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Bluely wrote:
I really wanted to submit this as NTSC verison however if i do that, it will be instant rejection because copying someone else's input and submitting it without permission is not allowed in TASVideos.org
This wouldn't work anyway due to a different frame rate. You'd have to recreate the run from scratch if you want it to be optimal.
-----
Considering that the time difference is so minimal, I do believe that this should have been accepted rather than rejected.
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Link to video
Made this TAS in two days. It's pretty bad & unoptimized, but it's still 22 seconds faster than Avanor's TAS RTA timing. Don't watch the final boss.
A few things I discovered while creating this TAS: it's possible to lock our speed at a certain speed. After rolling through an enemy, if you start losing speed before you reach a ledge, you can duck at the ledge in order to retain speed a little longer until you can roll below the ledge on the ground or something. For example:
You have speed 1088 from enemy, you start losing speed. You start falling when you're at 1048 speed, and you can't roll in mid-air, so you have to sacrifice your speed. Instead, you can duck right before falling, and, after losing a small amount of speed, your speed gets locked until you unduck or land on the ground. Your speed gets locked to 935, faster than rolling speed.
ICE PHYSICS: two things.
First, your true speed is different from your visual speed. Your true speed will always be normal physics, but your visual speed will have extra calculations done so that it seems a bit slippery. While your true speed may be 896, what you see is a speed is of only 100, due to turning right.
Well, apparently, if your true speed is at 896 but your visual speed is at 100 but you are in mid-air, if you jump (without holding the B button), your visual speed gets snapped to 896 and will have normal physics until you land on the ground (aka ice) again.
Second, and this is only useful in Animal Antics, Rambi's acceleration in ice physics is also like kongs: slippery and slow. However, it turns out that if you use the B Button to use his horn attack, he ignores ice physics and starts accelerating as if he's on normal ground. This saved two frames over not using the B Button.
Keeping to the tradition of Rambi: when charging and then stinging something, if you don't hold anything on the d-pad, the speed decelerates by 8 every frame as opposed to the usual 20 ish when holding only right.
When you roll through an enemy and get a speed boost (let's say 1088), and you turn around, your speed boost stays and you can go from 1088 to -1088.
And for something that I just found out now: apparently (and it makes sense), the reason why sometimes being left of the goal post saves time is purely because the camera is further to the left and thus the kongs leave the screen sooner.
Edit: I won't post anything new but it seems that there's easily 2 seconds of improvements in just Klobber Karnage alone lol. Also, doing a quick comparison between Squawks vs Squitter in Animal Antics Squawks section, it seems that Squitter saves about 6 seconds in total. (Direct video comparison between illayaya's Diddy's Dash TAS and my TAS in the video above. Note that my TAS does go for a banana coin & gets Dixie, so this might be closer to 8 seconds. Also note that the time save might be smaller or bigger in 102% as there's a Camera we need to get in Squawks' section.
.bk2 file: http://tasvideos.org/userfiles/info/60313005635378661
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ivGNZs_Mvw
I haven't watched it fully yet, but this would be an easy pick for me.
The TAS of American Dad is also very good. Please don't ban me.
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7 No votes, 7 Meh votes and 7 Yes votes. Perfectly balanced as all things should be.
Hey, 7/7/7. 777. Maybe this TAS will be lucky enough to be published after all. :)
Seriously though, I almost joined the frame war at some point but good God I hated TASing the game and didn't make it past the first ledge.
Run here seems optimized, but entertainment wise it is too short and slow to really make it all too fun, if that makes any sense. No vote.
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ThunderAxe31 wrote:
Snodeca wrote:
I can confirm it syncs.
Sorry, we still need for confirmation to come from a staff member. It's not a matter of trust, it's just that it's our responsibility to handle sync confirmation.
I realized that after I posted my original post but I didn't bother editing it because whatever lol
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Could a judge replace the .bk2 file with this .bk2 file? There was a very stupid timeloss in the first level, and fixing it saved a frame without desyncing the run afterwards. I also decided to change the second Krow fight as well so that between the second and third phase it'll look slightly smoother.
