I knew that kthx :(
In fact, I did some more tests and here's an analysis of what I found, compiling your advice, the sample you provided me and my own findings.
THE ANATOMY OF A SLIDE
A normal slide consists of:
a) One frame of crouching
b) Approximately 20-40 frames of sliding (haven't found the precise number yet)
c) A ground check that consists of either an extra crouch while on the ground or a Crash-in-mid-air frame while in the air. The vertical speed is also set to zero for one or two frames and Crash's downward acceleration is reset, and he continues to fall from the new set point.
d) One or two frames of getting up from a crouch.
c) and d) can be avoided by doing one of two things: spinning early in the slide or jumping after the slide.
MOVEMENT ON NORMAL SURFACES
Before obtaining the Crash Dash (read: for the first twenty levels plus four bosses), sliding and spinning is the most efficient method of travelling across smooth surfaces. Normal rapid sliding wastes a few frames because of how the slide works (see The Anatomy of a Slide). While jumping sends Crash forward horizontally and vertically, it is at a slower rate than the slide can provide.
So the goal is now to get to the next slide ASAP. This can be achieved by spinning later in the slide, i.e. right before Crash stops moving. This ensures that Crash will get the most out of the primary slide before cancelling the ground check. While the spin is obviously slower than the slide, I have recently found that spinning early cancels out the original momentum of the slide. So there. ;) (THIS PARAGRAPH'S CONTENT AND STRATEGY HAS CHANGED. READ IT CAREFULLY)
When you are attempting to grab a box in the air, slide spin once, then line up a slide jump so that the jump will start as late as possible, thereby losing as minimal momentum as possible for the jump.
MOVEMENT ON ICE
In the vast majority of cases, you will want to slide jump. For some strange reason, the ice acceleration physics can help you gain extra momentum and speed if slide jumping. Since spinning is not affected by the ice physics, slidespinning would not help at all on the ice. Slide-slide is only somewhat slower than the slidejump because, as mentioned before, the extra momentum gained by the slidejump is greater on ice. Note that this method is also faster than Crash Dash for the time trials.
In some cases you'll want to grab a box that can easily be shot over with a slidejump. In those cases, slide-slide works best except for dynamite. For the TNT boxes, slidespin then jump as you spin to more or less line up where you're aiming for.
MOVEMENT ON NORMAL PLATFORM CHANGES
For getting to platforms lower than the one you are currently on, use slidejump. It gets farther faster, because the spinning animation does not end late enough for the ground check mentioned above to be nullified, and it therefore resets the vertical speed just before Crash reaches the ground.
For getting to platforms higher than the one you are currently on, the option depends on how high and far the platform is. Relatively low and near platforms should be crossed by using a slidejump if you want to hit a later box, or a simple A button hop for any other scenarios. For farther away and higher up platforms, a slidejump plus a late double-jump works fine.
MOVEMENT UNDERWATER
Tap A like mad. Avoid the radical turning animations by gradually coaxing Crash into a turn. When going straight, don't press any D-pad buttons for fear of straying offcourse. It also makes a straighter line. Next.
MOVEMENT IN THE BEAR CHASES
Charge by holding B throughout the entire run and hit all the dash panels. For the stone barriers (first found in Snow Job), use short hops; they cost less time and using a small jump will get to the charge animation quicker.
MOVEMENT ON THE CONVEYER BELTS
Slidejump works best on the advancing belt because of the momentum bug discussed in the ice section; however, the change here is far less drastic, but nonetheless faster.
Slidejump works best on the retreating belt because it "fights" harder against the belt. Unfortunately, slidespinning does not work as efficiently as slidejumping against the current of the retreating conveyer belt. Slide-sliding is definitely a no-no for this.
MOVEMENT IN THE DOGFIGHTS
There's no real trick to this. With the exception of the portals/gates/zoom points/whatever, these levels are autoscrollers. The only trick is getting to the gates as fast as possible, and it's really about being at the right place at the right time.
So...that's a short (yeah right) and basic (really?) analysis. Anyone want to add anything before I redo most of my run?
My current project: Something mysterious (oooooh!)
