Posts for Michael_Fried

Posted: 5/28/2005 6:20 PM

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Michael_Fried

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player

Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 1107

It seems the non tool-assisted run is pretty good... only 20 secs slower. Actually the run on SDA used different timing rules, it's really about 42 seconds slower.

Posted: 5/28/2005 5:13 AM

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Michael_Fried

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player

Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 1107

I'm afraid I'll have to vote no. You won't impress me until you can juggle flaming torches, blocks are just too easy. :P Just kidding, that part was cool. Anyway, I've just seen the WIP up to Bowser's Castle so far so I'll have to watch the whole thing now, and then I'll vote. Edit: Would it be possible to start the ending faster by being a little farther right when the princess comes down so you don't have to move over to be standing next to the princess?

Posted: 5/28/2005 5:08 AM

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Michael_Fried

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player

Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 1107

Really? So let me get this straight - you think that "because people frequently use term x to describe y, z is a valid term" is a good argument? Wow. If this is the kind of quality reasoning I can expect from you, then I'm going to do my best to avoid reading any of your other posts. I thought everyone already agreed that time attack was a bad term. The only chance Arc has is if he can convince people that timeattack is a standard term, which the slashdot article clearly does not show. Also I should point out that it doesn't even show that time attack is a standard term. It was just used in 2 of the many responses, probably both by members of this site. You said it, yourself - that "people think of timeattacks and time attacks as the same thing". So do I. As such, what does it matter if I use one term or another? Did you even read this topic? The most important part of the argument against the term time attack is that it's already used for non-save state runs. Arc's argument was that timeattack was different because he removed the space and therefore won't be confused with time attack. Then I responded by saying that people think of both terms as the same thing, so calling it a timeattack will just make people think you're talking about a time attack, which makes the term timeattack confusing and a bad term. Since you apparently don't think that humans have the capacity to chose definitions based on context, I suppose you think that someone who says "hey, baby, let's me and you [insert sexual action here]" is a pedaphile? The only way to make the term timeattack not confusing because of the context would be to explain that it was made with save states. Just saying "I saw a Super Mario World timeattack" does not tell you it was made with save states. If you want to start using the term something like "save state timeattack" then I have no problem with that. I really hate to break it to you, but neither definition of "time attack" is standard knowledge. Neither is the term "speedrun". Don't believe me? Then explain this. They are in the video game community (not just a couple, but in video game forums all over the internet), just like how overworld and subscreen are standard terms in Zelda games even though they're not in the dictionary, or how lightsaber and podracing are standard Star Wars terms. However, if you pick some random video game forums and start talking about timeattacks, the vast majority of people won't know they're made with save states.

Posted: 5/28/2005 4:31 AM

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Michael_Fried

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player

Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 1107

Quote: real definition of time attack They are homonyms. One definition isn't more real than the other. What do you mean? I thought even you agreed that time attack only has one definition. The save state definition is only for timeattack, remember? See, even you confuse the terms and you were the one who came up with the idea of making things confusing.

Posted: 5/28/2005 12:06 AM

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Michael_Fried

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player

Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 1107

After all, the term time attack is a standard, too. If it wasn't a standard, why would so many people be using it? No, "time attack" is already a standard term for something else, and it's still being used to refer to the other definition much more than it is to refer to save state runs. Maybe you'd have a good point if people in that article were calling it a "timeattack." Btw, thanks for supporting my argument by providing some evidence that people think of timeattacks and time attacks as the same thing. After all the stuff Arc said about them being different, you mix them up and call a save state run a time attack. It's clear that people who agree with Arc think of both timeattacks and time attacks as being save state runs, so the argument that they won't be confused with the real definition of time attack doesn't work. Also I should point out that no matter how hard you try to spread the opinion that timeattack and time attack mean different things, this will never become standard knowledge. As for your question about why tool assisted is a standard term, I agree it may not be as standard as speedrun, but it's certainly more standard than timeattack is. The term tool assisted is older than timeattack, and everyone agrees on what it means (in reference to speedruns). It's never used to describe a run made with a hammer or something, and no one has tried to argue that people use tool assisted to describe realtime continuous runs.

