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jlun2 wrote:
I've managed to save 2 more frames so far.
Nice, I was up to about 73 pixels ahead (about 18-19 frames) in my last attempt, but for some reason I lost some of them by the end, even though everything was done the same way. It ended up being 15 frames (about 62 pixels) faster. I don't know for sure, but your 2 frames could probably be from where I goofed, we'll see!
About the next level, we may possibly need to switch to patrick briefly in the area where there are breakable blocks on the floor, to avoid going out of the way twice. I still haven't tested whether just using spongebob to go around that area is any slower than using patrick to break through, but just a heads up.
Also I think the third level is a racing level, so that will be interesting.
I won't go in too much TAS'ing detail on the next level until you post that improvement though.
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Sorry to post again so soon, but I've saved another 15 frames in the first level with a couple tricks. First of all jumping up to a ledge can be cut short by doing the B A combo while double tapping right to run, this saves a few pixels each time. Also there are places that were better optimized, such as jumping over the ledge where you collect those stars, rather than just falling off.
Also for some reason that spiked wall was sticking out this time (I'm not sure on the randomness of these objects) so I could cleanly jump to it rather than use that little boost in the air.
I'm pretty much done with the first level I think, unless you can come up with a couple more frames to save or something.
http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/812249762/Exxonym_SSLCP3.81.vbm
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jlun2 wrote:
The X Speed is actually 03002B8E
That makes more sense, I thought the other address seemed a bit unstable for runspeed, but I figured since it changed consistently with the way he was moving that it was the runspeed. I wonder what that other address is really following then.
I played through the second level normally and it seems like it might be a little more challenging to TAS. We'll see.
Edit: Did you try playing as any other characters? I never really tested them much besides their basic run speed, but it could be possible to glitch them in other ways since spongebob can.
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Nice! I figured the bad luck at the end could be avoided. I didn't think about pixel optimization, so knowing the x and y position seems really helpful.
About working together, I have no problem with it. I just wonder how my schedule will match up with yours as I'll probably be busy this summer. Also an easier way to communicate would be nice. I'm always on IRC but I also have AIM and MSN.
About the pixel optimization, does it come from jumping (Edit: Pressing B) for one frame after landing?
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I'm posting a new topic cause I couldn't find one for this particular game. Point me to it if I'm wrong.
I was just messing around with this game to see what I could come up with since I had some free time tonight. I only played through the first level, and it seems like a standard platformer.
I made a quick test of the first level, and here are some things I can point out:
- double tapping either direction will cause the character to sprint. Spongebob and patrick appear to be the fastest characters, while squidward is definitely the slowest.
- X speed: 03000552
- Y speed: 03002B9A
- it's possible to jump infinitely as spongebob by abusing his absorption technique. If you jump the exact frame after canceling the technique in the air, you can perform a jump, and repeat as many times as desired. This will be useful to skipping a lot of the game.
- Pressing B while sprinting will make your character do a special attack. It is almost necessary to defeat enemies that are in your way without slowing down significantly. Of course at the end of this special attack you'll completely stop and have to reactive the sprint. This also happens whenever you fall from a ledge, so it is often useful to perform this attack over a ledge to extend your sprinting speed (and only losing about 2 or 3 frames before sprinting again).
I'm already aware that in this little test my abuse of the infinite jump is not the fastest. I just did a quick test to see what it would look like, and it can/will be improved later (if I decide to do this game..). However if you notice anything else, please don't hesitate to tell me!
The rerecord count is pretty high for this little test, and only because I spent a lot of time looking for glitches (of which I only found the jump glitch).
I don't have any idea how long the actual game is until I unlock all the levels. Any thoughts if this would be interesting at all?
http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1561674525/Exxonym_SSLCP2.vbm
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Nice! I had this game in mind to TAS at one point (posted in the forums) but I just lost interest after only a small test of the first few levels. It's nice to see someone finally complete (edit: submit*) this game and it looks like you did a pretty good job. I'll surely vote yes!
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ShadowJacky wrote:
can you only jump off of them at certain frames or is it just a certain amount of frames until they kill you?
