Editor, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(781)
Joined: 10/19/2013
Posts: 1116
Chamale wrote:
Jadextreme wrote:
Will switch to use any dogs go any faster (from ecruteak)?
Amazed to noticed this was done back in 2006!
There's a Pokémon GSC thread to discuss this, but the answer to your question is probably no. I know it's useful for the unassisted Crystal speedrun, but because of luck-manipulation, Graveler gets a one-hit KO on almost everything in this TAS. Taking a detour of a couple minutes to catch a legendary dog doesn't seem to be worth the time.
You have to revive the dogs anyway in Crystal version. Entei has slower lv up rate so using it might potentially save some time from texts, but it's really hard to say. Let's move any future discussion to the thread for this game.
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(781)
Joined: 10/19/2013
Posts: 1116
DO YOU KNOW HOW IT FEELS TO BE TROLLED?
Link to videohttp://tasvideos.org/userfiles/info/38921170581626445
I totally didn't see this coming.
There is a hidden final boss fight in Ch.5 in which you fight Mammon Machine and Lavos Cores. I got two Elixir and Greendream for this just to find out... the right bit has an HP of only 3000 so Elixir glitch doesn't work!
This is not completely a bad news. The HP of left bit is 4000, and the HP of the humanoid thing is 2000. It should be possible to grind enough exp in a reasonable time to fight this boss without Elixir glitch, but the left bit would still be a pain to deal with since it absorbs magical attacks.
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(781)
Joined: 10/19/2013
Posts: 1116
cheeze42 wrote:
Why not just keep it glitchless like the RB 151 TAS?
1. As stated in the submission text of said TAS, "the categories for Generation I of Pokémon games have shifted towards being all about the glitches, and efforts to limit which glitches are allowed to show more actual gameplay have been largely ineffective." This is not the case for Gen III. Pomeg glitch is the only game breaking glitch that helps speedrunning.
2. With absolutely no glitch, the only choice is Ruby and Sapphire. Due to the linear nature of these games, two sides will probably feature almost the same content for most time and both end up simply grinding Elite 4 over and over for Bagon and Beldum. A run features Ruby and Emerald is likely to be more entertaining.
Still, this is just a proposal. It's gonna take a while before it becomes possible to make such a run.
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(781)
Joined: 10/19/2013
Posts: 1116
http://tasvideos.org/3134M.html
Obviously, a national diploma run of all Gen 3 games will be boring due to the sheer amount of tradings needed, but regional diploma runs might be a good idea.
Memory corruption glitches should definitely be banned since they would allow you to complete the Pokedex in Emerald alone without trading, but what about the minor glitches like riding on water? If they are allowed, is this glitch(http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/List_of_glitches_in_Generation_III#Roaming_Pok.C3.A9mon_encounter_bug) considered memory corruption? Lati@s encounter glitch would make it possible to complete Hoenn-dex with either R and E or S and E. Otherwise, the only way to do it with only two games is using R and S.
Another question is whether E reader can be used. Eon Ticket e card would be very helpful in case the Lati@s encounter glitch is allowed.
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(781)
Joined: 10/19/2013
Posts: 1116
Bizhawk 1.12.2 can run games with fbalpha_libretro.dll without reporting errors, but the screen position and resolution is wrong when running Donkey Kong.
BTW, does Bizhawk-libretro support fba sound sample packs?
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(781)
Joined: 10/19/2013
Posts: 1116
Most NPCs are the same, but some trainers are repositioned so that you can walk around them. This is evident by the fact that Crystal RTA WR(http://www.speedrun.com/pkmncrystal) is 5 minutes faster than Silver RTA WR(http://www.speedrun.com/pkmngoldsilver). I didn't know about version exclusive morning-only Pokémon though.
Electabuzz, Clefairy, and Pikachu can only be caught in Kanto in all Gen 2 games so breeding them that late in the game is probably not a good idea. Getting Elekid from Odd Egg is not a worse idea than getting Tyrogue from it. I'm not sure about getting Clefairy and Hitmonlee/Hitmonchan from Yellow, but sending Pikachu from Yellow to Gen 2 immediately is probably a good idea because it allows you to start breading Pichu early and Pikachu doesn't serve much purpose in Yellow for speedrunning.
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(781)
Joined: 10/19/2013
Posts: 1116
Chamale wrote:
One run (almost certainly Crystal) will always want Zubat, Eevee, and the Odd Egg (to hatch Tyrogue) in the party, and the other will always want Togepi and Eevee in the party.
Tyrogue is probably not the best choice for Odd Egg. The Tyrogue you get in Mt. Mortar is 5 levels higher than the ones hateched from eggs so it will be faster to raise this one to lv20. Hitmonlee and Hitmonchan should both be acquired in Yellow since you have much less things to do and have to reset after reviving one fossil anyway.
cheeze42 wrote:
Might even be the main bottleneck (either that or XP).
You can walk around with up to 5 eggs at the same time so hatching eggs is not likely to be the bottleneck.
Fortranm wrote:
A key difference in Crystal is that Sneasel is found at the Ice Path instead of at Mt. Silver, and Larvitar can be purchased at Celadon Game Corner with 8888C. This Larvitar is at Lv40, which is much higher than the level of any wild Larvitar you can find at Mt.Silver.
