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Posted: 4/15/2013 6:21 AM

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Kirkq

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (208)

Joined: 7/7/2006
Posts: 798
Location: US

If anyone wanted to test getting GV Witch Switch jiggy with no witch switch AND no shock pad, that would save some time in the run. It may be possible, but I'm not really having any luck. It would most likely be a backflip ground pound setup or a glitchy talon trot jump off a seam. I can get neither.

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Posted: 4/7/2013 10:17 PM

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Kirkq

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (208)

Joined: 7/7/2006
Posts: 798
Location: US

lol? http://www.twitch.tv/anatomyz/c/2020690 Don't know why you're leaving us a video that isn't the current console record.

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Posted: 4/2/2013 4:01 AM

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Kirkq

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (208)

Joined: 7/7/2006
Posts: 798
Location: US

You didn't even optimize this? Ouch. Hold B and shoot before you get to the window. Worst 13 seconds of my life.

TASVideoAgent wrote:

Does not die very hard

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Posted: 3/4/2013 11:16 PM

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Kirkq

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (208)

Joined: 7/7/2006
Posts: 798
Location: US

I wasn't aware of RNG emulation issues. Most of my testing has been on mupen, but most of my experience is on console. In Mupen while in battle I think the RNG cycles if you walk a certain distance or a certain amount of time passes (around a second). I don't trust my memory fully on this one though. Present the information however you want, I'm just asking questions I'm curious about.

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Posted: 3/4/2013 10:48 PM

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Kirkq

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (208)

Joined: 7/7/2006
Posts: 798
Location: US

I agree with the fact that there are two types of magic attack failures for spells like weakness. Sometimes it fails and gives an MP exp and sometimes it fails and does not give MP exp. I still wonder if escape is dependent on enemy agility levels, as my cast success doesn't feel even close to 55% :( Does the chance of getting an item go up if you fight 1 hell hound vs 4 hell hounds? Have you looked into the formula for how spell damage is affected by other elements? It's something like rock damage = N*earth + (N/2)*fire + (N/2)*water + (N/4)*wind. It's probably a little more complicated than that though.

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Posted: 2/26/2013 7:56 PM
(Edited: 3/4/2013 10:54 PM)

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Kirkq

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (208)

Joined: 7/7/2006
Posts: 798
Location: US

I still question your methodology. Solvaring's "Earth Spikes" can definitely Miss and you give it a 100% accuracy, and then you give other attacks a 90% accuracy, which just seems like numbers you are pulling out of your ass because I'm fairly confident the Miss chance is agility dependent. You have 90% accuracy on Magic Barrier and 90% accuracy on Confusion. From my experiences Confusion barely ever misses, which is less often than magic barrier. Also from a coding standpoint 15/16 chance = 93.75% makes way more sense than 90% = 231/256. (EDIT: Maybe this is wrong?) From my experiences, Escape has around a 1/3 = 33% chance of working. You give it 55%. From experience this seems to go up with agility level? (EDIT: ?) ~~I think you might have some useful information in your FAQ, but your methodology is unexplained and perhaps inaccurate in some spots.~~

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Posted: 2/10/2013 6:09 AM
(Edited: 8/24/2014 2:30 AM)

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Kirkq

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (208)

Joined: 7/7/2006
Posts: 798
Location: US

My route idea: (Get all 5 mumbo tokens, 10 jiggies, 100 notes, no honeycombs) 1: Near Hill: Collect notes at 'B', the jiggy at 'D' and notes at 'C'

2: Ground Pound, smash the back left two huts and collect all of the notes. 3: Termite Hill, Mumbo Token/Notes, (THERE'S A SMALL CHANCE WE WANT THIS EXTRA LIFE, NEED TO COUNT DEATHS), kill the termite at the bottom of the hill at a very specific angle to set up the Conga orange pad jiggy to bounce correctly on top of the Conga eggs jiggy. Get notes towards talon trot. 4: Talon Trot - A: Get Talon Trot, (roll to?) Jiggy, Mumbo Token, talon trot jump from jiggy platform to ruins, Notes, Orange Jinjo ~~- B: Get Talon Trot, Notes, Orange Jinjo, Jiggy, Mumbo Token~~ 5: Far Hill: Everything on the way down to Conga - A: Orange Jinjo, BACDEI,GFH ~~- B: Mumbo Token, CDABEI,GFH~~

