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No silly, the processor isn't on the game disk.
There is no such version on the N64
Yes there is, it's just not an official release.
The rom used needs to be an exact copy of what is on the disk. If you remove the emulator on the disk, then it is far from an exact copy.
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Slowking wrote:
ShadowWraith wrote:
I think rog was saying you should dump the GC ROM to an N64 cart and see if it crashes on the console, not that you should try it in mupen...
Oh it will totally crash on an N64. But that doesn't matter. Mupen is not an N64. And this is clearly the GC version. Everbody can see this. Nobody will expect that it works on the N64.
Except the rom inside the gc version is NOT a GC game. It's an n64 game. The the emulator is part of the GC game. You cannot just remove parts of the game because you don't like it.
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ShadowWraith wrote:
I think rog was saying you should dump the GC ROM to an N64 cart and see if it crashes on the console, not that you should try it in mupen...
That it works on mupen certainly would suggest that it at least might work on console.
If the GC rom does in fact allow for using the B stick when played on an actual n64, then i would withdraw all objections to using it in a tas, so long as it was done with the GC rom.
The issue now is actually proving that is the case. Is anyone able, or know someone who can test the gc rom on an n64?
Enterim wrote:
aleckermit owns a Nintendo 64 flash cart that can play ROMs on the original hardware, I'd recommend asking him.
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I dunno. I'd suggest testing it on an n64, but i doubt anyone here has the means to do so.
Might be worth testing in pj64 or something to see if void hovers work on that. Though i don't think it's even useful anyway?
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Well, sure, you can tas that rom on mupen if you want. But if B stick doesn't work when you play that rom on an n64, then you still can't use in mupen.
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But with mupen on a real GC/Wii it will also work. So why not use mupen to emulate these versions?
Because mupen cannot emulate a gc/wii game.
Sorry, but the emulator is part of the games. If you remove the rom from the wii .wad, and tas that, you are not tasing the wii version. You are tasing the n64 version.
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Just saved 3,473 frames on the boss 4 fight, cutting the fight almost in half >______________________>
Video coming as soon as it finishes dumping.
Total time savings up to this point is 7,240 frames now, and i'm only about half way through.
Link to video
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Yeah...i'm pretty sure he went with the japanese version because it's faster. Even if that wasn't his only motive, it was surely the main one.
I know I am making myself unpopular because of voting no and whatnot but I firmly believe that when someone deliberately does something to harm a wonderful site like tasvideos, despite how good his run is, it gets my no vote.
I'd argue that refusing to allow runs done on Japanese roms does far, far more harm to the site than this could ever do, for reasons that have already been mentioned, i'm sure a million times before.
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1. Goal choice isn't arbitrary at all. It has been a standard category for oot forever, and there's already a published run here in the same category. A 100% run would be twice as long with most of the run being running around getting useless shit that doesn't matter.
2. No, the goal is to defeat all the bosses, and do the trials. The story is still nothing more than a waste of time, and only shown when it can't be skipped.
3. This is true.
especially considering that I could actually have been getting value out of them if not for the language decision
Not really. Even if you could read the text, it's entirely nonsensical when done in this order, with so much skipped.
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Please use builds from http://dolphin-emu.org/download/ . The latest master version should generally be the best to use for tasing in most cases.
Gamecube games, or wii games which can be played with a gamecube controller currently sync perfectly, except for certain specific games (mario sunshine being the only one i know of), and should not require anything special to work.
Wiimote recording unfortunately does not currently sync as well, and can be prone to desyncs. For these, it is important to use more recent revisions (preferably 3.5 or newer), as older revisions are likely to desync constantly. Furthermore, it is currently necessary to completely close dolphin and restart it every single time you start recording, or playback.
If you wish to tas with both gamecube controller and wiimote at once, please contact me, as there is a way to (seemingly) make this work. This does not work on current master builds.
Important settings for tasing:
Dual Core: This must be off. This is very important, as it can cause desyncs, and even if it doesn't, it is impossible to properly dump video with this on.
Idle skipping: Also must be off, as it is not deterministic, and can cause random desyncs.
DSP emulator engine: DSP LLE Recompiler should be used. HLE is prone to desyncs, and often just sounds bad. This requires some copyrighted files to be dumped from a gc or wii. Instructions on getting them can be found here. If you need further help getting these files, pm me, and i can help.
DSP LLE on thread: Turn this off, it's not deterministic.
Audio backend: No audio output is actually the most accurate, and can sometimes prevent desyncs. If you do not need sound to assist in tasing, you should use this. Dumping audio still works with this.
Use EURGB60: This should be off for wii games, unless of course you're playing a PAL game. Don't ask me why.
Graphics settings: Search for your specific game on http://wiki.dolphin-emu.org . Nothing should matter for tasing in particular, though you may want to disable all of the hacks.
