Joined: 6/21/2004
Posts: 247
Location: New Hampshire
nitsuja wrote:
1. Copying SDA runs, but faster, is something we'd like to avoid. Making it any% at least gives some possibility of deviating from marshmallow's run.
2. It could potentially save a lot of time if you skip the right things (the game is long enough as it is that anything to make it faster helps), and the choice of what to skip is somewhat interesting and difficult.
Joined: 6/21/2004
Posts: 247
Location: New Hampshire
To see the little movie about the secret items at the end of the game, I'm all but certain you need all 100 jiggies. I definitely didn't have all 100 when I first beat the game and I'm pretty certain I didn't see the bonus movie until I beat the game the second time.
I used to be stupidly obsessed with this game, but... that was a number of years ago, so things are not as fresh in my mind as they used to be. I'll try to help if I can, but I think marshmallow's run is really the thing to go by here. As far as strategies and routes go I think he pretty much nailed everything. This would change if we chose to do any%, of course, but I personally don't see much point in doing that, since you need a pretty decent amount of jiggies/notes to get to the final boss anyway...
Joined: 6/21/2004
Posts: 247
Location: New Hampshire
Woah, I didn't even notice this had been finished and submitted!
Obvious yes, even though it doesn't matter by this point with 36 assenting votes and 0 "no"s. :)
Joined: 6/21/2004
Posts: 247
Location: New Hampshire
Wario Land II for Game Boy would be really sweet.
I almost posted Mischief Makers but I noticed you didn't mention any N64 games in your post, and I think nitsuja might be doing that game anyway (if his awesome WIP is any indication). So nevermind for now I guess!
Joined: 6/21/2004
Posts: 247
Location: New Hampshire
Worked fine for me with Mupenv7. The video is looking very nice, I especially liked the delayed breaking of the wall you flew by in the caged star in Whomp's Fortress.
Joined: 6/21/2004
Posts: 247
Location: New Hampshire
hopper wrote:
To me, crashing into walls and falling into the water several times in a row just looks sloppy. I'll hold my breath and stamp my feet until I'm sure that it won't be published, and we'll see who passes out first.
I suppose you could make a case for the "sloppy" feel spoiling the run; there are probably more clever looking ways to slow yourself down, but I liked the contrast between Genisto's goofy screw-ups and then doing extremely well on the last lap or two. Thinking about things again I do think a movie that does everything as perfectly as possible would be entertaining, but I got a number of good laughs out of the video... I've also never played this particular version, so my ignorance of the subject is probably making a difference. Michael Fried knows his stuff and didn't like it...
Still, though, I'm looking at it as a run that doesn't really attempt to break any records, it's just a goofy little playaround that attempts to vary things as much as possible, and I think Genisto succeeded in showing how a lot of the levels are laid out and what is and isn't possible. I understand why some of you don't like it, but I still don't see why it shouldn't be published.
Also, hopper, that's not fair. I started holding my breath before you did. :)
Joined: 6/21/2004
Posts: 247
Location: New Hampshire
This is a lot of fun to watch, to me it was quite clear Genisto knew exactly what he was doing, and we've had "playaround" videos published before. This had better get published, and I'm going to hold my breath and stamp my feet and pout until it is!!
Joined: 6/21/2004
Posts: 247
Location: New Hampshire
StrangenessDSS wrote:
I must congratulate you - you beat the console record for 1-1 by one frame. I didn't expect you to do so well this soon. Your other levels are still slower, though, and you do some very silly things. But I'm not going to say what - I can't just give you all the answers. It's too much fun watching people try to figure this game out.
Eugh, I had a big long reply typed out, but I accidentally deleted it. Here's the condensed version:
I realize my other levels are slower and have goofy strategies, but this movie was only intended as a proof of concept; a demo video to show how fast the pace of the game can go and all that. Aside from 1-1 I wasn't too worried about ironing everything out (and I only spent a while on 1-1 because I couldn't make that big jump for the life of me until I found the (or at least, a) right variation after at least an hour or two of tinerking, at which point I promptly moved on), so I'm extremely confident that everything can be improved upon. By someone else, of course. I don't have the knowledge, time, or skillz to find the best ways to do everything -- sorry to deprive you of the entertainment of watching me stumble around :)
On another note, I've gotten the best results playing this game with the Rice plugin that came with v3 (Daedalus?), though I may not have noticed graphical glitches, just that there was very little slowdown.