6: Some combination of Conga oranges and eggs and witch switch. - I think this one is fastest, 3 orange pads/grab orange off tree in some order. Flap towards chimpy, give orange to Chimpy and grab jiggy during spawn, talon trot jump, get eggs, shoot conga 3 times while progressing towards mumbo token/witch switch and maybe taking a damage? Ground pound witch switch, grab conga egg jiggy, damage cancel conga orange pad jiggy. For reference: - After Conga jiggy, hitting the last orange pad and getting the jiggy takes about 8 seconds. Taking a damage elsewhere randomly takes about 1.25 seconds. = 9.25 seconds. - Hitting the last orange pad early takes about 1.5 seconds or less, the jiggy spawning animation is about 3 seconds, we wait about 2 seconds for the orange after the conga jiggy, taking damage takes about 1.25 seconds. = 7.75 seconds 6: Do all 3 Conga Orange pads. Have the jiggy bounce on top of where the Conga eggs jiggy will go, do not get the jiggy yet. Grab the orange on the tree. Flap towards chimpy, give orange to Chimpy and grab jiggy during spawn, talon trot jump onto the ledge. Go learn eggs from bottles. Shoot conga 3 times while progressing towards mumbo token/witch switch and maybe taking a damage? Ground pound witch switch, grab both conga jiggies at the same time, eliminating one animation. ------- (Take 2 damage somewhere after talking to bottles for eggs.) 7: Bridge Notes, blue jinjo, talon trot dive into water for notes. 8: Near Hill: A, mumbo token, G (jinjo), H, E, F

9-1: If juju's head is facing correctly, shoot eggs from the very edge of unbroken huts if able. Not having to wait for the jiggy to spawn would be really helpful. 9-2: Break 2 huts from right to left, grab green jinjo, break 3rd hut on left, go back to grab jinjo jiggy and damage cancel. Finish feeding Juju, Mumbo Token, jump, beak, backflip, get Mumbo's Skull eye jiggy. Break last hut in back right corner and damage cancel jiggy 10. -------- (Take 2 damage somewhere after talking to bottles for eggs.) 11: Mumbo's hut notes and die back to beginning off a torch. (EDIT: Dying into mumbo's text with 5 mumbo tokens skips mumbo text later.) I really believe this will provide the fastest route. Double jiggy is just not worth it because you're going to spend too much time going out of your way to get to termite hill later. That by itself cancels out the gains. I did put a lot of thought into this in the past, I just never posted it.

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Posted: 2/3/2013 5:11 PM

Post subject: Re: Die Hard

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Kirkq

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (208)

Joined: 7/7/2006
Posts: 798
Location: US

Cigawoot wrote:

Has anyone ever considered creating a TAS of Die Hard, as made famous by Kirkq during AGDQ 2013?

I have considered creating a TAS of Die Hard, as made famous by Kirkq during AGDQ 2013. I had plans on doing this eventually but I ran into some problems optimizing where crooks are at. I didn't want to throw together something mediocre and kill the hype. - Fact: If you die and have health remaining (through hacking or presumably an undiscovered glitch), the game thinks you win. - Fact: Holding left for 2 frames and right for two frames repeatedly will cause your character to cycle through all the sprites in the game. I think this is only a graphical change, and it stops once you stop the pattern. - Side Note: There's a dumb debug code in the game to run down the timer, which I don't approve of. Here's my lua script which displays some useful addresses and lists some random stuff in memory.

