allow us to superslide into position for the Goht fight, which should save a lot of time since it's quite a long walk otherwise. Then we have an extra bomb, which I'm sure can be used somewhere.

Posted: 4/6/2009 1:52 AM

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Azorae

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Because MrGrunz' new FFWW and the ISG+ISS Lullaby skip mean we can finish Snowhead before STT and have 8 bombs left over, we can finally skip the extra rupees and Snowhead -> STT is now almost certainly faster. Here's a route I threw together for it: First Cycle 200 Rupees Second Cycle SoDT when you are 9 and a half in-game hours away from the Ranch houses Hit CT Owl, Withdraw 200R, Buy Bomb Bag + 20 Chus (70R) (20B) (20C) ISG-ISS to Great Bay area, Bomb Staircase over fence, slide to GB (16B) (20C) ISS to rock, Get 5 Bombs, Slide to water, Hit owl, get Zora Mask (19B) Slide to South Bay, Flying Zora to Fountain (18B) Bombchu into Fountain, Wrong Warp to Ikana with new method, Slide to and Hit owl (13B) (11C) Get Bomb drop by tree, Recoil Flip down to River, Swim to Swamp (17B) Go to Lost Woods, get 10 Rupees, ISS through Woods, get Bottle (16B) (80R) Zora ISS to BigOcto, Kill BigOcto as Zora, sidestep through water to palace (15B) Get Sonata using MrGrunz's strat with a bombchu, Get SoS, Get 4 Deku Sticks, Enter Temple (14B) (10C) Finish Woodfall Temple, Warp to CT, buy 20 chus (4B) (20C) (0R)* Exit via WCT, slide to grass near cliff, get 4 bomb drops, kill bird for 200R and slide into Milk Road (19B) (200R) Use MrGrunz's Ranch Entry Strat, slide to houses, Get Bottle (16B) (17C) Warp to Great Bay, get hookshot, get 2 Eggs (hookshot room and first recoil flip) (15B) (12C)** Warp to North Bay, Deposit Eggs, Go back for last 2 eggs (OoB and second recoil flip) (12B) (7C) Warp to North Bay, Do Pinnacle Rock twice, get NWBN Go to GBT, get bomb drop from pot near turtle (17B) Finish GBT, get bomb drop from pot again (18B) (0C) Warp to Clock Town, buy 20 Chus (18B) (20C) (120R) Warp to Woodfall, Get 2 Deku Sticks, FFWW to Snowhead, ISG+ISS into temple (13B) (12C) Finish Snowhead Temple (8B) (1C) Warp to Clock Town, Buy 10 Bombs and 20 Bombchus (18B) (20C) (10R) Warp to Ikana, ISS into Stone Tower (17B) (20C) Complete Stone Tower Temple, get 2 bomb drops inside and save 1 chu (4B) (1C) Hover into clock tower (1B 0C) Moon (0B 0C) *Try to use the 3 extra bombs before this point **MrGrunz mentioned something about a bombchu superslide to the hookshot chest. I'm still not entirely certain how this would work, so I'm marking it as requiring 1 bombchu. If it takes any bombs it throws the entire route off, but if it isn't used the route isn't changed. Just use the bombchu somewhere else, perhaps a recoil flip to cover a short distance quickly. It seems like both times we use the FFWW we have an unused bombchu that is overridden by a bomb run. Therefore, it may be faster to use it in the FFWW to save time from a quicker hover staircase setup.

Posted: 4/5/2009 10:45 PM
(Edited: 4/5/2009 11:11 PM)

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Azorae

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (98)

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I still believe that the rupee detour required if you do SHT first takes much more time than the very quick 50R after STT and the slightly slower Twinmold battle. Anyways, I've found a way to do the FFWW with 4 bombs and 9 bombchus that is about 5 seconds faster. The video can be found here.

