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moozooh wrote:
A much better and more enjoyable movie, although certain moments (jump height planning, for one) look somewhat rough. Yes vote.
I guess I forgot to mention in the description that in some levels, where you try to go from bottom to top like in 8-6 and 8-Tower, I jump higher than needed in order to: a) manipulate some of the above enemies to be in a more favorable position. b) manipulate map movement.
Especially in 8-Tower, I agree it looked a little sloppy compared to my WIP version of 8-Tower, but it was to manipulate the Hammer Bros to move to the right instead.
Edit: Okay, I'm thinking of a screenshot and I'm thinking of one at frame 89741 near the end. Here is the image. What do you all think?
It pretty much sums up the speedrun. Bowser knows that he is in BIG trouble.
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I always thought the chainsaw was the quickest killer since I remember that all I had to do was tap a button and it kills the person. But I think the Minigun is awesome if you are not close to the target and if the target is a vehicle.
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Atma wrote:
OK, found out what the cause was.
Turns out that since you had modified your firmware settings, and thus they showed up in the configuration file.
Changing the firmware settings or just having them show in the config file was enough to make the movie sync.
After finally being able to finish watching the movie, I must say it was pretty good, though I do have one question:
Why didn't you get the star coin in 8 Tower 2? It was the only stage in which you could collected them all without wasting any time.
Other than that minor part, nice work.
Hmmm...thats a good question. I remember rerecording that section quite a bit. I honestly thought I collected that coin. Oh well. I guess you can call it "heat of the freerun" or something xD.
Also, about the firmware settings, I find it odd that something that technically shouldn't even affect the game or even the emulator would have that type of effect.
By the way, two encodes on dailymotion? Thats kinda funny.
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sgrunt wrote:
I've just passed the problem spot in 8-T2 and it's still synced!
If the sync holds up (which it probably should at this point), I will do an encode in the near future.
Don't worry about the encode. I'll post it on Youtube most likely tomorrow for those who do not want to download/still have problems with the .dsm.
Edit: By the way, if anyone knows the extra details I need to include concerning the config. settings in the description, please let me know. Thanks in advance.
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The funny thing is, even with those configurations, the movie plays properly only 75-80% of the time, messing up at 8-6 or 8-T2. It seems to do even worse when AVI record is activated.
I'll probably be working on a modified .dsm that can be played properly on all 0.9.4 versions during the next few days, unless the culprit configuration setting is found.
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Ok, I feel dumb now.
This is what happened. So I cut the Configuration settings from the folder into order to create a new one Configuration file. Just like everyone else, at 1-Cannon, Luigi goes into his shell and bounces off the cannon. So I looked at the Configuration settings and this is what I found at the very bottom
[0.9.4+]
armFixCycleCount=1
armFastFetchExecute=1
This probably happened when I was fooling around with 0.9.4+ while I was on a break from the run. As it seems, I was doing the run on 0.9.4 with 0.9.4+ configurations inside it.
Edit: So, what I think I should do is hex edit the .dsm so that the normal common configurations can properly play it.
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Hmmm...with 0.9.4+, it never gets past 1-1.
And I switched from 0.9.2+ to the plain 0.9.4 at 5-Ghost, so if the problem is in the switching, it should have been there.
Edit: OK, I guess I forgot to include something in the set-up. Under "Frame Skip", I unchecked "Limit Framerate" and instead of "Auto", I checked "0". If this is a significant change, I'll include it in the run description.
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http://www.megaupload.com/?d=GUMSCQD2
Try this link. This is the same .dsm file but it has extra frames at the end that do not have any input.
Before I submitted the .dsm file, I thought that the time is determined by the number of frames of the movie. So, before I submitted, I removed the last few frames because there was no input there.
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Atma wrote:
miseiler wrote:
In the NSMB thread TRT mentioned he was using 0.9.2+ to do the run...try that.
I see, that's not 0.9.4 like he listed in the submission though :P
I got to the same point as grunt did when it desynced. you hit the halfway point in 8 tower 2, and then a little bit later you jump on the spikes and then fall to your death.
You know, I find it interesting because, for me, it tends to desync in 8-6 and 8-T2 as well. However, this only happens some of the time.
It also should be noted that I was never able to directly compare my WIP with any other WIP because the other WIPs would desync early in the run as well.
Perhaps it has to do with computers (I use a laptop).
Edit: Oh, and I did use 0.9.2+ earlier in my run, but when I found out that there was a 0.9.4 that played the dsm properly, I switched to 0.9.4. It indeed played normally. There shouldn't have been problems.
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Comicalflop wrote:
Watched it, and it's much better than the published run. However, there's still improvements to be made*, and I think you'd be much better off if you restarted using a lag free version of desmume, because those periods in between levels are still boring. And they can be made faster! it really is a significant amount of emulation error lag, and it can, and should, be fixed.
I'd also like to say that your waiting antics during 8-2 were very good.