Finally, if you're planning on doing any hex editing, I'd adivse you
A) not to waste your time, and
B) please don't touch 1-7crap... it's very embarrassing :)
Joined: 6/21/2004
Posts: 247
Location: New Hampshire
nitsuja wrote:
Hmm, when I play this back, it always desyncs at the end of 1-5... I've tried adding/removing frames but you always boost jump into a spike ball and drop the kid. Could someone else see if they're able to watch this? I've been catching various bugs lately but none of them have been related to input synchronization since alpha 5.
Besides that, this looks pretty good so far to me, although like you said it can probably be improved and would benefit from knowing or experimenting more with the game.
Yeah, I noticed that an hour or so ago when I tried to add some more levels onto the movie (ah, boredom). It's weird, after I finished recording it I watched it all the way through with no issues, but it's desyncing for me now at that same spot too.
...Oh, fucking hell. I recorded a new ending and a couple half-assed attempts on the next couple of levels (they were really bad, you're not missing anything), but now it's desyncing at the same spot it did last time! I'm 100% certain it didn't desync the first time I watched the movie, but now that I've closed and reopened Mupen it desyncs at the end of 1-5 again. How mysterious!
I just noticed that I don't have the latest version, I think. It's "v3" and not alpha 5. Don't know if that makes any difference, but it's worth mentioning.
[There was a link here. It's gone now.]
Joined: 6/21/2004
Posts: 247
Location: New Hampshire
That was beyond bizarre.
Seriously, I think the lines between "game," "hack," and "barely playable and incoherent mess" were crossed a little too far in a certain direction here.
Joined: 6/21/2004
Posts: 247
Location: New Hampshire
2D Treasure game = needs to be done!
With the slide jump and boosting and all that fun stuff, this game has the potential to be done really really quickly. A lot faster than any other Treasure game I can think of off the top of my head, anyway. This is one of my favorite games for the N64 and I would very much like to see someone more knowledgeable in the game's mechanics and shortcuts than I take a stab at this.
edit: comicalflop is working on it now. Hooray! Cheer him on and stuff!
Joined: 6/21/2004
Posts: 247
Location: New Hampshire
I really don't forsee the TAS of this game doing much better than StrangenessDSS and Brandon Sanford's videos. Yeah, we'll shave some seconds off by cutting corners more closely and all that, but I really think that as far as routes go that there just isn't much room for improvement. Of course, I'm just about equally confident that I'll be proven horribly wrong, so we'll just see how this goes.
I can't wait to see someone make Magma Peak their bitch.
Joined: 6/21/2004
Posts: 247
Location: New Hampshire
Holy hell, spezzafer. You certainly haven't cut any corners that I can see. :O However the final run turns out, I can say with certainty that it's going to be completely fucking astounding.
edit: "cut any corners" referring to your thoroughness, not your actual shortcuts :)
Joined: 6/21/2004
Posts: 247
Location: New Hampshire
Jesus, that's a hell of a jump. After experimenting around a little on console and emulator I've come within one or two block heights of making it up there... I guess now is a good time to admit I don't really know how anything in this game works :P Good thing I wasn't planning on taking things any farther, I just needed an excuse to tool around with this thing :)
edit: Just for fun I tried out the second level too. This is it, I swear :) http://cupofdirt.net/poop/1-2.zip
Joined: 6/21/2004
Posts: 247
Location: New Hampshire
I made a quick and crappy test run of the first level of Mischief Makers using solely frame advance if anyone cares enough to see it. It has a few obvious flaws, of course, since this is really only my second or third attempt ever at doing any sort of TAS whatsoever, but it does show how quickly the game can potentially move.
http://cupofdirt.net/poop/mmt1b.m64
The "S Rank Guide" FAQ writer on GameFAQs says his best time is nearly a second faster than mine, so there's at least a second of improvement (out of a 9 second level) in there. For example, the places I decide to jump are kind of weird, I'm not too quick at grabbing the guy on the shrine and turning around, and I couldn't make it up to the eagle wing without boosting before throwing the Clancer, which the guide writer says should be possible without boosting. Maybe I just didn't try enough options. Anyway, there you have it...!
Joined: 6/21/2004
Posts: 247
Location: New Hampshire
I'd put priority on Banjo-Kazooie over Tooie. It's a much shorter game and I imagine it would be a lot less hellish to plan out and test that first, then Tooie afterward.
Mischief Makers would make for a very good movie. It's a 2D Treasure game, and I don't think anything more needs to be said than that.
Also, Blast Corps. Since this game places a good amount of emphasis on time (esp. for platinum medals), it would be great fun to see just how quickly each level can be beaten. :)
edit: Forgot an obvious one, Goldeneye!
edit: Oh, and Pilotwings and Kirby. And Super Smash Bros. ;)
