Posts for Tilus


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Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player
Joined: 9/24/2004
Posts: 177
My answer to the "End movie at beating Red instead of beating Elite Four" question: Good luck on that one. Sure you'll have plenty enough opportunity to level off of all the Kanto gym trainers, who use level 50-ish Pokemon, but from there you get a massive and sudden jump in power from level 50-ish to level 80-ish. Who knows, you might be fairly close in level by that point in time, but still, that huge gap might be a bit much to overcome smoothly without powerleveling, which will drag the movie down. The fact that you have to go back to the title screen after beating the game once, potentially screwing up the clock rhythm, could also put a dent in things. Also, what looks to be the optimal moveset plan for beating the Elite Four as fast as possible could leave Typhlosion fairly vulnerable to some of the Pokemon the Gym leaders and Red might use. If I were to run G/S/C I'd stop after beating the Elite Four. The rest is really more of a bonus quest as far as I'm concerned, and would consist of little more than mass slaughter of Gym leaders with your overpowered Typhlosion, at least right up until you get to Red.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player
Joined: 9/24/2004
Posts: 177
Yeah, go ahead and post any sort of in progress speedruns, planned routes, and the like. Now that we've established a run of G/S/C is possible, we should start planning the route, what sort of movesets we'll use in the run, and so on. I'm actually playing through Gold right now, to get a better feel for the game and get a good idea as to what a run of Gold (or Silver or Crystal) would require.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player
Joined: 9/24/2004
Posts: 177
Actually, I have doubts it'll be 4 AM by the time you reach Union Cave if you go by my speedrun. I only spent 14 minutes beating the first gym. Maybe if you set the time closer to 3:45 AM (you should be able to pick up your Poliwag before sunrise), it'll be more likely for you to get your Sandshrew?
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player
Joined: 9/24/2004
Posts: 177
Yeah, bosses can't be manipulated nearly as well as you might think. In fact, Lavos 1 and 2's actions go by a very specific pattern (for example, if I remember correctly, 1's is 'Destruction Rains from Heavens!'/Chaotic Gate/Lavos Spawn Needle/repeat). So far the only luck manipulation I've found throughout the entire game is the target which enemies attack you with can be manipulated depending on your previous actions, but even then that's not manipulateable very well. And yeah, you're going to need to be around level 35 (or go WAY out of your way to go through about a half dozen events inaccessible until near the end of the game and gain a whole bunch of TP with certain characters, which wastes much more time than it saves) in order to be able to merely survive Lavos's most powerful attacks, which it uses frequently.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player
Joined: 9/24/2004
Posts: 177
As I mentioned, there are a few mistakes, and I'd likely be starting over if I continue on. Smokescreen was used because the AI was dead set on using moves with 255/256 accuracy, and I didn't feel like manipulating away that small chance for each and every hit on a quick and dirty testrun.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player
Joined: 9/24/2004
Posts: 177
Surprise~! This movie file runs up to the completion of the first Gym (Violet City). It is by no means perfect - it's got a few mistakes that need correcting, and if I do go through with a run of Pokemon Gold, I'll probably start over from scratch, or back up quite a ways back. Don't read too much into this, though.. Pokemon Gold is one of at least 5 games I've at least toyed around with in a search for my next speedrun. I think it's best if someone with more experience with the game takes this one on, though. But hey, it's a movie file, and it doesn't desynch. (Edit: Here's a few luck manipulation tips I found, in case someone else besides me does this run: - Unlike with Pokemon R/B/Y, trainers do have an AI that's smarter than "Pick a random move the Pokemon has". Don't expect to simply luck manipulate away every enemy Pokemon to do exactly what you want to do. - Enemy attack choices seem to be decided at the beginning of the turn, not when you choose to attack, so if you want to try to manipulate the attack, do it immediately prior to selecting your action for the turn (in other words, when the enemy is releasing his Pokemon, or on the last action of the previous turn). - Also unlike with Pokemon R/B/Y, critical hits no longer ignore ALL stat modifiers caused by moves such as Leer or Tail Whip, only those harmful to the attack. So, as you'll notice, I Leer a few of the earlier enemies to reduce the number of turns it'll take to defeat them by reducing their defense.)
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player
Joined: 9/24/2004
Posts: 177
...BisqBot is random?! Somehow I just see that as extremely inefficient. I don't see why you couldn't start with a blank movie file and then increment the input every time you don't accomplish the goal, get hurt, die, etc - that way, the first solution BisqBot reports is the optimal one. You can also insert ways of weeding out inefficient inputs, such as "don't press certain buttons if you performed certain action for X frames", "ignore this input if no input is recorded for X frames", starting with a movie length of X frames, or something of the sort.. though, who knows, BisqBot might come up with some trick you may never have imagined was possible?