--Many values are copied into 4  locations
--0x0000
--0x0800
--0x1000
--0x1800


--0x003B -- changes from 1 to 2  every 3 frames when not loading
local CameraOffsetX = 0x0044  --from character
local CameraOffsetY = 0x0045
-- 0x0046 enemy X rounded to a multiple of 16 --this holds one guy sometimes?
-- 0x0047 enemy Y rounded to a multiple of 16  --start on reg floor
local SlowIncPosX = 0x0048  --character value related to above
local SlowIncPosY = 0x0049

local Floor = 0x0065
--0x006A = randomtimer
local CameraX = 0x006F
local CameraY = 0x0070
--0x0071 = new direction press
--0x0073 = counter
--0x0074 = buffercounter
--0x0077 -- = count by 3 to 256 not pause
local CharX = 0x00A1
local CharY = 0x00A3  --there is another value similar to this in memory

local LifeDiff = 0x00A6
local Crooks = 0x00AB
local Life = 0x00AC
local Lock = 0x00AD
local TimerFrames = 0x00AE
local Seconds = 0x00AF
local Minutes = 0x00B0

--0x00CD --west elevator open
--0x00CE --west elevator open

--0x0205 -- character animation glitch.  Contains sprite ID, generally of top half

--0x04AA = direction change
--0x04AD = direction facing
--0x04B8 = character sprite?

--0x048F floor
--0x0497 floor
--0x0498 floor

-----------------------------------

--0x04D9 = charX
--0x04DB through 0x04E0 or so = Crook X positions --this floor only
--It appears there are slots for 6 enemies

--green guy right next to me = 04DB
--blue guy = 04DC tends east
--blue guy = 04DD tends southeast
--blue guy outside the door = 04DE
--karl = 04DF
--blue guy down the hall = 4E0

--Karl can be shot out the window
--Can push final boss
--Final Boss 04DA

--X is 16 and 30 for north elevator
--X is 32 for west elevator


--------------------------------

--0x051B = CharY
--0x051C through 0x0522 or so = Crook Y positions --this floor only

--0x06EA  --this may be related to how enemy positions are stored

local Axe = 0x0772
local Pistol = 0x077A
local SMGA = 0x077B --current
local SMGB = 0x077C --num backups
local C4 = 0x077D
local Flash = 0x077E

local FeetUnit = 0x0797
--Foot power gets drained every 12 frames
--Running 6 frames then walking 6 only drains foot power as if you were walking, but you move faster than walking speed.
--Running 6 frames then stopping 6 does not drain foot power.
--Loading glass on screen can trigger a -8
local Feet = 0x0798 --8 feet bad, 0 feet good

--1006 = music

local FeetCurr = 0
local FeetDiff = 0

while true do

if (FeetCurr - memory.readbyte(FeetUnit)) < 0 then
FeetDiff = FeetCurr - memory.readbyte(FeetUnit)
end
FeetCurr = memory.readbyte(FeetUnit)


gui.text(0,10,"Feet: " .. memory.readbyte(Feet))
gui.text(35,10," " .. memory.readbyte(FeetUnit))
gui.text(75,10," " .. FeetDiff)
gui.text(0,20,"Pistol: " .. memory.readbyte(Pistol))
gui.text(0,30,"SMG: " .. memory.readbyte(SMGB) .. "  ")
gui.text(0,40,"Flash: " .. memory.readbyte(Flash))
gui.text(40,30, memory.readbyte(SMGA))
gui.text(233,0, memory.readbyte(Life))
gui.text(0,0, "Crooks " .. memory.readbyte(Crooks))

gui.text(0,50, "Time " .. memory.readbyte(Minutes) .. "  ")
gui.text(35,50, memory.readbyte(Seconds) .. " ")
gui.text(50,50, memory.readbyte(TimerFrames))

gui.text(0,60, "X " .. memory.readbyte(CharX))
gui.text(0,70, "Y " .. memory.readbyte(CharY))

--memory.writebyte(CharY,190)
--memory.writebyte(Life,15)
--memory.writebyte(Feet,1)
FCEU.frameadvance();
end

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Posted: 1/27/2013 5:01 PM

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Kirkq

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (208)

Joined: 7/7/2006
Posts: 798
Location: US

Good improvements! =)

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Posted: 1/18/2013 5:38 AM
(Edited: 1/18/2013 7:52 PM)

Quote

Kirkq

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (208)

Joined: 7/7/2006
Posts: 798
Location: US

Replicating someone's glitch doesn't imply knowledge of game mechanics or understanding of programming. Anyone can pick up a game; it doesn't automatically imply your posts are useful. To my best understanding here is what may be happening: 1: Completing a trophy race in time trials turns the pictures for that world into Taj's face. 2: Opening Future Fun Land adds a new row to the bottom time trials. These two facts create a sort of "game state" while in time trials. Getting out into the "Time Trials World" has these events completed while having the new game state loaded. It's not exactly "copying a file." It's loading the state of time trials mode as was initialized by the completion file. Worth discussion.