Posted: 3/31/2009 9:02 PM

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Azorae

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Slowking wrote:

No we can't combine it since we have a 3-item limit. Going to snowhead after STT would be fastest like this: at twinmold battle we equip: Fire Arrows, Ocarina, Deku mask warp to Ct buy stuff, yadda yadda, warp to Woodfall, get over to FF, at Fairy fountain equip: Chus, Bombs

STT first we wouldn't have the fire arrows, so it'd be - At Twinmold: Arrows, keep bombs and bombchus on - After Twinmold dies: Light Arrows, Ocarina, Deku Mask - At Fairy Fountain: Hookshot, Chus, Bombs One extra pause.

Slowking wrote:

Azorae wrote:
Also, we skip 7 bomb timers and a superflip by using up all the bombchus, a total of about 20+ seconds. Even without factoring in the extra required rupees, STT first still looks to be faster. And again, we have to get those 10 rupees between buying explosives for SHT and buying explosives for STT. 10 rupees will be more feasible than 50 in the temple, but I don't believe there is a place where they can be collected quickly.
With 10 Chus more we can substitute 5 Mega hovers with normal hovers (normal hovers eat up Chus like they are nothing). 3 normal hovers span the distance of 1 mega hover. A mega hover takes 5 seconds, a normal hover 1 second. So on every substituted mega hover we save 2 seconds. Since we can substitute only 5 Mega hovers that makes 10 seconds saved total. I did my math here. ;)

The chus used, specifically, are: 2 extras to cross gap in pirate's fortress (instead of superflipping) (2 seconds) 1 to recoil flip into first egg (instead of using a bomb) (4 seconds) 1 to recoil flip to the third egg (instead of using a bomb) (3.5 seconds) 2 to hover out of bounds in PF to the fourth egg (instead of using 2 bombs) (7 seconds) 2 to hover out of bounds in GBT (instead of using 2 bombs) (7 seconds) Skipping those would still leave us with only 9, meaning an extra bomb hover in SHT (4 seconds) Plus, if we leave SHT with less than 8 bombs, we'll have to get the bomb drop near the Ikana owl to be able to superslide into Stone Tower, costing another 2.5 seconds at least. Total time lost by saving 9 chus for SHT first: ~27.5 seconds Total time lost by doing STT first: ~10 seconds. EDIT:

MrGrunz wrote:

bombchu superslide through barrels over to hookshot

How exactly is this done? does it require a bomb as well, or just a bombchu recoil flip->ESS or something similar?

Posted: 3/31/2009 7:47 PM
(Edited: 3/31/2009 7:55 PM)

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Azorae

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (98)

Joined: 9/27/2007
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The 50 Rupees after STT take MUCH less than 10 seconds. As you can see in this video, shooting the guay after the temple takes less than 3 seconds. Equipping the light arrows also takes about 3 seconds. The light arrows are unequipped when reequipping the explosives for SHT, so no time is lost there. That plus the slower Twinmold battle comes to a total of no more than 10 seconds. Also, we skip 7 bomb timers and a superflip by using up all the bombchus, a total of about 20+ seconds. Even without factoring in the extra required rupees, STT first still looks to be faster. And again, we have to get those 10 rupees between buying explosives for SHT and buying explosives for STT. 10 rupees will be more feasible than 50 in the temple, but I don't believe there is a place where they can be collected quickly. EDIT: Fixed video link EDIT2: Not to mention, STT last would require an extra bomb drop inside the temple, and that would cost about 3-4 seconds. Seems pretty clear.

Posted: 3/31/2009 6:54 PM

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Azorae

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (98)

Joined: 9/27/2007
Posts: 103
Location: Florida

The route I posted above reflects the fact that we're doing Woodfall first and in one go. I'm not arguing for doing Woodfall in two pieces; rather I'm proposing the route we would take if we had the extra chus from not splitting Woodfall. I'm pretty sure it's nine, but if MrGrunz sees an extra one to use, he can feel free to add it in. As for STT vs SHT, SHT first would still leave us 20R short, and those rupees would still need to come between buying explosives for SHT and buying explosives for STT. This would, just like the 50R problem we had before, require either 2 bank conversations or a rather long detour.