My username is all lower-case letters. Please get it right :(
Joined: 2/28/2006
Posts: 2275
Location: Milky Way -> Earth -> Brazil
wow
"Genuine self-esteem, however, consists not of causeless feelings, but of certain knowledge about yourself.
It rests on the conviction that you — by your choices, effort and actions — have made yourself into the
kind of person able to deal with reality. It is the conviction — based on the evidence of your own volitional
functioning — that you are fundamentally able to succeed in life and, therefore, are deserving of that success."
- Onkar Ghate
Bisqwit wrote:
I think that sums it up too ;)
Anyway I'm about to make a slight change to it. Turns out the slidespin doesn't work as well as I had imagined it to, so I'm basing it more on the sample now.
My surgery is tomorrow. IS ANYBODY GONNA FEEL SORRY FOR ME??? *hears nothing*
Ah well. Maybe next time.
My current project: Something mysterious (oooooh!)
My username is all lower-case letters. Please get it right :(
I think that sums it up too ;)
Anyway I'm about to make a slight change to it. Turns out the slidespin doesn't work as well as I had imagined it to, so I'm basing it more on the sample now.
My surgery is tomorrow. IS ANYBODY GONNA FEEL SORRY FOR ME??? *hears nothing*
Ah well. Maybe next time.
I'd feel sorry for you, but this is off-topic and I'd get modded, beaten up and then fed to starving, rabid dogs, and have my bones delievered to hungry people in Africa.
...
Crap, this is off-topic. O_o
I'd feel sorry for you, but this is off-topic and I'd get modded, beaten up and then fed to starving, rabid dogs, and have my bones delievered to hungry people in Africa.
*Mods Sketchie, beats him up and then feeds him to starving, rabid dogs, and has his bones delievered to hungry people in Africa.*
Just kidding.
Anyway I got back early from surgery (the ICU team said I was OK, but now I can't talk), but I'm not going to be back with VBA until ~ Tuesday.
Until then, I'll keep analyzing Crash's movement etc. and keep editing my movement analysis.
My current project: Something mysterious (oooooh!)
My username is all lower-case letters. Please get it right :(
I'm finally ready to redo my run, armed with VBA-rerecording 1.71 and a beta of TASedit! Yay. Yeah. I'm not touching the blimp or swimming levels, just the running levels.
Just letting everyone know I haven't died or anything.
I'll update a WIP of my new run soon.
My current project: Something mysterious (oooooh!)
My username is all lower-case letters. Please get it right :(
Yes, I'm triple -posting. So? :)
Anyway, here you go, pirate: a WIP of my ALL-NEW run up to the bonus area at Temple of Boom. Biggest changes:
- Changed main movement technique (slidespin from slidejump)
- 453 frames faster than my previous effort ending at the same spot (15,053 frames to 15,506 frames)
- Changed route in Shipwrecked to abuse collision detection quips
- Took a hit on the first eel in the Shipwrecked relic run to save time.
- New relic time: 42.7 (old relic time: 43.5)
- Running levels made entirely in frame advance (6% slowdown for the swimming levels)
Have fun watching and, as always, post your advice on the thread. I need it ;).
My current project: Something mysterious (oooooh!)
My username is all lower-case letters. Please get it right :(
Joined: 2/28/2006
Posts: 2275
Location: Milky Way -> Earth -> Brazil
Sorry... I could not reply last night....
About your run, it's a lot better. You removed useless input and you're more cautious about your progress.
But you started from my sample... that's not good.
You should use it as a base to study new possibilities and then "fly with your own wings".
It's still not entertaining enough sometimes...especially in the underwater stages.
You should use your favourite speedruns as examples...
see how they look so insane... so daredevil...
Since the game is divided in many small stages, you should not advance to the next stage until you feel that you've managed to overcome all the human limitations in the current one.
Anyway, you should make YOUR run, with YOUR nickname in the "author" field and with YOUR OWN strategies. It's not time to be lazy!
Never forget the old saying:
"NOPAIN,NOPAIN"
OK, I'm here. Waiting. =D
"Genuine self-esteem, however, consists not of causeless feelings, but of certain knowledge about yourself.
It rests on the conviction that you — by your choices, effort and actions — have made yourself into the
kind of person able to deal with reality. It is the conviction — based on the evidence of your own volitional
functioning — that you are fundamentally able to succeed in life and, therefore, are deserving of that success."