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Posted: 1/18/2013 4:27 AM

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Kirkq

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (208)

Joined: 7/7/2006
Posts: 798
Location: US

Would this glitch be able to be executed with just Drumstick unlocked and Hot Top Volcano unlocked in the tracks menu? Is it required to have a file with future fun land unlocked or not?

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Posted: 12/31/2012 12:48 AM
(Edited: 12/31/2012 3:01 AM)

Quote

Kirkq

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (208)

Joined: 7/7/2006
Posts: 798
Location: US

If anyone knows anything about the positions of Conga's jiggies (the orange switches, and shooting him with eggs.), please speak up. I have no idea what changes the spawn positions. If we can get them to spawn on top of each other it may save a few seconds. The current plan is to basically do something similar to what stiv does there. ----- EDIT: Here are some videos/speculation. This guy's conclusions are not well supported at all, but he seems to have randomly replicated it more than most of us by deviating from normal speedrun routes. I can't really support bkDJ's "set at beginning of level" conclusion right now either, there is nothing convincing me that it is true. The jiggy almost always goes one way, and once in a great while it goes another. https://www.youtube.com/watch?&v=JdDM0OlIuww https://www.youtube.com/watch?&v=u8hlXhcR5xk http://forum.speeddemosarchive.com/post/banjokazooie_100_pal301.html ----- - I miscounted notes in GV at some point, it's 93 that are possible now with bee. - BGS is 94 notes possible with no crocodile. - All other worlds 100 are possible with the form we enter as (Banjo/Bee) - Jiggies - Sandcastle jiggy and slider puzzle jiggy were the last two jiggies to be deleted, so jiggies are finalized for now. - Mumbo Tokens - are just about finalized, depends on whether we get a couple specific patches of notes. - Notes - are almost finalized. For now it is certain that we will be getting 100 notes, 5 Mumbo Tokens, and all jiggies associated with MM. All the notes in MM are really fast compared to some later in the game. bkDJ: I don't see red feathers being that scarce in any% at all. In 100% yeah definitely. We use them in any% in TTC, FP, and to get the FP witch switch jiggy and go OoB through the 450 note door. Those are the only spots I can think of. (We don't go to CCW Winter.) I'll do a thorough write-up on notes once we have made up our minds on the last few to discard.

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Posted: 12/30/2012 12:16 AM

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Kirkq

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (208)

Joined: 7/7/2006
Posts: 798
Location: US

You got me. NTSC version.

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Posted: 12/22/2012 3:07 AM

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Kirkq

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (208)

Joined: 7/7/2006
Posts: 798
Location: US

Fun fact we learned today. Casting rock shower against 4+ skelebats seems to always crash the game.

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Posted: 12/4/2012 5:36 PM

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Kirkq

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (208)

Joined: 7/7/2006
Posts: 798
Location: US

FractalFusion wrote:

According to people in our community, Desert Bus is entertaining.

The Desert Bus TAS cracks me up every time I'm reminded of its existence. =)

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Posted: 11/18/2012 2:03 PM

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Kirkq

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (208)

Joined: 7/7/2006
Posts: 798
Location: US

To add: Since savestating is so suboptimal, I would create a savestate every 100 or so frames, then start a counter. When the frame is reached, reload the savestate and use the counter to advance frames until the button needs pressed, then start again. This should make the program run magnitudes faster.

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Posted: 10/27/2012 4:14 AM

Quote

Kirkq

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (208)

Joined: 7/7/2006
Posts: 798
Location: US

How does one normally beat this game, and what glitch or method is being used to beat it faster? It's not clear.

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Posted: 10/15/2012 11:15 PM

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Kirkq

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (208)

Joined: 7/7/2006
Posts: 798
Location: US

Pausing does something weird to banjo's movement oscillation. It's extremely minor, but if harnessed, this might be enough to make the Clanker's Cavern puzzle jump. I'm trying to make sense out of it.