I can confirm it syncs.
http://tasvideos.org/userfiles/info/57809926725990864
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Both Diddy and Dixie have a speed of 656 when running. When rolling, Diddy has a speed of 896 while Dixie has a speed of 640. This is a huge difference and makes Dixie almost utterly useless, and it would not reduce enough lag in PCP for it to save time. If it wasn't for that small thing right at the end of K. Rool, Dixie would not have been used whatsoever. It's just ironic how it's always slower to use her but we still finished the TAS with her.
I honestly don't know if all SNES glitches were tried (I actually don't know the SNES version whatsoever, well, I don't know the minor glitches) but wrong warps work very differently. If you were to try to wrong warp like in SNES, what happens is you softlock the game. That's because it tries to warp to Warp ID 0, which is a mere softlock here: the game simply freeze.
That said, it is possible to wrong warp in this game. Only problem is that it is useless. Coincidentally (or maybe not so coincidentally), the exact same method for wrong warping in DKC2gba is possible in DKC3gba, and thanks to the new water world, it turns out to be useful.
I'll write up a section that explains all the tricks and possible tricks in this game to extension, the wrong warp in DKC3gba, as it is theoretically possible in Slime Climb. I was not able to get the wrong warp to work, but the circumstances for a wrong warp are correct in this level (bonus/warp barrel + water + ground).
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World 5:
Link to video
We improved about 7 to 8 seconds in total up until King Zing Sting compared to the last video of world 4 back in June.
Currently we are 2:31ish ahead of Avanor's TAS back in 2017. Sub 50 is confirmed, sub 49 may happen but is probably unlikely.
Edit from the future: "probably unlikely", it was sub 49 lol
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Chuttacoacko Plays wrote:
Chutacoacko Playz: I'm going ahead and submitting a KSS spring breeze run, although it's slower then MUGG'S run but faster than nitsuja's Spring Breeze TAS which was part of the any% no ACE run.
"it's slower then MUGG'S run"
I advise against submitting this. You said it yourself, "it's slower than Mugg's run". It's slower. It's just going to be rejected. And you'll be wasting the judge's time.
Feel free to submit it to the userfiles though! ^^
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This TAS was pretty enjoyable to watch, next to the autoscroller of course. Although optimizations can LOOK awkward at times, that's purely because of the fact that I have never played this game and I'm not used to "falling from high will stun you". Reading the submissions text after watching however clarified this.
Yes vote.
StarvinStruthers wrote:
wouldn't be surprised if the human race decayed before seeing one prince mode tas or rta (yes, that is a challenge)
(From his submission in 2017)
Well look who's wrong (:
Edit:
So I compared this run to the NES submission, and while the NES submission is faster at times (and has a little skip), I personally enjoyed the GB version more; better graphics, closer up so it's easy to see what's happening, more levels. With more levels comes a proper ending, and the ending for the GB version is much more satisfying than that of the NES version.
I don't know what the rules are for two very similar games, but in my opinion I think this TAS should obsolete the NES TAS. Good job on both TASes, though!
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I looked at the run more closely, and I noticed a couple optimization issues. Note that I have no experience at all with this game. The timestamps are from the encode I provided.
0:20 - you jump on a Shy Guy which slowed you down.
2:00 - Again, but on black things don't know what they're called.
3:22 - Again. Twice.
4:06 - Again, but I can imagine that this one might be harder to avoid jumping on.
4:40 - You got hit here. I don't know if this is slower to avoid or not, but still a notable thing.
7:07 - Couldn't you have jumped in order to fall down the hole faster? And also potentially have more speed while already moving to the right.
7:50 - Same here, you MIGHT have been able to jump down, assuming there's no ceiling above you. This would have saved time as well.
About 0:20. I quickly checked if I could avoid the Shy Guy by editing your movie, and it was very easy to to do. I got past the log 1 frame faster. Note: I have never touched this game or tried to TAS with FCEUX, but I was still able to improve this by one frame -- I don't know if that frame persists until the end, but I would assume so.