- Onkar Ghate
Bisqwit wrote:
The run looks MUCH better from what I've seen in your latest WIP. Keep up the great work. By the way - you don't actually end at the end of the first warp room. You died in the bonus area in the first level of the second warp room, but meh XD
By the way, I am curious - are you considering about doing Crash Bandicoot Purple: Ripto's Rampage after this?
After all, it IS a GBA Crash Bandicoot game...
By the way, I am curious - are you considering about doing Crash Bandicoot Purple: Ripto's Rampage after this?
After all, it IS a GBA Crash Bandicoot game...
NO.
The series went downhill after they combined it w/ Spyro. I'm doing N-Tranced after this.
Oh and pirate, I was going to make it a joint TAS with your base and myself. Just telling you now :)
My current project: Something mysterious (oooooh!)
My username is all lower-case letters. Please get it right :(
By the way, I am curious - are you considering about doing Crash Bandicoot Purple: Ripto's Rampage after this?
After all, it IS a GBA Crash Bandicoot game...
NO.
The series went downhill after they combined it w/ Spyro. I'm doing N-Tranced after this.
Oh and pirate, I was going to make it a joint TAS with your base and myself. Just telling you now :)
Good call.
I just looked up Crash Bandicoot Purple: Ripto's Rampage, and yeah, it just went downhill. A game that is mainly mini-games? YUK.
In fact, I will personally bonk the person is planning to do that run with a huge rubber mallet. A game that crappy doesn't derseve a TAS. ._o
...yeah, another off-topic post. YAY! =D
Joined: 2/28/2006
Posts: 2275
Location: Milky Way -> Earth -> Brazil
theenglishman wrote:
I was going to make it a joint TAS with your base and myself.
Wow... thanks!
But that first part of the run could be improved, I guess, because I wasn't trying hard enough.
That will be an excelent exercise for you. Try to optimize that. You need to learn how and where to use frame advance and frame search to make a "perfect" play.
"Genuine self-esteem, however, consists not of causeless feelings, but of certain knowledge about yourself.
It rests on the conviction that you — by your choices, effort and actions — have made yourself into the
kind of person able to deal with reality. It is the conviction — based on the evidence of your own volitional
functioning — that you are fundamentally able to succeed in life and, therefore, are deserving of that success."
- Onkar Ghate
Bisqwit wrote:
I was going to make it a joint TAS with your base and myself.
Wow... thanks!
But that first part of the run could be improved, I guess, because I wasn't trying hard enough.
That will be an excelent exercise for you. Try to optimize that. You need to learn how and where to use frame advance and frame search to make a "perfect" play.
As far as I can see, your sample can't be improved. The slidespin you use (R, 16 frames, B) is the best optimization for that particular run, as is your techniques for getting rid of two ten-wampa bouncy boxes. Plus I'm still horrified by my first attempts to use TASedit ;).
Oh, and here's a new WIP, to the end of Ace of Space now. Enjoy.
My current project: Something mysterious (oooooh!)
My username is all lower-case letters. Please get it right :(
Okay pirate, I need your help (and possibly a WIP?) for one of the most complicated and confusing levels of the game: Down the Hole gem run. Here's a WIP of my run up to about 15 seconds into Down the Hole. Since this is a joint TAS after all (see earlier posts), I was hoping you could help me with this level.
It's not a requirement, but I would really appreciate the help.
Thanks.
My current project: Something mysterious (oooooh!)
My username is all lower-case letters. Please get it right :(
Joined: 2/28/2006
Posts: 2275
Location: Milky Way -> Earth -> Brazil
Before anything, I did NOT ask you if it was possible to optimize or not... I told you to DO it. You can't figure the game physics out without playing and feeling them yourself.
About the underwater stages now.
The faster speed: do a spin, wait 24 frames (or wait 2 frames before it returns to its swimming stance), boost, wait 10 frames and spin again... repeat while possible.
You can boost, wait 11 frames, boost again... repeat -- but that's a little slower.
There's the crate problem too... rows of crates laying on the ground don't affect your speed, but stacked crates reduce the speed if you do a horizontal spin. And don't forget that if you destroy the lower crates in a pile, any crates that fall upon you will be automatically destroyed too.