However, Misdreavus is only available at Mt. Silver in all Gen 2 games, thus it is the bottleneck of the run, just like Mewtwo in MrWint's R/B 150 TAS. The best plan is probably to have either G or S rush to Mt. Silver by getting all Kanto Badges and C collect legendaries(since you have to revive three beasts any way) and getting coins in Celadon Game Corner for Larvitar.
Chamale wrote:
This means that either Gold will have to restart after catching Sunkern, or it won't ever be able to trade with Yellow, which seems weak. Gold and Crystal will be much slower than Yellow, so we want to minimize the number of trades they do.
It's possible, although not a huge timesave, that if Gold outpaces Crystal before the first reset it could trade over something with Cut so Crystal can skip acquiring that HM. However, I'm not sure if Crystal can waste enough time between New Bark Town and Azalea Town to make that timing happen.
If one Gen 2 game has to restart, it better be Crystal because it has fewer mandatory NPCs although it has additional cutscenes, but as I mentioned, that might make it better to have Crystal catch the legendaries. You can also get two Odd Eggs this way.
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(781)
Joined: 10/19/2013
Posts: 1116
jlun2 wrote:
Somewhat off topic, but is there any new tricks for the "glitchless" (mostly?, probably game too broken tbh) run? I haven't really followed the tricks for this game, but I assume something would be found since the last run from 2006?
The submission text of that movie mentions a few obvious improvements:
Get a fifth Escape Rope and use it in the Underground Tunnel.
Get an Ether instead of a Max Ether.
It also saves time to get Kenya instead of catching a bird for Fly.
Using a Poké Doll to escape from shiny Gyarados instead of fighting it might save time.
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(781)
Joined: 10/19/2013
Posts: 1116
klmz wrote:
Really? According to my old tests, the holy water could be used on Dracula when he starts circling in the room, but waiting for that takes longer than just to beat him up before that. Did I do it wrong o.O?
Flame Whip can probably kill Dracula quicker than holy water does, but other whips are slower.
Using scrolling glitch in Brahm's Mansion turns out to be faster than using stair glitch.
Swag boost is the only trick from RTA WR that is still not in this TAS. :(
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(781)
Joined: 10/19/2013
Posts: 1116
Link to video
I just found out Koh1fds uploaded this video back in 2014. Killing Dracula with holy water turns out to be 115 frames faster.
I'm using zggzdydp's run from March 26 so the new route in Mansion 4 is not implemented. It probably can be easily edited into the new run since the final boss battle seems to be RNG independent.
Edit: Saved another 66 frames. The exact location of Dracula doesn't matter after all. You just need to make sure the holy water hits the ground at the right time.
http://tasvideos.org/userfiles/info/38276594254582976
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(781)
Joined: 10/19/2013
Posts: 1116
Nach wrote:
zggzdydp:
Can you update your movie to make use of this new trick? Or is the movie not edit-friendly here?
The RNG of this game is extremely edit-unfriendly. This trick is only used more than two-thirds into the game so he won't need to redo most of the run though.
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(781)
Joined: 10/19/2013
Posts: 1116
Link to videohttp://tasvideos.org/userfiles/info/37957828373462109
I started a run on FDS version. By the end of this WIP(being back at Jova after getting rib and heart), it's 2 minutes faster than my run on NES with similar route from 2 years ago. I'll finish this run to see how it goes.
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(781)
Joined: 10/19/2013
Posts: 1116
This run probably should obsolete the Ending H run for any% category, but I do think the Ending H run is pretty unique for its insane RNG manipulation that makes scissorman go away immediately in the garage. It would be great if an all endings run is ever made.
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(781)
Joined: 10/19/2013
Posts: 1116
Koh1fds wrote:
It requires that jumping-whipping trick to land one block higher than usual? I'm pretty sure jumping-whipping trick doesn't work in FDS version
That explains a lot. It's not even possible to jump across the pit east of Aljiba. :(
Koh1fds wrote:
Also in FDS version you can open inventory at Dracula fight and use garlic on him. If i remember correctly you can't do that in US version
Yes, garlic disappears when you enter the final boss room in NES version. Using garlic on Dracula can end the inputs early, but it's not that much of a time save though.
After testing various wrong warps on FDS version, I think it's safe to come to the conclusion that they work the same in both versions. The glitched room is likely to be the result of the disk loading system. The player is asked to switch between two disks in certain loading zones. The maps of Rover Mansion and Laruba Mansion are stored in different disks. When the wrong warp is performed in Rover Mansion, the game is forced to load a map that is not stored in the current disk and therefore sends the player to a glitched room.
Unless a way is found to perform Camilla Cemetery wrong warp (or serious memory corruption)in FDS version, it's definitely still faster to use NES version.
Actually, it sounds like a good idea to abuse the save system to warp back to Jova from Rover Mansion! The password system on NES version technically works the same, but using passwords is somewhat controversial. The biggest issue in this case would be collecting enough hearts before getting to Ondol to buy Morning Star since the player looses all hearts after getting a game over.
Editor, Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Experienced player
(781)
Joined: 10/19/2013
Posts: 1116
Link to video
Messed with FDS version a little bit. This one is pretty neat.
This alone is probably not enough to make it faster to use FDS version due to the long loading times in this version though.
Edit: I couldn't get on the top of the left wall of Camilla Cemetary. Could someone please take a try?
It still looks like this.