Although it usually succeeds while TAS'ing, I found that sometimes you die no matter how quickly you try to jump. That's usually not the case, but even though it is successful most of the time, it's usually only 1 frame that allows you to jump again without dying. That being said, it would be very difficult to perform in real time. I don't think it's that big of a deal for a realtime speedrun to just use the platforms; Especially if you get that far into the game, only to die at that point.
Good luck with the real time speedrun, I've always wanted to see that for this game, and that's what sparked my interest in making a TAS of it.
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Well I decided I would try this game, even though I've found mupen64 to be completely frustrating. I did a test up through the starting area (the teensie king(s)).
I think I'm getting the hang of TAS'ing using this emulator, and this WIP is in no way final. I haven't thought about a route plan for the game yet as I'm only testing at the moment. With the SDA run however, it shouldn't be too hard to come up with an effective lum route.
I found a trick in this section involving Z, where I can grab a ledge that's normally out of reach (right before the globox kids). This saves having to run to the murfy text block to get up there.
I also incorporated the Murfy text skip at the very beginning, and the globox kids text skip (though probably not as best as I could have).
The sliding section at the beginning is weird, I looked at Comicalflop's WIP and compared it to a certain frame near the end. According to that I ended the sliding section about 40 frames ahead of his? I'm not too sure because it looks awkward like I didn't quite optimize it right. So a confirmation on whether it's faster would be appreciated.
Anyway, here's the file. I haven't come across any desyncs quite yet luckily.
http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/73445903/Rayman2_exxonym.m64Edit: I updated the file above with one that completes the globox kids text skip more effectively (don't have to fly over them).
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Yeah, the repetitiveness is what is keeping me from really going into this much. I found a code for level select so I could see exactly how long the game is. Apparently there are 6 worlds:
-Flatulent Swamps (4 levels + boss)
-The Pits (4 levels + boss)
-Mucous Mountains (2 levels)
-Boogerville (4 levels + boss)
-Nasal Caverns (2 levels)
-Pus Palace (4 levels + boss)
-Sewer City (16 levels, but all are optional I believe)
Since some places only have 2 levels, I'm not sure yet if they are optional, and only the ones with 4 levels are the main story of the game. There are 5 bosses however, so it would be likely there are 5 main worlds.
Also, apparently there are 2 endings, and I'm not sure which triggers one or the other.
And for future TAS reference, there is a code that allows Boogerman to fly anywhere on the current level, and collect items. Now I don't think this would be allowed in the TAS (plus it kills you for some reason when exiting it), but it is very useful for mapping a level and seeing where everything is. The code is: Start + A + B + C, on the 2nd controller.
Some enemies will not appear if you move a certain way or do a certain something beforehand. I noticed this in the first level there was supposed to be an orange giant enemy, but when I went back and jumped on a different tree branch, he was not there.
This last bit makes me believe the game is not emulated correctly, as well as previous posts. I did the level select to the "Booger Meister" boss, and the game froze after I hit him one time.. That could be a problem, or maybe it only happens with the level select? It seems like that boss is far into the game, so it would be hard to find out, and I would hate to get that far and see the game is impossible to complete.
Any thoughts or information on this would be greatly appreciated!
Edit: Okay, the Genesis version of this game is definitely not right. I downloaded the SNES version of the game and the menu displays correctly (toggle music, sounds, etc, or quit the game).
There seems to be differences with the game as well... the music is the same melody just slighty different. The real difference however, is the level design; They do not appear to be the same at all. I think I'll just skip this game altogether for now.
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Is this game even emulated correctly? I don't own the original game so I can't recall if the game is supposed to act like this.
First of all, pausing and pressing B brings some sort of menu (supposedly), but it appears as gibberish. This occurs on any ROM I load.
Secondly, pressing up and down will freeze the game (the music still plays) until you let go.
I wonder if these will inhibit anything, as I would like to know what appears on this "menu."
Here's a file that demonstrates both:
http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/622478985/Exxonym_boogermanA2.gmv
Also, while I'm at it I guess I'll post an updated movie. I've redone up through 1-3 and slightly into 4. I've tried a few more tricks to make it as entertaining as possible. It's also slightly faster although I haven't checked the exact frame difference yet. My main goal is to see if anyone would find this even mildly entertaining.
Here's that file:
http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1108101428/Exxonym_boogermanB2.gmv
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Well I got bored again today and took a stab at this game. I finished the first world, and it is most likely not optimal.