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player
Joined: 9/24/2004
Posts: 177
As mentioned several times before, I'm very convinced that no application of the Missingno glitch would save time. To execute it would take a good 2 minutes out of the way (at least) to pull off, and I'm sure that even if one were to have perfect luck the rest of the way, one hitting every other Pokemon I encounter from that point on with no "It's super effective!" or "Critical hit!" messages, I'm not going to be able to take back 2 more minutes from the run. (Edit: Hmm, Trainer/Fly at Cerulean.. that might very well save time. However, you're going to need to get past the Nugget Bridge gauntlet to reach the patches of grass where you can catch an Abra, you need to spend ~10-15 seconds picking up the Rare Candy in Cerulean, Trainer/Fly takes about 2 minutes to execute, then add on top of that ~4-5 seconds per Rare Candy used. Keep in mind though that the Nugget Bridge gauntlet is about at the end of where I routinely take more than one turn to faint a Pokemon, and from that point on the vast majority of battles are ones in which I one hit the opposition.)
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player
Joined: 9/24/2004
Posts: 177
Cut is only power 50. Alot of Grass types have high HP and high Defense, so good luck trying to Cut them to submission.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player
Joined: 9/24/2004
Posts: 177
I considered doing it as my next run after Pokemon.. ..but that quickly died when I realized that Ys doesn't work properly in either FCEU or Famtasia. Sorry, but you're going to have to come up with another game..
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player
Joined: 9/24/2004
Posts: 177
Comparison chart, for anyone interested, and not sure if Squirtle really is the best option for a TAS of Pokemon: Things that Squirtle defeats easily: - Gym 1 (Bubble) - Gym 3 (Dig) - Gym 4 (Ice Beam) - Gym 5 (Dig) - Gym 7 (Surf) - Gym 8 (Surf) - Elite Four's Agatha (Dig) - Elite Four's Lance (Ice Beam) Things that Squirtle has problems with: - Rival's Gyaradoses - Elite Four's Lorelei --- Things that Charmander defeats easily: - Gym 3 (Dig) - Gym 4 (Ember/Dig) - Gym 5 (Dig) - Gym 8 (Dig) - Elite Four's Bruno (Fly?) - Elite Four's Agatha (Dig) Things that Charmander has problems with: - Gym 1 - Rival's Squirtles/Wartortles/Blastoises (high physical defense, and fire moves are not effective vs it) - Elite Four's Lance (many Pokemon he uses are Flying, and all are resistant to fire) --- Things that Bulbasaur defeats easily: - Gym 1 (Vine Whip, but this requires lv13, not really suitable for a TAS) - Gym 2 (Vine Whip) - Gym 8 (Razor Leaf) - Elite Four's Lorelei (Razor Leaf) Things that Bulbasaur has problems with: - Rival's Pidgeys/Pidgeottos/Pidgeots - Rival's Exeggcutes/Exeggutors - Rival's Charmanders/Charmeleons/Charizards - Gym 4 (Enemies are Grass type and thus resistant to Grass moves, and you won't have anything powerful physically at this point in time - Gym 5 (Grass attacks are also not effective vs Poison types) - Gym 7 (Ditto with Fire) - Elite Four's Agatha (everything is at least part Poison, see above) - Elite Four's Lance (especially the dragons)
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player
Joined: 9/24/2004
Posts: 177
ackackatk: The reason behind that is the way critical hits work in this game. Despite what you might think or what conventional knowledge shows you, critical hits do not do 2x damage in this game. Instead, it's actually closer to ~1.8x damage, thus if an attack would normally drain half the enemy's life bar (or slightly more), a critical hit with the same attack won't defeat the enemy Pokemon. Thus, you'll see quite a few instances where I'll use 2 normal attacks to defeat a Pokemon instead of 1 critical (or a critical and 2 normal attacks instead of 2 criticals, and so on).
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player
Joined: 9/24/2004
Posts: 177
Yes, I did continue to use Ice Beam even after I had the opportunity to pick up Hydro Pump, as it was super effective against Rival's Pidgeot and Venusaur, and allowed me to freeze both those Pokemon as well as Gyarados, whom you'll notice was quite a pain for me to deal with throughout the run. So, I can't overwrite Ice Beam with Hydro Pump. And yes, it's possible to pick up all 151 Pokemon on one version using glitches. (I'm not doing a run which picks up all the Pokemon, as it'd mostly be the same as the current run only with a bunch of Pokemon catches thrown in, and alot of time spent executing glitches to catch Pokemon not normally available on the cart..