Posted: 5/25/2005 7:08 AM

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Michael_Fried

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player

Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 1107

it wouldn't prove the 99.9% because a few forum users on SDA and TG aren't representative of the entire population. This is the problem with "everyone knows" statements. If you want an accurate population parameter, you'd have to make that topic on places like this forum as well where people do know the difference, not just places where you believe people will be confused by the term. In that case, the statistic will drop lower than 99.9%. You're ignoring my point. I didn't say anything about 99.9% of people being confused by the term. The 99.9% thing is just about whether timeattack and time attack mean the same thing. I visit this forum fairly often and even I had no idea until recently that Arc considered a timeattack and a time attack two different things. I always thought he considered them both to mean a save state run. In fact, as I said before Arc's site even used to refer to them as "time attacks." Then when he changed his site design, he just happened to switch it to timeattack. How was I supposed to know the reasoning behind it? I don't remember any topics about removing the space to make it different from time attack. I don't know if the rest of you realized that, but there's certainly a very small chance people from other forums would know. You're giving an example where purposely made Morimoto go around making a series of fallacious statements and included the word timeattack in there. I don't see how this helps your point. You should remember that Arc's site came after Morimoto's run, so his term is not as old those used by Doom communities and others. Why does it make a difference if Arc's site existed yet? Most people haven't read it, so timeattack is a misleading term whether or not there's a site that says what it means. My point is that if you want to go talk about a save state run somewhere, you shouldn't be using the word timeattack. I've seen people post about save state runs on forums where people haven't read Arc's site, and because they were tricked by Arc into thinking timeattack is a standard term that everyone knows just like everyone knows what a speed run is, they think that's all they need to say for people to know what it is. However, instead people think the person is talking about a time attack, and when they find out the truth, they get mad, and they should be. It's also a matter of context; there are many words that have different meanings depending on the context; for instance, the statement "time flies" can mean two different things. Show me one example of 2 words where removing the space changes the definition into exactly what people don't want the first term to be confused with. When gay is used as a noun, it can only mean one thing. If it is used as an adjective, it can vary depending on the context. This is similar to the distinction between time attack and timeattack. To say morimoto's smb3 run is a timeattack does not mean that he played it in time attack mode. People do use the non-save state definition of time attack as a noun.

Posted: 5/25/2005 4:38 AM

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Michael_Fried

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player

Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 1107

but again, you're appealing to popularity. If I think 1+1=14 and post it on three forums and get people to agree with me, it doesn't make me right. Since the videos and the sites containing the runs are now almost flooded with disclaimers, I find the use of different terms to label them at least somewhat justifiable. What are you talking about? The 99.9% thing was about how everyone except for Arc would consider timeattack and time attack to be the same thing. If I make that claim, and then I go around to different forums and find out that everyone thinks they are the same thing, then yes, I am right! There's also another point I forgot to make. Suppose Morimoto went around to hundreds of different forums after everyone thought the vid was legit and said "It's not my fault you were all fooled! I labeled it as a time attack! Everyone knows that implies that save states were used!" "How are we supposed to know that?" "Because it says it on Arc's site of course! Is it my problem if my assumption is wrong that everyone has read Arc's site???" How do you think people would feel about that? Savestate-run is accurate but sounds pretty lame. How does it sound lame? Does the "run" part sound lame, or does the "savestate" part sound lame?

Posted: 5/25/2005 2:56 AM

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Michael_Fried

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player

Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 1107

I don't like the whole 99.9% idea either. It's just common sense. No one is going to think to themselves "Oh look, he left out the space in time attack, he must have been talking about something else!" If you don't agree, I'll make a topic about this on SDA or TG and we'll see what they think about the difference between a timeattack and a time attack.

Posted: 5/25/2005 1:15 AM

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Michael_Fried

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player

Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 1107

I don't care if people don't know it's made with save states. It's not my problem. Fine, so don't help try to make the situation better if you don't want to, but at the very least don't make it worse by using the word timeattack for save state runs.

Posted: 5/25/2005 12:52 AM

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Michael_Fried

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player

Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 1107

'Spoken' i.e. verbally. They have learned it by context. "Did you see the SMB3 timeattack?" "Yes, that is awesome." I didn't see this when I edited my post, so I'll respond now. If they never heard of Morimoto's SMB3 movie and you say that, they'll have no idea that it was made with save states. However, they might know it was made with save states when you say that because you used the word "the," and there was only one SMB3 movie going around at the time, but that would be because they already know about it, not because you used the word timeattack. If they already know how it was made and you refer to "the SMB3 movie" or "Morimoto's SMB3 movie", they'd still know how it was made. However, if someone says "I just did an awesome timeattack for SMB3," they have no way of knowing if it was made with save states, and they shouldn't assume it is.

