The glitch is that at certain positions if I shoot on the earliest possible frame all the time every other shot is a blank, I loose a supermissile but i doesn't actually leave the armcannon (I think it exists for 1 frame and then disperses for some reason.)
Speaking of realtime, that glitch then you enter the pause screen but go through a door just before it finishes and the screen stays completly black. Would that reduce lag since it wouldn't load the graphics for the room?
All the graphics and everything is still loaded. The only difference is that the brightness of the SNES is set to 0 - this is how the fade-out to the pause screen is done. It is completely unrelated to the fade-out between rooms. The fade-out between rooms is done by manually changing almost every individual color every frame during the fade-out. Which causes a good deal of unavoidable lag, as it's doing a bunch of math with the color intensities.
Greyout glitch is triggering the x-ray scope and reserve tanks at the same time, and letting the reserve tanks finish while the x-ray scope is still running. I've only done it by getting hit while inside a door, that might be the only way to do it. It completely messes up layer 3. And makes the x-ray scope actually work at a good speed o_O. This causes some really bizarre graphic effects when you use power bombs (and it affects how they hit stuff too), and certain combinations of power bombs and crystal flashes can cause some other strange effects (Permanent power bomb explosion that never goes away, for one. I've triggered a crystal flash during a crystal flash too, though I had to set my max energy to below 50).
X-ray shield requires the greyout glitch is on and there's some requirement about the room's Layer 2 that I forget, but it works in most rooms (Not Mother Brain's room though... I was hoping it would mess up her last attack but it won't even trigger in her room). Turn on the x-ray scope, switch off of it, then turn the scope off and immediately hold run again. It'll make a column of light that you can kinda control. As far as I know it has no effect on anything.
kwinse wrote:
Kejardon wrote:
Kriole wrote:
Samus is damaged by a Rinka in the opening.
That's a script action; no damage.
... it just dawned on me I know way too much about SM.
Hero, I'm pretty damn sure he only made that video today. You could say the exact same thing about Kejardon or myself even
Hey, leave me out of this, I'm not a speedrunner! :P
The only thing I've intentionally kept secret was the MB skip. I know a plethora of other glitches, but that doesn't mean I know any useful ones. ... Unless they're actually useful and I just don't know it. <_<
Hey, maybe someone will find a use for my greyout glitch or x-ray scope shield!
kwinse wrote:
Kejardon wrote:
Kriole wrote:
Samus is damaged by a Rinka in the opening.
That's a script action; no damage.
... it just dawned on me I know way too much about SM.
Make sure the ghost is dead and currently leaving a powerup, go to the corridor that lead in, do a crystal flash, jump into the next corridor above you, roll out onto the robot.
::watches::
Huh. Never seen that glitch triggered that way.
Samus's pose has an animation index. The animation index is sometimes used to give a single pose multiple subposes - it's used by the grapple beam to rotate Samus, but it's always directly set instead of any sort of continued progression from frame to frame. It's also used by Samus's kneeling poses during the Mother Brain fight, although I haven't looked into how that works exactly.
What happens in a few cases is that these direct accesses to the animation index will happen when Samus isn't in the actual pose she's supposed to be in, and the resulting animation index is often out of bounds. Hello garbage data.
On the plus side, this glitch is mostly graphical. Although it may try to interpret around 180,000 bytes of data as sprites per frame. This tends to go not so well for lag and on-screen graphics.
I don't know of any use for that kind of glitch, but I also don't know for sure there *isn't* any use.
kwinse wrote:
Kejardon wrote:
Kriole wrote:
Samus is damaged by a Rinka in the opening.
That's a script action; no damage.
... it just dawned on me I know way too much about SM.
It's not fast (Crystal Flash followed by X-ray climbing up a screen), but it's faster than the statue, I think. Everything else ignored it'd probably be worth it.
However, I think it's been considered already and was too slow, since you have to get grapple beam and x-ray scope before Phantoon, and both of those are better to get later (Plasma for Crocamire, space jump for X-ray). Not to mention the waste of ammo for the crystal flash. I don't know what the current route for 100% is, but I doubt it'll work well for skipping the statue.