*
-Sometimes you don't land on the very bottom part of the flagpole when you could
-Your acceleration and rounding corners when underwater was very bad. Especially in that level where the big eel chases you... the beginning, you didn't round corners at all, and also you didn't approach the tubes that shot bubbles optimally either. If you swim upwards towards them or float down from above you want to clip the corner and hit those bubbles as fast as possible.
-Is ducking off a ledge when running with star power faster than doing a small jump?
-I mentioned to adelikat about when doing vertical jumps in a tower, if you need to make many short jumps, it may be better to duck and jump, for the added benefit of making shorter jumps and having faster gravity acceleration so that you land and can jump sooner.
-In 8-2, at 22 seconds, can you take damage and wall jump on those spikes to get to the door faster?
I didn't land on the bottom of the flagpole because I didn't think there was any time loss as long as Mario/Luigi was below the actual flag. Plus, I believe there was manipulation of map movement with the score.
In the underwater levels, I actually did try to clip the edge of the bubble-shooting pipes (though it may not have been optimized). I think it looks like it wasn't clipping because I was constantly moving to the right and downward movement in the water is slow (if I went downward a frame earlier, Luigi's feet would touch the pipe, reducing speed; and if I went upward a frame earlier, Luigi would bump his head, and I would get into the bubble stream later).
As for ducking with star power, I wanted to get 72 Star speed for as much time as possible, so the quickest way to the ground is through ducking.
If I take damage on the spikes, I would end up fighting Bowser Jr without Fire Flower. Also, I think there is time loss in the "power down". I'll look into it. I'll also look into the duck-jumping to see what it can do to the run.
Cpadolf wrote:
Ok, now I noticed that the blue shell is faster under water and that adelikat measured the times in the fortresses from when he entered to doors to the bosses, so everything seems good.
I think in the current published run, he entered the door as early as possible. Its actually faster to enter doors as close to the middle as possible.
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8-T probably is slower because I was trying to manipulate Hammer Bros to move to 8-3 (to get Blue Shell which saves around 20 ticks). Since I was mini-Mario for most of 8-T, the only way I can manipulate is coin collection.
This was my WIP version from earlier this month
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=MU5L555P
8-T seems faster in that WIP vid, but Hammer Bros always seemed to move left to 8-2 instead of right to 8-3.
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(sorry for the double post)
I've finished the run. I think its a little rough on the edges, but with some hex editing, it can definitely smoothen out. overall, i like how it all turned out. several spots i think can be optimized a bit further (i'm not that good at squeezing out frames from runs). but if you all see something that can be done, here is the .dsm file and video file. Other than that, what do you guys think of this run? Any comments or suggestions?
dsm file(if it desyncs, i may upload individual levels instead)
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=GUMSCQD2
video file (in wmv format because avi takes up too much memory.)
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=3ROAMPVE
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jlun2 wrote:
Sorry Greenalink but.......
I found a way to beat the game in 4:00
I plan to find a way to get a sub 4:00 time before I submit it.
Edit: Is the Hellenbach faster than the Duke? If it is, How does it look like?
I believe the Duke is slower. Hellenbach is probably one of the fastest common cars. By the way, I like how that run looks.
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UPDATE: I finally manipulated Hammer Bros and am currently up to the Castle1.
Also, I found out two awesome boosts (both as Super Luigi)
One involves ducking, and the other involves the rope. When ducking, jump to the lower right corner of a block. If done correctly, Mario/Luigi would straighten himself up just as he hits the block, pushing him forward and boosting his speed to anywhere between 64-112.
As for the rope, Mario/Luigi gets a small boost upon grabbing the rope. And if they jump just before touching the rope, they do not lose any speed and still have that boost.
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In that case, I advocate speed and entertainment rather than low par and entertainment. I remember some levels where it is faster to use a few items to complete than not using items.
"Fast and unexpected" should be a goal for a TAS run of this game.
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Derakon wrote:
My personal inclination is to not aim for speed as a goal at all in a Scribblenauts TAS. Instead, aim for creative solutions and unusual situations. Maybe your level solution requires swinging a soccer ball around on a vine, or a duel between Charles Darwin and a humpback whale. Above all, keep the viewer guessing. TASing in this case would not necessarily be required for all solutions, though efficient summoning and placement of objects would of course be a keystone.
How amenable is the game to hexing? If it can be hexed easily, then you could split up the game by level and have multiple contributors working in parallel to come up with lots of unusual approaches.
I second this. Keeping the viewer guessing is probably a key part of the entertainment in this game.
Plus, the game should be extremely easy to hex edit since each level is very short and the level menu involves pretty much a few clicks of the touchscreen.
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alden wrote:
It seems that Bowser's dash punch (or whatever it's called) is slightly faster than walking when done perfectly. So that will be annoying to watch :D Plus all the cut scenes. I'm not sure if I'm looking forward to a run... though it's been fun to play so far.
I don't know if this is true, but I think the punch is faster in short bursts. Later on, you get Bowser to roll into a ball and move pretty fast. In long distances, the cool-down of Bowser Punch would make it slower than the Bowser Roll overall.
