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Eszik wrote:
I think the ACE run should obsolete the 100% run since it gets even more than 100% collection rate and end the game fastern, and because we have too many branches for Super Metroid.
Uses RAM manipulation to achieve it. Not even in the same ballpark of what I'm talking about.
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feos wrote:
Fog wrote:
As it stands right now we have too many branches for Super Metroid.
"Too many" is subjective.
Fog wrote:
If this run is able to apply and obsolete three runs (which in my opinion it should), then that would reduce the amount of branches that we have, and streamline what the branch definitions should be.
Arbitrary obsoletions just to clarify branch names? Sounds silly. Once again, dealing with subjective things one needs to rely on statistics. Otherwise it well go like that.
How is it arbitrary? There are perfectly valid reasons to obsolete the x-ray glitch, game end glitch, and in game timer runs.
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feos wrote:
Fog wrote:
Then why did no one downvote the ACE run where they did exactly that and got a 6 minute IGT?
Because it looked great within its goals.
Fog wrote:
The point I'm trying to make is that the IGT does not deserve to be in Moons if it can be easily exploited by multiple methods.
It can't. If some game-breaking glitch or super boring trick is added to that category run, it will be called "ingame, trick X". Have fun collecting votes for that to obsolete the normal ingame run.
Also, see my signature.
We don't need to have a separate branch for each IGT. As it stands right now we have too many branches for Super Metroid. If this run is able to apply and obsolete three runs (which in my opinion it should), then that would reduce the amount of branches that we have, and streamline what the branch definitions should be.
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feos wrote:
Fog wrote:
Theoretically, someone could get to 0hp, then pause/unpause forever to get a lower in-game time.
Perhaps we should abolish the in-game time branch.
This is exactly why we rely on the audience's perception when judging Moons movies. Someone runs through the entire game pausing all the time? No problem! The crowd would just downvote it and it will be rejected. Because to obsolete something in Moons, the run must be either
- faster, and not too distracting, or
- more entertaining, and polished.
If it's faster, but it looks terrible, it can be either rejected, or published to Vault. If it's more entertaining, it can be actually slower (for example, have speed/entertainment trade offs), or even have a different goal, and still obsolete another Moons run.
To make sure one Moons run should obsolete another, if they have different goals, the direct question needs to be asked: which one is better and how. Well, I didn't ask "how" this submission is better than the 2 glitched runs, because it still can be understood and seen from the posts. But the fact that almost no one sees any similarities to other SM branches tells that they deserve separate branches. At least for now.
Then why did no one downvote the ACE run where they did exactly that and got a 6 minute IGT?
The point I'm trying to make is that the IGT does not deserve to be in Moons if it can be easily exploited by multiple methods.
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feos wrote:
Fog wrote:
Nach wrote:
Thanks Fog.
What about obsoleting the fastest in-game time run? This is the fastest in-game time, and doesn't do anything particularly crazy aside from messing with the Y coordinates (which our Metroid runs do too BTW). As is, in-game is rather arbitrary.
It doesn't use the RAM to modify the in game time, so I feel that it should obsolete that as well.
It is only faster than the ingame time run because it glitches straight to the end. It doesn't set the goal "minimal ingame time". It has
1) shortest real-time as a goal,
2) game breaking glitch as a method.
On the other hand, the ingame time run deliberately avoided game-breaking glitches. Because with them, old (current) X-Ray run's ingame time was still smaller.
It's a byproduct of those two goals.
Theoretically, someone could get to 0hp, then pause/unpause forever to get a lower in-game time.
Perhaps we should abolish the in-game time branch.
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Nach wrote:
Thanks Fog.
What about obsoleting the fastest in-game time run? This is the fastest in-game time, and doesn't do anything particularly crazy aside from messing with the Y coordinates (which our Metroid runs do too BTW). As is, in-game is rather arbitrary.
It doesn't use the RAM to modify the in game time, so I feel that it should obsolete that as well.
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Nach wrote:
The question is, is the techniques in this run closer to either of the runs you proposed it obsolete. If the old X-Ray run has a reason to be more "legitimate", than this, it shouldn't obsolete it just because both use the same item somewhere.
You seemed to propose X-Ray is the decisive factor, and happen to obsolete another based on time. I'm suggesting to look at RAM corruption as the decisive factor, and not necessarily obsolete because of using particular items.
The thing is that it's using the same glitch for both this submission and 1978M, however this submission goes even farther out of bounds than 1978M, which causes the RAM corrpution. For all intents and purposes, this submission takes the X-Ray glitch to a much greater extreme. It also is the current fastest way to complete the game and causes a "game-end glitch". I don't feel that it should obsolete the other low% runs which use different items than the X-ray. Those runs still maintain a resemblance to normal gameplay.
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QuizmasterBos wrote:
I don't see the point in easiest difficulty TASes. Aren't TASes supposed to show super-human skill? Beating the game on the hardest difficulties and making it look really easy? Playing on easy mode just seems counter-productive to that.
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sack_bot wrote:
Fog wrote:
sack_bot wrote:
Fog wrote:
Requesting the submission file to be replaced with this zip: http://www.sendspace.com/file/d3ce9t
There was many frames of blank input from stopping the movie well after last input.
I also uploaded a crappy temp encode, will probably provide a better one later.
EDIT: uploaded a 480p encode. should be good enough to watch without your eyes bleeding
Does jumping repeatedly increase your height?
Only on specific bouncy surfaces (like the bed, specific tree branches, etc.) that are built into the design of the level.
As for the "mouse-hopping", it's purely to increase speed when compared to normal running.
What if you landed on it from mouse hopping instead of doing it from a dead stop?
Unfortunately you just keep moving forward if you try to mouse hop and land on a bouncy surface with no additional height.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
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sack_bot wrote:
Fog wrote:
Requesting the submission file to be replaced with this zip: http://www.sendspace.com/file/d3ce9t
There was many frames of blank input from stopping the movie well after last input.
I also uploaded a crappy temp encode, will probably provide a better one later.
EDIT: uploaded a 480p encode. should be good enough to watch without your eyes bleeding
Does jumping repeatedly increase your height?
Only on specific bouncy surfaces (like the bed, specific tree branches, etc.) that are built into the design of the level.
As for the "mouse-hopping", it's purely to increase speed when compared to normal running.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(626)
Joined: 4/5/2014
Posts: 459
Requesting the submission file to be replaced with this zip: http://www.sendspace.com/file/d3ce9t
There was many frames of blank input from stopping the movie well after last input.
I also uploaded a crappy temp encode, will probably provide a better one later.
EDIT: uploaded a 480p encode. should be good enough to watch without your eyes bleeding