This game might be a tad too long and monotonous for a serious submission. My goal was mainly to see what this game looks like TAS'd. Honestly I found it pretty boring after the first world, but I haven't played through the entire game yet.
If someone wants to take this game seriously, here is some information I found,
- Movement speed is 00FF1A2B
- Jumping on the correct frame at the start of a level gets max speed much faster.
- The fireball fart causes much more damage (found out on the boss) than any other attack.
- You'll want to avoid getting as many plungers as possible. I think 10 is the number where he'll try to climb to the bonus cliff at the end of the level; That wastes a bunch of frames.
- Landing on trampolines slows you down a bit. I hit one but didn't bother going back to optimize the flying a bit more so I could fly over it.
If someone wishes to see it or improve it, or neither, here it is:
http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1644753312/Exxonym_boogermanB.gmv
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Nice! I never saw the previous attempts at the game, but this one is nice. The dodging is pretty neat the first few times, but gets boring after a while. Still, the run is nice and I enjoyed watching it!
Voted yes.
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When I first saw the title of this game a while ago, I thought it was a completely different type of game.
Nice improvement over your last movie, it's a short game and the bosses don't stand a chance.
Voted yes.
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So I found this game and it seems alright, though it may be a bit boring to watch the full run.
I wasn't sure what topic to post on, since there were 2; I went with the original.
I have some questions on this game however; I know the game's difficulty is usually preferred on the hardest mode. This game's difficulty only changes how many hits the character can take as far as I can see. Selecting the hardest difficulty (expert) will only slow the run down because you'll have to take time to change it, and you won't be able to take damage in the run (Expert kills you in 1 hit).
I finished the first 2 levels on the "Hard" difficulty (2 hits = death) and I've already found 1 spot where taking damage saves time over maTO's run.
Here's my playaround file that I whipped up in about an hour (subject to change obviously, and is ~20 or so frames ahead of maTO's because of the difficulty selected):
http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/592021958/Exxonym_Havoc_test.gmv
1. Does this game look interesting enough to be publishable?
2. What do you think of the difficulty?
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Oh no! I think I found a use for that 4-3 glitch in 4-1. Could anyone hold off encoding this, until maybe I can complete the new file. It shouldn't take more than 1 or 2 days to update then someone can maybe upload the new file instead.
I'll update this post when (or if) I can confirm the improvement. Sorry for any inconveniences (not really)!
Edit: It seems like it is indeed faster. I will have to redo world 4. I'll reply to the thread when it is complete, and I will go as fast as I can without making anything sloppy.
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Personally I liked the movie, even with the sprite ejections. It's a nice break away from the zipping (though I love those runs too). Pretty soon though the whole game will be zipping anyway, so it's nice to have something like this alongside it. I'll vote yes.
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arflech wrote:
I remember back when I considered making a TAS but never followed through on it :-(
Yeah, thanks for creating the thread and posting useful information! That kept me from dillydallying in the game a little bit since I knew kind of what to expect from your post.
Of course I'm sure this is improvable somewhere (probably world 4; more glitching or such).
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It is VERY hard and awkward to play in real time. Just try and see :P.
I was advised that I should probably make a separate file that fills in the high-score name at the end only for the encode version. What do you guys think?
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I found a way to make the magnet sliding in 3-1 faster. However, I'm currently on 3-6 and really don't feel like starting from 3-1 again. There's really only one place in 3-1 I think it would be faster (a few frames, maybe 10 at the most). Does anyone think it is worth going all the way back for those few frames? 3-1 and 3-6 are the only levels that have the magnets and I figured out this trick while doing 3-6.
The trick is: instead of holding right after sticking to a magnet wait until the second frame on the magnet and press L+R and then hold right. This causes TinHead to slide instantly rather than waiting a good number of frames before sliding.
I don't think the first slide in 3-1 will matter because the vertical platform that comes after it will have to be waited on anyway. It is the magnet sliding on the way back to the portal that I think can save a few frames.
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This looks much better than the last submission. I refrained voting from that one but it would have likely been a meh from me.
@Lil_Gecko: I was thinking the same thing! I thought he would have run side by side or as close as possible at one point.
This one however looks like it will get a yes from me. I still like what you did to make the olympic events more entertaining.