About the branch, I don't know how fitting this is. I feel like Luigi is no different from Mario (yes, I know Luigi jumps higher), and Bisqwit's TAS was obsoleted with the branch "Warps". Peach (or princess) has her own branch because she isn't being used in the normal Warps (and Warpless!) run at all, while all other characters are. Following this tradition, the Branch "Luigi only" feels arbitrary to me.
Optimization is bad, I'm not a fan of the Branch either. No vote.
NOTE: BEFORE YOU REPLY AGAIN, DO NOT REPLY USING SUBJECT. When you press on "Quote", type your message BELOW THE QUOTE in the big message box. Otherwise people will be confused:
EZGames69 wrote:
[11:01 PM] Colin (EZGames69): @Olivia Meows he didn’t even finish his reply to you
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Don't create a new submission. Instead, upload it to the userfiles ( http://tasvideos.org/userfiles/my#uploadfile ), and ask in the thread (posting the new file) to replace the current submission......................
I'll reply to the original submission because this is that's where it originated. Also, you simply copy-pasted your submission text, making the "obsoletes it by 10549 frames" inaccurate now.
Edit: the other submission got cancelled lol.
I'll just link the post I posted in the other, now-cancelled submission.
http://tasvideos.org/forum/p/486324#486324
This may or may not reflect the run now, as it's a "new" submission, but chances are that it does.
(Either way, still a pretty good effort for a first TAS; my first TAS was way worse than this, so don't beat yourself up about it, ok? I don't want to be rude or sound rude.)
Edit: Video removed because a video was added to the submission text.
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You did not finish the game. The pause at the end was me getting confused, and while not shown in the encode, I had to manually enter the door in the end in order to actually finish the game. Beating the final boss doesn't mean you beat the game. I'm not a judge or whatever, but please provide a movie file where you actually finish the game. Thank you.
Edit: Video has been removed because a video was added to the new submission text.
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Different in a technical point of view or when making the TAS, not very different at all when watching the TASes.
Still good effort, but it's too arbitrary IMO. I did, out of curiousity, check the file and see if there were any L+R, but luckily there are not. So at least the TAS lives up to its branch (:
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Hi, I am sorry for necroing a 2 year old gruefood thread, but I uploaded an encode of the TAS on YouTube, although the colours are a bit messed up. I'm not going to bother to fix this because encoding and uploading took far too long.
The video is here:
Link to video
I'd also like to comment on a couple notable things on this TAS:
- autofire (as I once mentioned before) is slow, although what I initially wrote in one of the posts was quite wrong, autofire is only slow if there are two lines in a text box next to "you don't know if you hit the first possible frame or not", with a couple exceptions. It likely doesn't lose more than half a minute over the course of the run, though;
- Sometimes you didn't even use autofire for going through text. You just mashed A at your own pace, which is visibly slower than the RTA world record. This obviously loses a shit ton of time (excuse my language);
- routing was very bad (far too many mushrooms, collecting mushrooms when you have far more than enough and STILL going shopping for mushrooms, you needed at most 21 Mush damage against Cackletta, you had over 25 Mush damage against Popple & Birdo, still went shopping);
- the above leads me to believe you didn't do any testing at all;
- collected the Bros. Rock, which, while useful in RTA, sadly loses time in TAS (I have tested this, it had potential but getting Bros. Rock sadly takes far too long)
- Very weird movement...
- In the Winkle mini-game: you didn't get hit as much as you could, which loses time
- In the Geno mini-game, you collected stars which slows down the timer and visibly loses time (I do not know by how much it loses each time)
- The barrel mini-game, from an entertaining section, was very boring. I would have tried to at the very least get 50 points, as going for a high score here does not lose time. You didn't lose any time here, no, but it was boring, and visibly done in RTA.
- While this still needs to be tested, killing Luigi in almost all the bosses may actually be faster, but I won't blame you for not getting Luigi to die as it may be close.