Kejardon wrote:
Well, if you don't mind the game mercilessly laughing at your futile efforts. <_<
kwinse wrote:
Kejardon wrote:
Kriole wrote:
Samus is damaged by a Rinka in the opening.
That's a script action; no damage.
... it just dawned on me I know way too much about SM.
technically, certain rooms could allow you to hit lower doors on any particular right edge by firing to the left. The setup required for it is very particular though, and probably doesn't exist in the game. I haven't looked to see if any are even possible, let alone useful.
It's part of how the block lookup overflows when the beam reaches outside of the room. To the right simply starts over to the left side of the room but shifts it down a row. To the left acts like going right 255 screens, and you have to crunch some numbers and room values to figure out exactly what blocks you're going to hit.
kwinse wrote:
Kejardon wrote:
Kriole wrote:
Samus is damaged by a Rinka in the opening.
That's a script action; no damage.
... it just dawned on me I know way too much about SM.
And a random idea here, shooting those green pirates after diagonal room in Crateria made their hitboxes bigger allowing to take a damage boost earlier thus saving frames, is this considered to be used elsewhere too? Now I'm thinking of that pink brinstar pipe bug, maybe if it exploding (the explosion) would have a bigger hitbox it might be useful for a frame or two?
The space pirates make use of multiple hitboxes. This is fairly unusual, the main enemies that actually use multiple hitboxes are bosses (Draygon is pretty noticeable, as the section you attack doesn't hurt you).
kwinse wrote:
Kejardon wrote:
Kriole wrote:
Samus is damaged by a Rinka in the opening.
That's a script action; no damage.
... it just dawned on me I know way too much about SM.
I disagree. Would you also say that Beethoven never created anything, as he was just playing around with notes?
Any kind of creation, artistically or otherwise, is based on previous works. Even just combining previous works in a clever way can be a noteworthy achievement. That's what enables a society to evolve.
There's a line where on one side you have a 'creation' that really isn't anything new, and on the other side you have a 'creation' that really deserves to be called something new. Opinions differ as to where exactly that line is drawn.
As for speedrunning Super Metroid, the community already has the same general goal. There is only a handful of 'perfect' possibilities, and everyone is striving for them; there is little room for style, which I would consider a significant part of a creation.
An actual creation would be stuff like JXQ's run with the 5-player input. The goal of entertaining has an extraordinarily huge range of possibilities, and you can't really define a perfect entertainment. Each person is likely to have unique goals to accomplish, and the ideal targets everyone works for don't converge. There's style.
kwinse wrote:
Kejardon wrote:
Kriole wrote:
Samus is damaged by a Rinka in the opening.
That's a script action; no damage.
... it just dawned on me I know way too much about SM.
why exactly can't a super missile go through a gate if it's on the left side as easily as if it was on the right side? is there something special about hitboxes or something?
Firing up and left gets a big boost to position. There is not reason for firing up and left to have a big boost in position, it just does.
My 2c on Saturn:
I rarely ever think of tricks in the game as belonging to anyone, except maybe Nintendo. Even if they never know about them. We're just playing around with their engine, we're not actually creating anything ourselves.
Because of that, I don't see the point of keeping this sort of thing secret until publication. But if you really want to insist on keeping it secret, then go the whole way and don't even mention or suggest that any of it exists till you're done. If someone else publishes something you used, too bad. That's just more reason to finish your run sooner.
And since I have nothing else constructive to say about the issue, I'm not going to talk about it again.
Edit: yay misplaced paragraphs
kwinse wrote:
Kejardon wrote:
Kriole wrote:
Samus is damaged by a Rinka in the opening.
That's a script action; no damage.
... it just dawned on me I know way too much about SM.
The run I saw looked more like someone played it by hand, and used re-records to execute the glitches. The overall quality of play was not even up to time runner standards of precision.
That's very right indeed. It is halfassisted, no slowdown and savestates only IIRC.