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Posted: 10/14/2012 5:23 PM
(Edited: 10/14/2012 5:36 PM)

Quote

Kirkq

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (208)

Joined: 7/7/2006
Posts: 798
Location: US

(EDIT: Ringrush) had the idea to use a talon trot "skid" to rejump and get to the Clanker's Cavern puzzle portrait to open the world early without shock jump. This should save a bit of time in 100% if possible. I got within about 1 frame of making the jump successful, but it's extremely tedious to perfect. I feel like it should be possible with a perfect angle. I theorize that you need to initiate the rejump between about 636 and 645 Z coordinates. The angle you're facing is really important, and the spinning camera makes this terribly difficult to optimize. There are two different frames on which you can beak with promising results, I would try both of them. If you jump from closer to the door you'll have a higher Z coordinate. If you jump from further from the door, you'll have slightly less X and Y distance to cover. The height of the platform is 700, I believe you can beak up there as long as you're above about 660 Z height. This is one of my better attempts: http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?m8iiaz7igz0zax2 -------------------------------------------------- Cronikeys also had the idea to get OoB after filling in the Click Clock Wood puzzle to open the world. This would warp you back to the pipe in the room with the 180 note door, saving about 15 seconds. If you can jump high enough to land on the cut branch on the tree near where I jump in the following video, you can easily get out of bounds over the top. Again, I was just short of getting enough height to do so. Here's my best attempt: http://www.mediafire.com/?sap47r1b6gzahzu --------------------------------------------------- Memory Addresses: XPosition: 00C67C98 ZPosition: 00C67C9C YPosition: 00C67CA0 XVelocity: 00C67CB8 YVelocity: 00C67CC0 ZVelocity: 00C67CEC JiggyAmount1: 00C71A48 (for reference) JiggyAmount2: 00C71A5C (for reference)

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Posted: 9/26/2012 3:23 AM

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Kirkq

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (208)

Joined: 7/7/2006
Posts: 798
Location: US

Requesting continuance of SNES Magical Pop'n (J) by Kirkq (2 levels completed out of 6) I may try to hex the gameplay into a better emulator, but if it doesn't work well I have no intentions of restarting.

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Posted: 9/18/2012 12:48 PM

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Kirkq

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (208)

Joined: 7/7/2006
Posts: 798
Location: US

Mupen savestate at the point in question: http://www.mediafire.com/?x0wbrnrsr7xccn7 Savestates that can be used with Sami's movie to hop around the game quickly: http://www.mediafire.com/?79pm2ua25mn1q0w I tried for quite a while to make this work. In order to get out of bounds and beaking you have to have momentum away from the door. This makes it seemingly improbable to get under where you'd want to ground pound. I don't think I was able to get quite high enough to get back up through the floor even if I was under it. Something in the setup needs to be changed to make this feasible.

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Posted: 9/9/2012 12:59 PM

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Kirkq

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (208)

Joined: 7/7/2006
Posts: 798
Location: US

4. The Japanese version has some rupee locations missing. Notably the "101 rupee trick" does not work because...they're not there. There are also not any pots around some of the triforce chart locations (e.g. islet of steel).

This loses maybe 2 minutes due to different rupee collection routes.

5. Triforce chart 5 is not what is pulled up after sinking the golden ship, instead treasure chart 16 is obtained and it goes through a chain of charts to get the triforce chart itself (it goes 16 (shark island) to 28 (needle rock) to 3 (eastern fairy island) to 40 (headstone) where TC5 is gotten).

This loses probably about 4 minutes due to extra superswimming. It also changes the order in which we do things towards the end of the game pretty substantially.

6. The cutscene for cutting down the barrier happens automatically on Japanese, on English it needs to be manually started by swinging the sword. (I played English for the first time in a while and ran straight into the barrier lol)

Once you can have all the triforce shards and have beaten both temples on (J), the barrier cutscene can be skipped. This saves about 15-20 seconds. The (J) version is a little over 5 minutes slower in non-cutscene time. The (J) version is probably 12-15 minutes faster in cutscene time. (It is unclear how many cutscenes we can skip with storage right now.) Overall the run would be about 7-10 minutes faster. The major route difference is the aforementioned triforce chart.