Posted: 5/24/2005 11:40 PM
(Edited: 5/25/2005 12:43 AM)

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Michael_Fried

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player

Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 1107

The people outside of this community who I've spoken to about timeattacks haven't been confused either. Can you provide some links to forum topics? How did they know what a timeattack is? Is it only because they read your website? What about people who haven't read your website (which is most people)? How are they supposed to know? Although I don't currently think that anything is wrong with 'timeattack.' How many times do I have to explain that? It's bad because it's too similar to "time attack", and as someone already mentioned, 99.9% of people consider timeattacks and time attacks to be the same thing and won't realize that when you say "timeattack" that it means something different from what they've always thought of as a "time attack". No one wants to post times they got in the time attack mode of a game and have to worry about people thinking they used save states. People shouldn't have to stop using the word time attack just because you decide that the terminology for different kinds of runs should be made needlessly more confusing. No one wants to have to ask whether or not save states were used every time someone says they did a time attack for a game. Whether you like it or not, people have been confused about what a timeattack is. This isn't something that just happens occasionally, I've personally seen hundreds of instances where people didn't realize that a timeattack was made using save states, and that's just topics that I've read. In fact, many thousands of people have been fooled by the word time attack, just take Morimoto's SMB3 vid as an example, and don't give me the argument that if it said timeattack then people wouldn't have been fooled since your clever idea of removing the space didn't come until much later. Actually I just checked archive.org and the old copies of your website did call it a "time attack". Why would they be confused by the term "time attack" you might ask? Because, as I've already said so many times, time attack has never meant that save states were used. Morimoto used the word time attack because that's just what many people call speedruns. He just didn't mention for some reason what kind of time attack it was, which would be a save state time attack or a tool assisted time attack. Also I should mention that whether you like it or not, people have complained about people referring to save state runs as time attacks, and I don't blame them. As in the previous paragraph, not just a few, but thousands of people have complained. Why is that? Are they all trolls? No, it's because it really is misleading, and the fact that so many people are complaining is proof that it's misleading. Tool-assisted' just sounds so ridiculous and uncool. In your opinion. Lots of other people like the term, and also the Doom tool assisted community apparently likes the term. Like calling a powerboat a tool-assisted boat. Again you provide a poor analogy. Here's a better one: If the term for a boat with an engine or motor was "power boat" and you decided to start using the word "powerboat" to describe a sailboat or a rowboat, then that's misleading. If the movies had a cooler name like 'dreamruns' or something, then I wouldn't mind so much switching to that. So this is just about sounding cool? Then how about calling then "continuous single segment speedruns" so people think you have lots of gaming skill. It's not about sounding cool, it's about being clear and informative.

Posted: 5/24/2005 7:24 PM

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Michael_Fried

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player

Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 1107

In our case, there isn't agreement that a 'tool-assisted' speedrun is really a type of speedrun. There's agreement between most of us, and that's what matters. I could say that I think Paper Mario isn't a kind of Paper Mario anymore when he gets lots of badges, but that doesn't mean everyone has to stop calling him Paper Mario, just like we shouldn't stop using "tool assisted speedrun" just because you think it's not a kind of speedrun. You say that speedruns have to be continuous, but segmented speedrun is a popular term. Just because continuous speedruns might be more common than others doesn't mean they don't fit the definition. When you play the emulator movie file, the game gets completed quickly, so it's a speedrun. Just the way that the button presses were produced is different, hence the words "tool assisted." Also, even if it's not really a kind of speedrun, it still has an adjective that lets you know how it's different from a speedrun, and having the word speedrun in it doesn't necessarily mean it's a kind of speedrun. For example, if there's something made out of soy that looks and tastes similar to beef, you might call it fake beef, but that doesn't mean it's really a type of beef. I say that it's a different type of thing that deserves a new term. Well even if you do give it a new term, it doesn't become a standard term until it's what most people use, and most people don't use the word timeattack to describe save state runs. On your site, you make it sound like timeattack is a standard term, and there's no doubt that you've caused a lot of confusion by doing that. Instead, you should have just said that on your site you'll be referring to that kind of movie as a timeattack rather than making it seem like you're educating people about the proper words to use. Also, I can't remember if I've seen you do this, but I know other people have done this after being mislead by reading your site, but you certainly shouldn't be posting on forums about your save state runs and assume that people will know what you're talking about if you call them timeattacks. Why such reluctance to form a compound word? New example: Fine, make a compound word if it's so important to you, but make it something like toolassisted or savestate, not timeattack. Your example is poor because turnout won't be confused with turn out. Turnout may not be confusing, but if you make the compound word lackofpeople which really means that people are gathering, then it'll cause a lot of confusion. Why do you insist on using the word that'll mislead the most people?

Posted: 5/24/2005 2:22 PM

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Michael_Fried

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player

Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 1107

If you got the flower from the castle in world 1, you could switch to the flower when you do room #5 and still have the cape when you get hit.