I'd like to see YOU come up with utterly insane task to accomplish, and then actually figure out a way to accomplish that task within a few months. And then record the movie when you intend to present it within a week. During finals week of college. :P
Seriously though, not everything has to be a speed run.
kwinse wrote:
Kejardon wrote:
Kriole wrote:
Samus is damaged by a Rinka in the opening.
That's a script action; no damage.
... it just dawned on me I know way too much about SM.
There are technically 32 different slopes. 6 are just normal blocks, about 8 are completely unused, about 3 or 4 have invalid data, about 8 exist but are completely unused, and there are about 8 that are the slope blocks that exist in Super Metroid that you'd think of slope blocks.
There are 2 blocks for a 60 degree slope, 2 blocks for a 30 degree slope, 1 block for a 45 degree slope, 2 blocks for a sort of off-set 45 degree slope, and 1 block for a 'slope' that is actually more of a staircase.
You can also flip all the slopes.
kwinse wrote:
Kejardon wrote:
Kriole wrote:
Samus is damaged by a Rinka in the opening.
That's a script action; no damage.
... it just dawned on me I know way too much about SM.
- sacrifice a goat to the almighty Kejardon so he might bless us with disassembled knowledge ;)
actually, I prefer homework solutions over goats.
Unless you mean these kinds of goats. ;)
Anyways, if you want, I'll work out a formula for arm-pumpability on slopes when I get the time. But really, I'm pretty sure it's about what you'd expect it to be - slopes are approximated by pixelized paths rather than a strict slope, and Samus can only armpump when the path is two horizontal pixels in a row. Which would depend virtually entirely on Samus's pixel position (i.e. ignoring block and sub-pixel position).
kwinse wrote:
Kejardon wrote:
Kriole wrote:
Samus is damaged by a Rinka in the opening.
That's a script action; no damage.
... it just dawned on me I know way too much about SM.
You know you can just watch the RNG number, right?
Generally, it's only frame dependent. Things like item drops and a few enemies' actions (Gold Space Pirates, many bosses) also reroll the RNG though.
kwinse wrote:
Kejardon wrote:
Kriole wrote:
Samus is damaged by a Rinka in the opening.
That's a script action; no damage.
... it just dawned on me I know way too much about SM.
Don't know. A quick glance at some offsets didn't tell me anything useful, and I don't really have the motivation to hunt down a small sound bug.
I can tell you that the gameplay engine correctly gave the sound engine the command to play the low health alarm (before the movie even started, I think), but I don't know what caused the sound engine to wait a while before playing it.
kwinse wrote:
Kejardon wrote:
Kriole wrote:
Samus is damaged by a Rinka in the opening.
That's a script action; no damage.
... it just dawned on me I know way too much about SM.
The latter. IMO, the former is bad game design, and should be avoided as much as feasible.
A good game should be detailed and flexible enough so that it is virtually impossible to do the *exact* same thing twice. Hardcoded caps and such make that easier to happen.
though that should be balanced with being able to do roughly the same thing twice relatively easily. Super Metroid already does this pretty well overall, one reason why I like it. :)
kwinse wrote:
Kejardon wrote:
Kriole wrote:
Samus is damaged by a Rinka in the opening.
That's a script action; no damage.
... it just dawned on me I know way too much about SM.
I didn't remove the speed cap, I made a new physics engine.
The new physics engine has no theoretical speed cap, only practical speed caps because it's just too difficult to get excessively high speeds. Unless you're using slowdown and savestates.
It won't be nearly as abusable as you're thinking, though. For one, you don't even know what the physics engine is for yet.
kwinse wrote:
Kejardon wrote:
Kriole wrote:
Samus is damaged by a Rinka in the opening.
That's a script action; no damage.
... it just dawned on me I know way too much about SM.
I've gotten Samus up to 28 ppf in Insanity, but I don't know of any way to get her faster than 15 ppf (max super jump speed) in the original, and never past 10 ppf (max running speed) and still able to fire. Arm pumping doesn't even count as an additional 1 ppf for the purposes of firing projectiles.