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Posted: 9/7/2012 1:43 AM

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Kirkq

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (208)

Joined: 7/7/2006
Posts: 798
Location: US

The only previously known way to cause "storage" was to get Forest Water and use the expiration text 20 minutes later. Different ways of "activation" let you clip into walls, skip cutscenes, and superswim on console. Activation methods include opening a chest, text boxes, and pulling out the wind waker. We can do what used to take 20 minutes in about 3 seconds now with "dry storage". This makes it much more viable to use for smaller time savers, whereas previously it had to save over a few minutes to be useful. (Cabana Deed skip and Forbidden Woods boss key skip were the old uses to be considered. Though Cabana Deed skip can be done TAS without storage now.) The TAS will use this to clip in/around walls and skip some cutscenes. The console run can use this to superswim by locking the camera: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B5X67GPqGXM (All he does is hold up when the camera is locked.)

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Posted: 9/7/2012 12:21 AM

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Kirkq

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (208)

Joined: 7/7/2006
Posts: 798
Location: US

Since this new glitch destroys the old route, I will post the full route we had developed for the (U) version. It was going to be slightly modified to suit the (J) version, but the discovery of dry storage is going to require large route modifications anyway. Here is where we left off a bit over a month ago. TWW TAS Route WIP VERSION 2.0 Last updated: 7/22/2012 US version only. Early Game: 1: Ensure you got triforce set “3”, as it will be fastest. Jump off watchtower. 2: Superswim to Northern Fairy Isle (Get 1000 Rupee Bag) 3: Superswim, Enter nearby sub, Lantern Moblin + No Sword sends you to FF1 4: Trigger Tetra text at bottom of FF1 by stairs. Get 20-60 Rupees. (can get 10 rupees in first pot at FF1, can get 10 rupees in a pot in the second room, 40 rupees in spotlights) Beat Forsaken Fortress 1 (FF1) (You get a sword here) Zombie Hover up to a heart by the sidle ledge (GlitchesAndStuff) (gossip stone -> searchlight -> hover, deku stick + fall damage) You cannot get directly to the sword or a cutscene will occur and you fall and die. 5: Superswim around to Windfall back dock, get up to 80 rupees (1 pot by the dock, 1 up the dock behind bush, 1 pot by the sail can drop a red) 6: Buy Sail (80), (Something like this may be slightly faster to get into the water: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vMnVnyPfueA) 7: Superswim to Greatfish to trigger endless night (required to get bombs) 8: Superswim to DRI, get Wind Waker (Be aware that I haven’t planned wind changes) 9: Superswim east, get Wind Requiem (Note the spawn after DRC is just a bit west of the spawn after getting the WW.) 10: Superswim to Forest Haven, Wind Waker bag dive, fall damage zombie hover up deku tree up branch, grab leaf from below (GlitchesandStuff: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YEx9PmK0Dxk ) 11: Death from Deku Leaf should kick us back to Windfall. 12: At Windfall, (KoRL Endless Night cutscene?) Superswim?, Let Tingle Out, Password Skip with Deku Leaf, Get Bombs 13: Superswim to Dragon Roost 14a: Known Possible: Superswim to the east side of the island, zombie hover up to the kargaroc nest, deku leaf bomb drop heart drop, wind requiem at some point up until now, turn the wind WEST or SOUTHWEST and deku leaf to the high platform on the mainland right by the entrance. GlitchesAndStuff: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RJWNQ_xmzK0 (Delivery Bag Cutscene is a bit over 3 minutes on US version) 14b: Plausibly Possible (unconfirmed, extremely difficult), could be slightly faster. Lure a kargaroc from the east side of Dragon Roost Isle, zombie hover to the southwest towards the entrance, deku leaf bomb drop the kargaroc to get a heart go in DRI and skip the delivery bag. 15: (YOU MIGHT NEED TO GET KOMALI’S LETTER HERE TO TRIGGER MEDLI OUTSIDE LATER) DRC deku leaf entry, zombie hover deku leaf bomb drop the teleportation pot, or a keese, or the pot with a heart, (at the opposite door on the 2nd floor in one of the smaller pots), if death, jump in now open pot, get grapple, Boss key skip (mugg: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UPgGmYH_nUo), clear dungeon 16: Superswim to Forest Haven 17: Go in Beedle's Ship, exit, play wind requiem somewhere up to here to have the wind directed SOUTH so the boat will let you climb in, climb out of boat into mini cyclone and deku leaf into Forbidden Woods. 