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Use the tasinput and/or more-save-fixes branch. You should not ever get any desyncs using either of those branches for recording gc controllers on either gc or wii games.
We should probably have a warning somewhere telling people not to ever, ever use any version other than these for tasing.
edit: and now we have one.
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ShadowWraith wrote:
It proves it's possible unless he cheated. I'm asking if you think that's the case.
I think it's possible he cheated, as he clearly does also. It doesn't really prove it can be done with original, just opened from the box, controller.
Personally, i don't think that matters. Even if it can only be done with a modified and/or broken controller, it's still possible.
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Lex wrote:
Swordless Link wrote:
I could never get the video to work on VLC or WMP or anything so I just waited til it was on YouTube (Glide64 never works for me so watching it on Mupen wasn't an option).
What are you talking about? Even the 10-bit 4:4:4 video works in VLC here. Are you sure you're using the latest version? I just tried in VLC 2.0.0 and the video runs from beginning to end with correct colors and frame rate.
2.0 was only released like a week ago, so he's probably not using it. 10 bit has worked in vlc for quite some via nightly releases, but obviously that isn't what most people use.
sonicpacker wrote:
sonicpacker wrote:
bobmario511 wrote:
Using Jabo's video 5 or 6 it is possible to finish this 34 frames faster (1266 total) as this .m64 shows (assuming it synchs). Since the only way this game can be reasonably encoded is with glide napalm wx, the frames were needed.
The final time should not reflect the need to "fix" the .m64 for encoding IMO. We have to extend the .m64 in SM64 for Aktan to encode it as well because of the Mupen pause bug, but never have we been asked to change the time of the run because of this.
Is no one going to address this?
I agree. The time should not include the 34 extra frames. They may be needed to record the run, but if they aren't needed to make it sync, they should not be counted.
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Spider-Waffle wrote:
If the RTS that use VC are so popular and all the runners use that, why shouldn't TAS be able to as well.
You can. Just get the .wad for OoT, and run it in dolphin.
but the physical hardware does not.
Yes it does, it's just not realistic to do it with any consistency. Much like pressing A 30 times per second.
Why does it have to be run on Dolphin, why can't it use a different VC emulator?
Because there are no other emulators capable of running wii's VC games. If you wanted to create a new one that is capable of playing and tasing them, then i'd imagine that would be ok.
But of course, you don't actually want to to tas a VC game. You want to tas to the n64 game inside. You're only calling it a VC game because you want to confuse the issue, and make it seem like you're not wanting to abuse an obvious emulation glitch in mupe. Unfortunately, when you strip away the emulator from the rom, it becomes a different game. It doesn't just play on a different console, but it behaves differently as well. Nintendo's emulator is part of the game.
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That's the only original controller I know that can do up+down without breaking the controller. If you've got proof of this I'd love to see it.
Regardless of what is possible with an original controller, it works on the console. And wtf is this about practical? Pressing a button 30 times per second is even less practical.
Nevertheless, the single entity which holds the ultimate power here has said he think this glitch should not be allowed no matter what emulator you use, VC or GCN.p
That wasn't quite what he said. And it seemed like a joke to me, anyway.
Basically the RTS of the game will be faster and use better strategies then.
Well hey, with no 3ds emulator, that will be the case anyway.
So why can't Mupen be renamed and distributed as a VC emulator?
Because it's not an official nintendo release. And if it was, you'd need to tas it in dolphin.
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Is this really the case? We may somewhat be comparing apples to oranges here, but let's go back to HappyLee's latest SMB warpless submission for a minute. While basically every previous SMB run had synced when it was played back on a NESBot, that run had one specific trick that caused a desync on the console. When people questioned whether we should not accept that submission and instead request a slightly edited one that didn't use the trick and would sync on a console, the consensus formed that it was sufficient for the run to sync on an emulator and that the property of syncing on NESBot was more of an interesting footnote than a requirement.
iirc, that trick is possible on console, it didn't sync because of lag. There's a huge difference between slight timing differences and fundamental changes in how the game works.
What I do care about is trying to force people to use an emulator in an emulator or disallowing a glitch all console runners use, because it's possible on a real console.
Console runners do not use stick on B on their N64, because in fact, it's not possible.
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Slowking wrote:
Nobody is talking about reprogramming mupen to allow stick on B.
Yes they are. The pause bug is only fixed in the plugin which does not allow you to use B stick. That would need to be fixed.
As far as running an emulator in an emulator, the VC version of oot runs even faster than most wii/gc games do. Yes, it still requires a top of the line pc to run at full speed, but most should be able to run it at at least half speed, and if that's not good enough, they can always watch an encode.
So, i use that second number?
:(
Good to know there's an easy way to do it though.