- Last routing issue I can remember, was that in Stardust Fields you fought 4/4/3 enemies instead of 4/4/4 enemies. When I first noticed you went for 4/4/3 enemies, I thought you were going to go for 4/4/3/4, the last 4 being an encounter in Hoohoo Mountain, like in the new RTA route, however you did not. You are weak for the next few fights because of this. What I mean with 4/4/4 and whatnot is the amount of enemies you fight in battles, so 4 enemies three times.
Those were the things I remembered at the top of my head from when I watched it. What it seems like to me is that this TAS follows the old RTA route (the new route gets the Greed Wallet), and the only rerecords were to not get hit in fights and to avoid all enemies. This TAS severely lacks in optimization and it was rightfully rejected.
I would estimate an optimal TAS would be about 2:55:xx, on Bizhawk-mGBA. We'll see when I finish mine :shrug:
Again, sorry for necroing a nearly two-year-old thread. And yes, I realize you won't see this, @Lu64.
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No vote for playing as Rosie. (No, seriously, Skunny looks so much cooler.)
On a serious note, I for the most part enjoyed the TAS visually. The music... It's a tad bit too repetitive, which sadly cuts down on the entertainment IMO. All things considered, I still enjoyed watching it, so that's a yes vote.
(I think I left kusogrande Discord server not long ago lol.)
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First, I found this neat little thing underwater that hasn't been documented anywhere. I checked and none of the Glitchless runs on speedrun.com/mlss uses this exploit.
Link to video
All runs on speedrun.com doesn't do the "fast swimming" method as solo. For some reason, if you swim as if you're with both Bros. (Press A & B at the same time), the Bros. in front gets a speed boost. I originally thought the reason the Bros. in front gets a speed boost is because of something finnicky with the Follow Path, but this video proves that theory wrong (that I never checked, for the record). Either way, it's a small timesave that saves a bit of time over the RTA runs. Very easy to do in real time.
Second, I have two questions. First about the damage formula.
Formulas by JDaster64
What do these terms mean? "Pow" and "Pow Mod", "Def" and "Def Mod", specifically. I understanw Pow and Def, but the "Mod" confuses me. And even then, I don't know if it's enemies' Defense or whatnot. I know Power can't be the enemy's power because their power differs from attack to attack and there's no constant power, but I still find this unnecessarily confusing.
Second question: when levelling up, is it always possible to get +3 (or more)? Right now I have routed the bosses until Queen Bean (and I ended up with the same route as yours so I suppose that helps confirming that 1. I didn't do badly and 2. It might be the fastest route), but this something that I'm not sure about.
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Albeit I'm not the biggest fan of using a death with the pipe to skip major parts of levels, I understand that it's the fastest way to go about it. Though it did catch me off guard. The rest however is entertaining and it's well optimized, so this gets a yes vote from me.
By the way, temp encode:
Link to video
Edit: updated the temp encode with a video in 720p(60? I just uploaded it so it might be 60fps soon, currently it's still just 30fps), replacing the crappy 144p video lol.
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MUGG wrote:
I'm really glad you still exist!
Yeah I haven't really been motivated to continue lately until now. (I accidentally lost like a minute of progress last year and later on broke my laptop (oops), hence)
Fencypo wrote:
Manipulating Cackletta
What I meant with this is that you can manipulate boss fights by waiting before entering, like for Bowletta you'd wait to get preferred RNG. For Cackletta I was wondering if it looks back on the RNG you entered Bowletta, or if it calls new RNG after Bowletta.
MUGG wrote:
Are you going for a "human theory TAS" or are you going for a serious "stick to the rules and squeeze everything possible out of the game while following the rules" project?
Originally I was going to just do a fairly simple Human Theory TAS that doesn't push for absolute optimization, but then with me being a little bit of a perfectionist in TAS, I just couldn't stand using a slow route PLUS I also forgot to collect mushrooms in Toad Town which RTA route does do. Decided to go as optimal as possible.