18: Forbidden Woods: No Forest Water, get boomerang (mugg: (uses forest water though) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E3II8YLuHEA) (cafde: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wUdUub3LqW4 ) ( Klydestorm: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DNMDp0A2eJA ) Tentative Route: Entrance -> bomb first door flower -> leaf pump to second bud then leaf pump to door -> bomb door flower -> leaf to hanging platform -> to door -> kill baba and jump up to door-> bomb door flower -> run around thorns and bomb door flower -> main room -> leaf across grapple gap -> leaf around and onto large flower, bombing warp pot on the way -> bomb self and hover to top platform -> drop bomb to cut grass for a heart then go through door -> leaf through this room and go through door -> jump across to other door -> miniboss fight, boomerang -> rang or bomb door flowers and go back to main room -> boomerang large flower and jump down -> jump down to bottom -> through door -> take passage on right to door -> ledgeclip on left near ladder and leaf to door -> miniboss2 and boss key -> Savewarp + warp pot back to main room -> boomerang door to boss -> kill the 2 enemies -> 1 cycle boss Mid Game: 1: Superswim to Bird's Peak Rock, grapple glitch, to get triforce chart (Klydestorm: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fnW-JfDVRHQ ) (60 RUPEES, See late game note) 2: Superswim to ETI, Place Farore's Pearl 3: Superswim to NTI, Place Din's Pearl 4: Superswim drown to Needle Rock Isle, get Triforce Chart (There are about 5 seconds of extraneous drowning time here, but I think this is the best time that it is possible to do this.) 5: Superswim to Outset, drown in whirlpool, shoot down door, Acquire Jabun's Pearl 6: Superswim to STI, Place Jabun's Pearl 7:* Beat Tower of the Gods (mugg: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ahqQnJMzRK4 ) -- I think it is possible to aim the bow faster by putting it away between shots. 8:* Hyrule 1: Puzzle skip via Zombie Hover is possible but not viable, then this skip can be done without double magic: ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J2VXn5f8r4g ) 9:* Superswim to FF2, wind waker dive in 10:* Fight Phantom Ganon, get Skull Hammer 11: Zombie Hover up to top, deku leaf bomb drop heart drop skulls left of door (maybe an enemy instead?) (No hearts on sidle ledge in FF2) 12:* Superswim past Helmrock, and bombs/deku leaf skip fight. (mugg: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRIyXkBbF1E ) 13:* Hyrule 2 (It is now 12:00) Late Game: 1:* Superswim from TotG to Gale Isle, learn song (Abahbob: www.youtube.com/watch?v=feLqOXHg9Kk ) 2:* Superswim clip into Mother & Child Isles with reair, get Fire and Ice arrows, (Exit: abahbob: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Szebvd6DjSk ). 3:* Superswim drown to Fire Mountain, get Power Bracelet (Zombie Hover Kargaroc heart drop?) 4:* Superswim to Ice Ring Isle, climb on island to freeze and spawn in boat, (quick skip in dungeon IIRC), melt the chest outside, jump on chest, deku leaf to get in, get Iron Boots 5:* Superswim to Headstone, learn song 6:* Superswim to Dragon Roost, get the 200 rupee chest, Get Medli 7:* Superswim to Headstone, beat Earth Temple (Boss key skip (mugg): No Double Magic: ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uY_eeO1omyM ) With Double Magic: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VL8XAUJRePY ) (Klydestorm: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aPQ7i_HYosE ) Tentative Route: first room CM(?) -> skip CM in chu room (chu in spot light first, then circle left and weave around the chest platform, taking out green chus as they pop up. Finish purple ones last) -> Medli to SH peg (maybe leaf pump?) -> key -> switch skip with bomb boost -> CM skip in block room -> take out enemies -> key backflip trick -> stalfos skip -> melt wall trick & grab Medli -> statue skip -> EGL -> melt statues -> move mirror & hit peg (left room) -> key -> skip CM in statue room -> EGL (unless song stone skip is found) -> bk skip (method avoids double magic) 8:* Superswim to Forest Haven, WW Dive in (Bag Dive?), get Makar 9:* Superswim to Gale Isle (It should hopefully by my calculations be just after 18:00 before you get into the quadrant, later is good, earlier is bad.) 10: Wind Temple: get hookshot, beat Wind Temple (mugg: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yNiJnC-kJwM ) Wind Temple: notes for muggs route: in hookshot room, use hammer on switch immediately after hookshotting the target. Tree skip room: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bFVFreUY-Bc (End has 52 RUPEES, See Note) 11: Superswim Clip into Diamond Steppe Island, ( Kirkq: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mtDaB4sPu7A ), Get Ghost Ship Chart 12: Superswim to Ghost Ship at Diamond Steppe, 2 iterations with Save and Quit, Get 620 rupees 13: Superswim to Tingle Island, Decipher Bird’s Peak Rock, Needle Rock Isle Triforce Charts 14: Superswim Clip into Islet of Steel, Get Triforce Chart (60 RUPEES, See Note) NOTE: At this point you should have nominally gathered 46 rupees (45 can work) plus the additional 200 from Dragon Roost. These extra Rupees will come from any of Bird’s Peak Rock, Islet of Steel, or the end of Wind Temple. 15: Superswim to Ghost Ship, 3 iterations with Save and Quit, Get 930 rupees, get the Triforce Chart on the last iteration. This puts you at 999 or 1000 rupees. 16: Superswim to Tingle Island, Decipher Islet of Steel and Ghost Ship Charts NOTE: After this point, ignoring anything that happened before now, you need to gather an additional 19 (or 20) rupees before the last tingle visit. 17: Superswim to Stonewatcher Island, Lift the Rock, Complete the dungeon, Get the Triforce Chart, Get 173 rupees the first time, repeat the pillar twice for 202 more rupees. 18: Upon exiting, sail to the Stonewatcher Island Triforce Shard. (1) 19: Superswim to Link's Oasis, Get ~210 rupees, Get Triforce Chart ( mugg: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pDXdt6zZTDo ) (Klydestorm: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sGmYJm9mQ4o ) 20: Superswim to Tingle Island, Decipher Link’s Oasis and Stonewatcher Island charts. 21: Superswim to Overlook Island, Hookshot inside, Complete the dungeon, Get the Triforce Chart, Get 173 rupees 22: Sail west to Seven Star Isles, get the Triforce Shard. (2) 23: Superswim inside Gale Isle, exit, get in the spawned boat, get the Triforce Shard. (3) 24: Superswim drown to Greatfish, get the Triforce Shard (4) 25: Superswim to Outset, Complete Savage Labyrinth (mugg: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8Uo0Z8uy2Y ), Get 611 rupees, Get the Triforce Chart 26: Save and Quit out of Savage Labyrinth, putting you next to the boat, jump in, Get the Triforce Shard (5) 27: Superswim to Tingle Island, Decipher Savage Labyrinth and Overlook Triforce Charts 28: Superswim drown to Two Eye Reef, Get the Triforce Shard (6) 29: Superswim drown to Cliff Plateau Isles, Get the Triforce Shard (7) 30: Superswim drown to S. Triangle Isle, , Get the Triforce Shard (8) 31:* Superswim to Tower of the Gods, (If you need the boat (unsure), just swim into TotG and exit), Hyrule 3 32:* Go through warp at TotG to Hyrule. Go downstairs, fight darknuts, break barrier. 33:* Ganon's Tower Trials Skip (get above up left door, bomb clip, deku leaf to loading zone.) 34: Light Arrows Skip? (mugg: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JGV--6dk3t4 ) (Also this room: mugg: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Y9xItPbPHA ) 35:* Puppet Ganon kill or skip via zombie hover deku leaf bomb drop heart drop keese. ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XthYgzPf7cA ) 36:* Fight Ganon. (mugg: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U5A2_ilyr7s ) 37:* GG.

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Posted: 8/10/2012 12:59 PM

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Kirkq

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Player (208)

Joined: 7/7/2006
Posts: 798
Location: US

I dislike this decision too. Put it on your own youtube/nicovideo channel and I'm sure some people will appreciate it. Good luck with MMBN3. That is one of my favorite games. :)

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