Posted: 3/31/2009 6:44 PM
(Edited: 3/31/2009 6:56 PM)

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Azorae

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (98)

Joined: 9/27/2007
Posts: 103
Location: Florida

Yes, I did read your route, and yes, I know we are doing Woodfall in one trip. What I did was take a snippet of my old route and pointed out places that I used bomb hovers or recoil flips over bombchu hovers or recoil flips. In the new route, we have 9 extra bombchus for the PF->GBT portion, so I'm proposing that we use those to save time where time was lost in the old route due to bombchu constraints. The new route would, with the improvements I listed, look something like this (from Woodfall complete to STT) Finish Woodfall Temple, Warp to CT, buy 20 chus (2B) (20C) (0R) Exit via WCT, slide to grass near cliff, get 4 bomb drops, kill bird for 200R and slide into Milk Road (19B) (200R) ISG slide to rock, pull out bomb while ESSing, hover in corner next to rock to Ranch, Slide to Houses, Get Bottle (16B) (17C) Warp to Great Bay, get hookshot, get 2 Eggs (hookshot room and first recoil flip) (15B) (13C) Warp to North Bay, Deposit Eggs, Go back for last 2 eggs (OoB and second recoil Flip) (12B 8C) Warp to North Bay, Do Pinnacle Rock, get NWBN Go to GBT, get bomb drop from pot near turtle (17B) Finish GBT, get bomb drop from pot again (18B) (1C) Warp to Clock Town, buy 20 Chus, warp to Ikana (18B) (20C) (120R) Slide to STT, Finish Temple (0B) (0C) Get 50R from guay and warp to Clock Town (170R) We have 30 extra rupees, but that can't be helped and it doesn't really matter. If anyone can find any holes/improvements/etc. feel free to add them.

Posted: 3/31/2009 6:26 PM
(Edited: 3/31/2009 6:33 PM)

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Azorae

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (98)

Joined: 9/27/2007
Posts: 103
Location: Florida

Very Nice find MrGrunz. Can you keep the speed even around corners? Can't watch any videos for an hour or so, at school right now. Anyways, regarding extra bombchus after GBT, here is the portion of my route from buying chus after Woodfall to buying chus after Woodfall Part 2 Get Bow and deathwarp out, Warp to CT, buy 20 chus (11B) (20C) (0R) Exit via WCT, slide to grass near cliff, get 2 bomb drops and 20 rupees, slide into Milk Road (19B) (20R) ISG slide to rock, pull out bomb while ESSing, hover in corner next to rock to Ranch, Slide to Houses, Get Bottle (16B) (17C) Warp to Great Bay, get hookshot, get 2 Eggs (hookshot room and first recoil flip) (13B) (16C) - 2 Bombchu hovers instead of a superflip would save time Warp to North Bay, Deposit Eggs, Go back for last 2 eggs (OoB and second recoil Flip) (7B 14C) - This portion uses 8 explosives with a minimum of 3 bombs for ISG and the superflips. Using 3 bombchus over bombs can save time. Warp to North Bay, Do Pinnacle Rock, get NWBN Go to GBT, Do pots twice on the way, get bomb drop from pot near turtle (12B) (200R) Finish GBT, get bomb drop from pot, warp to Woodfall (11B) (9C) - 2 chu hovers can be used instead of bomb hovers while getting OoB That's 7 chus total, along with an extra explosive that I missed while recoil flipping the second egg room. That's at least 8 of the 9 bombchus we have left used to save time, and we also save 7 bombs, allowing us to buy 20 chus but not the 10 bombs that would be required for STT (we're warping to Clock town for the STT Chu run where it says we're warping to Woodfall in that route). Also, we skip the bomb drop from the grass in Ikana, because we can superslide straight to Stone Tower and have 17 bombs and 20 bombchus. Then we get one bomb drop from the temple (which is required anyways) and we have 22 - exactly how many we need to complete the temple. Then we collect the 50 rupees after the temple, warp to Clock town, pick up 20 of each explosive, and complete SHT and the rest of the game the same from there.

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