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player
Joined: 9/24/2004
Posts: 177
Yes, it's irreplaceable because after the battle with Lorelei, I have to use Dig later on in order to defeat Agatha's Pokemon. I guess that is solvable if you bring an Ether or two to refill Fissure, however you'd also have to figure out where the closest Ether to the path is (you can't just go into a store and buy one), scroll down the menus later on in order to use it, and since near the end I was running extremely tight on item storage (you only have space in your inventory for 20 items), I'd have to drop an item in order to be able to keep it. This looks like another one of those high potential risk, low potential reward things which I'll need to leave to someone with far more free time than me.. Also, why Blue? I did my test run with Japanese Green, and switched to Blue because it was the same game. In other words, I did it for no really important reason, and I'm sure I wouldn't be any faster or need to make any major changes if I switched over to Red.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player
Joined: 9/24/2004
Posts: 177
Maza: 1) I don't teach Fissure to Blastoise, as to learn it I'd have to overwrite something irreplaceable and vital to the run (Ice Beam or Dig). You can't overwrite moves learned by HM, otherwise I'd definitely have done that. 2) Regardless of whether it saves time after Bill's house or not, I actually use Teleport twice more to get back to Cerulean from Vermilion, saving anywhere between 45 seconds to a minute each time. So yes, it was definitely worth it.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player
Joined: 9/24/2004
Posts: 177
Run completed and submitted.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player
Joined: 9/24/2004
Posts: 177
Don't worry, just finished that section of the game. The map only confirmed the fact that the path in the testrun is the optimal one. I don't expect any changes out of Victory Road, either. I was most curious about the Saffron Gym teleporter layout, really (and I doubt there's a way to make it to Sabrina's room in less than 3 teleport trips anyways.)
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player
Joined: 9/24/2004
Posts: 177
Nope, I'm not Finnish. So yeah, you'd probably have to translate text.. The maps are really the most important, though.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player
Joined: 9/24/2004
Posts: 177
Sure, go ahead. The things I could use maps of are: - Saffron City gym (Gym 6) - Chances are the path in the test run is the optimal path, but you may never know.. - Abandoned Mansion - Victory Road
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player
Joined: 9/24/2004
Posts: 177
Progress report~ Thanks to the map of the Silph Co tower that was posted earlier in the thread, although I didn't get Earthquake, I did find a new route through the building which is both a shorter walking distance and avoids a trainer battle, saving a good minute or more. However, it seems that avoiding this trainer battle has thrown a huge monkey wrench into the run, as all of a sudden I'm not able to one hit a bunch of Pokemon anymore, and I'm losing turns against the test run right and left.. and by the looks of it it could even offset the gains I gained with my new route! o_O So, I'm trying something a little different, and taking a different route through this section of the game by beating the Gyms out of order (Abandoned Mansion-Gym 7-Silph Co Tower-Gym 6 instead of Silph Co Tower-Gym 6-Abandoned Mansion-Gym 7 as in the test run). So yeah. the next update may not come for a little while..
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player
Joined: 9/24/2004
Posts: 177
Nope, it looks like it's still very much a work in progress. From what (very little) Japanese I know, it seems like this all started off with a picture or flash or something of the sort of a "FF10 for Famicom" posted on a famous message board (2ch), then a bunch of people with way too much free time on their hands decided to try to make it a reality. And while I'm as skeptical as the rest of you, never underestimate Japanese doujin authors with a silly idea to work with (as I recall, "Ragnarok Battle Offline" started off with a very similar premise).
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player
Joined: 9/24/2004
Posts: 177
Absolutely! Any offensive attack can miss, even if it's only a 1/256 chance. However, Blastoise is faster than the Weezing, so I don't manipulate a miss in that manner. =P And, I'm now up to 1min 54sec (114 seconds) faster than the test run.
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player
Joined: 9/24/2004
Posts: 177
Gym 5 was defeated tonight. Won't be posting an update quite yet - the challenge of making this run is all downhill from here (not to mention I'll be fighting the last three gym leaders in quick succession), and I'll probably wait until I finish all 8 gyms before I post a new update. Though, to give you a little sneak preview, I just discovered something while fighting Koga, the 5th gym leader - a Lv43 Weezing knows Selfdestruct. I'll leave it up to you to fill in the blanks ;)
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player
Joined: 9/24/2004
Posts: 177
Well, while the site was down (and just before I got the sickness I've had the last couple of days..), I concocted this up. It runs off a savestate created from the full Pokemon Blue run after leaving the 4th gym, and should be able to be edited into the movie if you want absolute undeniable proof that this is doable. =P
Experienced Forum User, Published Author, Former player
Joined: 9/24/2004
Posts: 177
I'm done with this game. I've tried many many times to motivate myself into completing it, or starting over, and each time I've failed. So, I'm going to let someone else handle it. I am open for questions concerning any aspect of the game's physics, luck manipulation, or anything of the other (very few) quirks the game offers. This game's a programming masterpiece, and I'm sure now more than ever it's probably the absolute worst game on the SNES to even try to attempt speedrunning. (And if you've wondered where I've gone, look at the Pokemon Red/Blue topic. I've completed a successful test run over there, and am midway through the final run.)
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