24 ppf was a very rough guess, I'd have to look at the room and do some calculations to get an exact speed. But it's so far away from any speeds I've seen in the original game that it doesn't matter too much what it is, it's still too big.
kwinse wrote:
Kejardon wrote:
Kriole wrote:
Samus is damaged by a Rinka in the opening.
That's a script action; no damage.
... it just dawned on me I know way too much about SM.
It's funny how you use the word impossible from the beginning of this little battle, and a lot of time, it is proven possible.
Could you please stop discouraging people and let them try for them self. That's just boring, and you do exactly the contrary of what a community is supposed to be.
Normally, I'd agree, but when you get to a specific enough case, it becomes feasible enough to label something as impossible.
In this case (with the super missile shot horizontally through the gate), it IS impossible unless you can get Samus's speed to around 24 pixels a frame when firing from the far left of the small open area before the gate or some other absurdly improbable thing.
If you ever manage to get a super missile through that gate horizontally, it'll require something new that would have far more significant implications than opening that gate from the wrong side.
Labeling something as impossible can also save people from wasting time trying to do something that is guaranteed to fail, and give people more time try other things that actually might succeed.
And if Saturn is in fact Taco, I'm going to have to yell at him for stealing my trick.
kwinse wrote:
Kejardon wrote:
Kriole wrote:
Samus is damaged by a Rinka in the opening.
That's a script action; no damage.
... it just dawned on me I know way too much about SM.
Long story short, the code that checks if Samus's health is 0 IS NOT RUN while pausing the screen. Pausing the screen is considered a different game mode than normal gameplay, and the death animation is a different game mode too. For some reason, the check to kill Samus is only in the normal gameplay mode, I think.
kwinse wrote:
Kejardon wrote:
Kriole wrote:
Samus is damaged by a Rinka in the opening.
That's a script action; no damage.
... it just dawned on me I know way too much about SM.
Just Press Fire
Or for more fun, give yourself a super jump charge and follow your shot (7E0A6802)
There is technically additional collision detection for super missiles that try to go through walls. Long story short, it just really doesn't do anything, fast super missiles go through walls anyways despite the fact it seems to hit the wall.
Unless you can get enough speed to go through two blocks, or to go through at a diagonal, it's not going to do any good.
kwinse wrote:
Kejardon wrote:
Kriole wrote:
Samus is damaged by a Rinka in the opening.
That's a script action; no damage.
... it just dawned on me I know way too much about SM.
You realise that I shown this in the 100% speed route movie I made
Haha.. I only noticed that movie right now. >_< I don't check that topic often.
That trick has been found independently a few times. The first person to tell me of it (via AIM, IIRC) is the one listed in m3.c. That was probably ~6 years ago, and he supplied a zmv of it as well, though that's probably lost by now.
m3.c wrote:
"Save Game while Dying" by GODALMIGHTY
... Yeah, he took it a step further. That particular implementation was a Bad Idea(tm), by the way.
kwinse wrote:
Kejardon wrote:
Kriole wrote:
Samus is damaged by a Rinka in the opening.
That's a script action; no damage.
... it just dawned on me I know way too much about SM.
Sort of, as in 'That'd be fun to do'. I have too much other stuff to do to actually plan such a run though. And aside from that, there are so many interesting things to do that take a *long* time to set up or crash the game or require restarts or even ruin save files (i.e. saving the game with 00 energy). It'd probably be much better as an avi of many short clips or something.
That is by far the most extreme, somewhat-applicable glitch I can think of for Super Metroid too. Nothing else would match it, the closest thing I can think of is Mother Brain's 'aim-bot cheating' which I posted earlier.
The double-crystal flash is pretty neat too, but pulling it off without cheating might be impossible.
Saturn wrote:
I want more of such Puzzles!
Maybe I should restart the puzzle thread on M2K2... :P I don't have any plans for that at the moment though.
kwinse wrote:
Kejardon wrote:
Kriole wrote:
Samus is damaged by a Rinka in the opening.
That's a script action; no damage.
... it just dawned on me I know way too much about SM.