Just in the case you're feeling lazy again... watch this.
I'm looking at your new run right now, but I think you should not advance too fast. You should concentrate your attention on the small things.
"Genuine self-esteem, however, consists not of causeless feelings, but of certain knowledge about yourself.
It rests on the conviction that you — by your choices, effort and actions — have made yourself into the
kind of person able to deal with reality. It is the conviction — based on the evidence of your own volitional
functioning — that you are fundamentally able to succeed in life and, therefore, are deserving of that success."
- Onkar Ghate
Bisqwit wrote:
Before anything, I did NOT ask you if it was possible to optimize or not... I told you to DO it. You can't figure the game physics out without playing and feeling them yourself.
About the underwater stages now.
The faster speed: do a spin, wait 24 frames (or wait 2 frames before it returns to its swimming stance), boost, wait 10 frames and spin again... repeat while possible.
You can boost, wait 11 frames, boost again... repeat -- but that's a little slower.
There's the crate problem too... rows of crates laying on the ground don't affect your speed, but stacked crates reduce the speed if you do a horizontal spin. And don't forget that if you destroy the lower crates in a pile, any crates that fall upon you will be automatically destroyed too.
Just in the case you're feeling lazy again... watch this.
I'm looking at your new run right now, but I think you should not advance too fast. You should concentrate your attention on the small things.
Will do. Sorry about that. I really do apologize; I'm just stressed because of late exams that I haven't studied for and that @$#%ing Down the Hole level. Just to be clear, I'll redo the swimming levels and Down the Hole myself. I really am sorry about all this. Really.
Oh, and also:
theenglishman wrote:
It's not a requirement, but I would really appreciate the help.
Just making sure that was clear.
My current project: Something mysterious (oooooh!)
My username is all lower-case letters. Please get it right :(
Joined: 2/28/2006
Posts: 2275
Location: Milky Way -> Earth -> Brazil
Well, I didn't say "I won't help you anymore! Do it yourself!"
...
You should just take it easy... It's nothing to be stressed about... you don't need to post a WIP every day. Just find your own pace.
I like to help, but sometimes it seems you want me to figure those things for you... and that's strange, because the best part of making a speedrun is finding the best solutions yourself.
=P
"Genuine self-esteem, however, consists not of causeless feelings, but of certain knowledge about yourself.
It rests on the conviction that you — by your choices, effort and actions — have made yourself into the
kind of person able to deal with reality. It is the conviction — based on the evidence of your own volitional
functioning — that you are fundamentally able to succeed in life and, therefore, are deserving of that success."
- Onkar Ghate
Bisqwit wrote:
Hi everyone. I'm restarting work on the run again! Yay!
First, to pirate: I'm really sorry, but I'm not going to use the underwater technique. Every time I try to use it it ends up slower than a frame-perfect A-rest-A-rest. It probably is faster, but I'm sorry - I'm not going to use it.
But I will finish this 101% run and get it published as a test run, destined to be obsoleted but more of a demonstration than anything else.
I'll post a WIP once I finish Down the Hole.
My current project: Something mysterious (oooooh!)
My username is all lower-case letters. Please get it right :(
Joined: 2/28/2006
Posts: 2275
Location: Milky Way -> Earth -> Brazil
ok. I'll wait.
"Genuine self-esteem, however, consists not of causeless feelings, but of certain knowledge about yourself.
It rests on the conviction that you — by your choices, effort and actions — have made yourself into the
kind of person able to deal with reality. It is the conviction — based on the evidence of your own volitional
functioning — that you are fundamentally able to succeed in life and, therefore, are deserving of that success."
- Onkar Ghate
Bisqwit wrote:
This is another update which ends partially into Star to Finish. I'm stumped as to how to get to Yellow Gem in this level. According to my guide which I picked up, "Where the spinner is next to the stack of nitros, use it to spin left and land on the circular platform." This is where my run ends, and despite using this technique, I have not been able to grab onto a platform of any kind. Some help might be appreciated (revision: will definitely).[/url]
My current project: Something mysterious (oooooh!)
My username is all lower-case letters. Please get it right :(