Posted: 5/24/2005 4:11 AM

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Michael_Fried

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player

Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 1107

I would also go with a sentence that contains the word 'timeattack' instead of one with a long phrase that defines it. Since when has 2 words (tool assisted) been considered a long phrase? Anyway, the problem with your analogy is that falcon really does mean that, so there's no problem with using the word falcon. Now suppose that Paper Mario collects lots of badges and items and levels up a lot and gets really strong. What should I call him, 1a, a brief description much like tool assisted is, or 1b, a word I just made up that means what I just described? 1a. Powered-up Paper Mario 1b. PaperMario Here's another example. Suppose someone takes 20 different drugs before competing in Table Tennis in the Olympics. I understand your concern about not wanting to go into a long description about what all the drugs were, but which would would be a better choice for a news reporter to put in his article? 1a. After he won the medal for his drug-enhanced Table Tennis performance, his secret was found out and he was disqualified. 1b. After he won the medal for his TableTennis performance, his secret was found out and he was disqualified.

Posted: 5/24/2005 12:47 AM

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Michael_Fried

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player

Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 1107

'Tool-assisted' is too euphemistic. How is tool assisted too euphemistic? Because it doesn't mention what the tools are? It's certainly better than timeattack, which doesn't even mention there are tools being used.

Posted: 5/23/2005 8:24 PM

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Michael_Fried

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player

Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 1107

I think someone suggested calling them emu rape runs, but I suppose that might be offending, so how about we call them emurape runs instead since clearly that has nothing to do with raping. Also, one of the guys who took part in the gamefaqs flamewar suggested the term tool assisted speedruns, or just ass movies for short, so another alternative could be calling them assmovies. Here's another possibility: since you're basing your reasoning off of that you can use the term timeattack just because it isn't taken already because you cleverly removed the space, how about just calling them vngqavhnpaiodfusgvh runs. I'm sure that would be a great way to make sure people are informed. Another thing I should point out is that your reason of why "timeattacks" shouldn't be called tool-assisted speedruns doesn't make sense. You say that they're not really speedruns. Why not? Since when has speedrun meant that it has to be continuous any more than time attack meant that? Again, you only think that because you felt like making up a definition of speedrun, and I don't see it on your site now, but I remember it used to say that it means that because it has "run" in it, which implies continuity. However, now I'll use your own logic against you and say that speedrun is a single word and doesn't have to be related to what "run" might imply about it. Anyway, my point is that time attack always meant what the wikipedia article says, and has nothing to do with using save states. You can't just make up a new misleading word that's very similar to a word that means something totally different, decide that it has a certain definition, and then always use it to describe something and assume that your term is descriptive and that people will know what you're talking about. I assume we all agree that "vngqavhnpaiodfusgvh run" is a bad term. Why you ask? Because it's not descriptive, it doesn't differentiate it from an original console run, it explains nothing about how it was made, and people won't know what you're talking about and will just be misleaded and confused. Timeattack is a bad term for the same reason. As for what they should be called, it depends where they're being discussed. If you're talking about a TAS on another forum, I'd recommend avoiding all confusion and just calling them "save state runs", which people would probably be even more likely to understand than "tool-assisted speedruns." On this forum TAS would of course be fine, and if a TAS is being discussed then simply calling it a run (in the topic where it's being discussed) would be fine. For example, if I mention "VIPer7's 96 exit SMW run" in the need help with Super Mario World topic, people would know what I'm talking about. As for what "unassisted" speedruns should be called, again it depends where you're discussing them. On SDA, or in the speedrun competitions section of this forum, they should just be called speedruns. In a section where most of the runs discussed are save state runs, one possibility is original console runs, or 2 other more popular terms (which are used on SDA) are single segment (SS) runs, which are continuous runs through the whole game, and segmented runs, which are done one section at a time where you're allowed to redo each section until you're happy with it. Both single segment runs and segmented runs are runs without the use of save states. Edit: I guess while I'm at it I should also mention another thing about Arc's site that bothers me. In the aesthetics section, save state runs and non-save state runs are mixed together without specifying which is which.

Posted: 5/23/2005 3:24 AM

Post subject: Diddy's Dash (DKC2 for GBA)

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Michael_Fried

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player

Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 1107

I found out about this cool mode in DKC2 for GBA yesterday, so I downloaded the rom and started playing it. It times you to see how fast you can beat each level, and you can temporarily freeze the clock by killing more than one enemy in the same attack. Here are my best times for the levels I've tried so far: Pirate Panic: 0:08:55 Mainbrace Mayhem: 0:08.99 Lockjaw's Locker: 0:43.89 Hot Head Hop: 0:36:21 Rattle Battle: 0:33:52

Posted: 5/22/2005 4:02 PM

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Michael_Fried

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player

Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 1107

What am I missing here and has anyone else had a similar problem before? I was having desyncing problems with both this movie and the speed run, but then I found out he's using the PRG1 version and not the PRG0 version and then it worked fine.