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There are other exploits that involve switches and switchdoors. A Starite can go through a switchdoor with a string-like thing or a fan. You can also launch yourself through ground and other solid objects by trapping yourself between two doors and releasing one of the doors. I think a pure speedrun should be done (if it is done fast enough with proper exploiting of items, it would be more entertaining than a run that only goes for low par, in my opinion)
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mindnomad wrote:
on a straight-to-end run, you could get rid of the blue shell after 8-3, and from there you could keep going with whatever (of course you need to get the star power). and a faster way to beat masked bowser jr. in the towers is to jump on him, then to a ground pound on him since a ground pound counts as two jumps on the head, then on the right frame, before mario automatically turns to the player for the victory pose, you could turn to the left/right (depending which way you're facing) to get out of the tower faster and save a frame or two.
Another thing is to make sure that you defeat Bowser Jr. as far to the right as possible, because when he jumps out after you defeat him, it takes out a load of frames.
I found this speed trick with a mega mushroom (which can be seen on my level 1-1 freerun )in which you ground pound on a slope and jump immediatly and continue jumping. it's similar to the hoping glitch in SMW. however, i tried it with the other variations of mario, and they didn't seem to work...
Nice tricks in that video. It looks cool.
Are you sure ground pounds work against Bowser Jr. By world 8, he ducks in his shell. During my first run, I tried ground pounding Bowser Jr but it doesn't seem to work.
When you say "as far to the right", are you talking about Bowser Jr. or Mario/Luigi? Because if you are talking about Bowser Jr, you are pretty much saying "Defeat Bowser Jr as quickly as possible".
By the way, I'm currently stuck trying to manipulate hammer bro to 8-3. Since I was mini-Mario for the majority of the run, the only way I can manipulate is collecting different amount of coins or getting a different score. Here is an .avi file of my progress. I do not know which level in 8 I should do over for manipulation, but I'm leaning towards 8-1. What does everyone else think?
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=MU5L555P
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I agree about 8-4 because the star appears 3/4 of way to the flag.
However, in 8-7, it appears 1/2 through the level; the second half of the level is set in such a way that you can get continuous boosts (which I believe more than makes up for the time lost getting the star).
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I can also get the Fire Flower by taking a small detour in 8-3. However, I wonder if it is worth losing the Blue Shell and getting the Fire Flower later on. I know Shell Mario moves slower with a Star Powerup (2 levels use the Star Power) and shell Mario kills Bowser Jr slower. I'm thinking Shell Mario is only useful in world 8 for that swimming part.
There is going to be a trade-off somewhere in the run if I try to become Fire Mario again.
I'm thinking I should definitely try to get a Fire Flower before 8-7, where the first star appears.
I must say, though, that it is pretty hard to manipulate blocks or Hammer Bros early in the world 8 because mini-Mario cannot kill most enemies without a ground pound or hitting a block underneath (which the first few levels have a short supply of).
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Blue Shell Mario moves much faster in the water. I was wondering why my previous run of 8-3 (as blue shell Mario) was 21 ticks faster than my current run (as Fire Mario). In my older speedrun, I finished with 306 remaining. As Fire Mario in the run I am working on right now,
I explored it a little. Blue Shell Mario moves at a speed of 27 in water. Fire Mario moves at a speed of only 18. I don't know if this is going to impact the any% run, but it definitely could be helpful in a 100% run
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Progress update. Currently stuck trying to figure out how to corner boost as mini-Mario on a block that is 3 small Marios high. Does anyone know how to do this one?
Edit: Figured it out. You hold jump for 9 frames, let go for 4, then hold it for 2 or more depending on how high you want to jump.
Heres what I know so far:
In order to corner boost as small Mario on a block 3 small Marios high, you press the jump for 4 frames, let go for one frame, then hold jump a couple more times to get the boost (hold the jump longer afterwards for preferred height and airtime). You can see this in World 1-1.
In order to corner boost as large Mario on a block 3 small Marios high, you press the jump for 1 frame, let go for one frame, etc etc (I haven't been able to do it successfully at 48 speed with shell power though)
There is, however, another type of corner boost when you are in a shell. You jump while hiding in the shell at a block overhead. Then, when you are about to pass the block, let go of the dash button. Mario/Luigi would stick his head out and get a small boost. You lose around 4 speed per frame in the shell, but you gain 20 or more speed in the one frame. This is helpful when you have no choice but to hide in the shell. You can see this most in World 5-3 and once in 1-T.
Then, when you are mini-Mario, you can corner boost off a block that is 2 small Marios high (like the one at the end of the secret exit at 5-G). You hold the jump for 3 frames.
Here are the dsm and avi file (avi file is second link)
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=YU2IXXZFhttp://www.megaupload.com/?d=HRCLNY5Q
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http://www.megaupload.com/?d=NS647WKT
My current progress up to 5-G using version 0.9.2+.
I tried to optimize it to the best of my ability. I don't think I optimized the route of the flying box/hammer bro though. But at least the hammer bro is now at 5-G.
I'm going to compare it with adelikat's WIPs (if only the emulator would let me view it properly without desyncing)
Let me know what you guys think.
It pretty much sums up the speedrun. Bowser knows that he is in BIG trouble.