Since I knew there weren't a lot of mushrooms to consider in Koopa Cruiser I pushed through until beginning of Stardust Fields just to see how I would do compared to your WIP you posted (I did compare a lot to see where I lost time and trying to understand what I did wrong). Once I reached Stardust Fields, I went to sleep (relevant yes), and I had already decided to not continue and to actually route before I waste my time more.
I'm not sure if this is the preferred way to route mushrooms but what I'm doing is, I try to optimize my movement on getting mushrooms and compare it to not getting any mushrooms, to see how much time I lose. I'm not sure yet how I'd optimize Stache/Hige stat and money and stuff.
About manipulating RNG against the first set of Goombas, I just managed to get it and it turns out that it's actually slower. The time between jumping to hit the Goomba in the counter and being able to attack again;
- 79 frames when Goomba attacks Mario (goes diagonally)
- 82 frames when Goomba attacks Luigi (goes in a more straight line).
So manipulating RNG is definitely not worth it.
I asked about what people think of the skip in Teehee Valley in a TAS, so we'll see others think. The RTA route does not use any Red Peppers but does use Thunder Bros. in some fights, though both would be unnecessary anyway in a TAS so it doesn't really matter.
Oh and thank you for the good luck
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Just burned myself reading through this entire thread for 5 hours. Nice progression.
MUGG wrote:
using the hammer spin bros attack (which as you might know can deal ~60 individual attacks).
Is this information correct? When I tried to use Chopper Bros. in a TAS setting to do a quick sketch-route for Cackletta's Soul, I was only able to do 26 individual attacks (which after a night worth of testing I found that Mush Badge with 21 would be enough for sure), but then I read this and I noticed no one corrected this at all.
(This post was made on the 4th page of the thread)
2nd question. For manipulating Cackletta's attacks, is that determined before Bowletta or after Bowletta?
And my 3rd question, at Koopa Cruiser in the first fight, I was not able to manipulate RNG to make the Goomba attack Luigi instead of Mario for some reason. Also noticed you didn't manipulate that in your WIP as well. Is there any reason why this doesn't work?
----------------------------------
I'm back to working on Glitchless, though. Using Bizhawk 2.3.2 (I will be reverting back to 2.3.1 thanks to some bug in TAStudios).
I seem to be 13 / 14 frames ahead of the WIP you posted, likely due to better Fawful RNG (I haven't checked yet why). I'll post my WIP if you want to check it out (at the bottom of the post); it's currently in the beginning of Stardust Fields. I'll be routing Glitchless, and I do have a couple questions in regard what you think should or should not be done
(Note that I'm not talking to anyone in specific, so all comments are going to be considered):
- The biggest one, should I mash the A button fast enough in Teehee Valley to avoid getting Peach getting caught? The reason I'm thinking of letting Peach get caught is because when you revisit the room where she's supposed to get caught the first time later, the room is forever going to be in a glitchy state. However, since we don't ever revisit that room a second time, I hesitate a lot with this.
- Granted it may not be useful in Glitchless, should we allow the 0 DEF Glitch and infinite red pepper? This is allowed in the RTA categories because a runner could accidentally pull of those glitches and it would be stupid to void a run just because they accidentally did those glitches. However since in TAS you can just go back to avoid those glitches, I'm thinking of banning the two glitches as well.
Oh, I'll also (try to) """encode""" the rejected #5648: Lu64's GBA Mario & Luigi: Superstar Saga "glitchless" in 3:15:53.55. It's not a great TAS but it is the fastest known Glitchless time (as far as I know) and I have gotten it to sync all the way through, so it'd be nice to have a video of it. [small][small][small]I don't earn money on my channel anyway[/small][/small][/small] With encode, I mean playing the run back on video during stream with Livesplit to compare to RTA run. (July third next week, in the evening London time (say around 6PM UCT) on Twitch if you want to see it, I guess. Not going to link my stream, you'll see it on the game page when it's live.)
WIP file: User movie #56149381358162570 (Uses Bizhawk v2.3.2)