Posted: 5/21/2005 6:40 PM

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Michael_Fried

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player

Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 1107

Genisto, I don't know if you checked Wonn's site already, but he has some cool glitches on there that you might want to include in your run. http://kontek.net/davidwonn/nes.html#S Also, there's a glitch I found where you can enter the top half of a pipe. I don't remember which level it was, but I think there was a big hammer brother at the beginning and a pipe just behind him that leads to the rest of the level.

Posted: 5/20/2005 9:08 PM

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Michael_Fried

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player

Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 1107

I tried playing this fmv several times already and it keeps desyncing. The fireball keeps missing Boom Boom at the end of airships (the level just before 8-1). Do I just need to keep watching it over and over until it plays correctly, or is there something else I need to do?

Posted: 5/20/2005 7:27 PM

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Michael_Fried

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player

Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 1107

...because obviously the best use of my computer time is running a keylogger that posts results to people I don't know on the internet... You wouldn't be using a lot of computer time to run the program. After it's set up, it'll just take you a couple of seconds each day (or less often if you want) to submit your number of key presses and clicks to the site, and you don't even have to load it when you turn on your computer since there's an option to automatically load it on startup (and it loads quickly). It doesn't take up a lot of memory either, it's using about 5 KB of memory for me which is just about nothing compared to the several hundred MB that I have. All you have to do is download it, install it, register, and join a team if you want to, all of which would just take a few minutes. Then there's gonna be an icon in your tray, and when you double click it or right click it and click "Pulse!", it tells the site how many key presses and clicks you've done since your last pulse. Exactly what I was thinking. How do you know this thing isn't recording your passwords? It doesn't record what keys you pressed unless you turn on the keystroke frequency option, but that just records how many times you pressed each key and not the order. I don't see how it would keep track of what keys you press because none of the files in the whatpulse folder increase in size as you type more. There's a keyfreq BIN file that keeps track of how many times you pressed each key, which only increases in size if you have that option turned on, and otherwise it stays at 4 bytes. There's a pulses text file that keeps track of the date and time for each pulse and how many key presses and clicks were submitted with each pulse. Then there's the uninstall file that of course always stays the same size, a whatpulse BIN file that I don't know what it does but it stays at 880 bytes, and the executable file that you click on to run the program that always stays the same size. Even if by some chance they did have some way to secretly record all your button presses, which is very unlikely since no one wants to use hundreds of gigabytes of space to store useless information, there would be so many keypresses for them to look through that there's no way they would know when you typed your password.

Posted: 5/20/2005 3:32 AM

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Michael_Fried

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player

Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 1107

One neat trick is you don't have to actually beat the wizard to beat the first level. Although, I doubt it will save time since you kill him so quick, and his shots tend to cause lag. I knew that already, but after walking under him to get the key, he comes back down and you can't get past him. Touching him will kill you, so you can't go through him. I'm pretty sure I tried jumping over him and that failed, and waiting for him to come back up is obviously too slow, so killing him is the only solution.

Posted: 5/20/2005 1:30 AM

Post subject: Whatpulse

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Michael_Fried

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player

Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 1107

http://whatpulse.org/ The nesvideos site should have a whatpulse team. Whatpulse is a program that counts all the times you press a key or click the mouse, and the site keeps track of all this data and has rankings for both individuals and for teams. Unfortunately I wouldn't be able to join since I already joined the Mario Kart team and you can't be on 2 teams at once.

Posted: 5/20/2005 12:55 AM

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Michael_Fried

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player

Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 1107

Would you mind posting what your time was (and what timing rules you used)?

Posted: 5/20/2005 12:51 AM

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Michael_Fried

Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player

Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 1107

When you say I lost time because I waited for enemies to move, do you mean I could have not waited with the enemies in the same position, or is poor luck manipulation the only thing I did wrong? Also, which minibosses are you referring to that I walked through? I remember the cat, and I think I tried a little to manipulate luck so he wouldn't be in that position, but I wasn't able to. The other one I remember is Peg Leg Pete, and if I remember correctly the screen flashes when you kill him, so walking through him after touching a knife is the fastest way. Anyway, it's too bad the shooting for fun caused lag, I found all that shooting kind of cool-looking.