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This is a TI-83 TAS, but it's unlike anything ever submitted before. Rather than loading a game, this run writes it... and *then* TAS's it. Slowly. In all the glory the TI-8x line is (in)famous for. Also, the game is *really* broken for how short it is - it's like the result of Snake and Astroids swapping a few too many digital bits without using (memory) protection. Or something. On second thought, forget that analogy and take a gander at the source code in its entirety:
26üK
1.1üB
{4AnsüA
ClrHome
For(A,1,û2
randInt1,16)+.1randInt1,8üC
Repeat C=Ans(1
Aüdim(áA
áA(1
Output(10fPart(Ans),int(Ans),"O
Output(10fPart(B),int(B)," 
Output(10fPart(C),int(C),"*
getKey
If Ans=45
Goto 0
If Ans=34 or 2>abs(Ans-25
AnsüK
áA(AüB
áA(1)+(K=26)-(K=24)+.1K=34)-(K=25
If max(áA=Ans
Goto 0
Ans+16(not(int(Ans-(17=int(Ans)))+.8(not(fPart(Ans))-(.9=fPart(Ans
augment{Ans},áAüA
End
augmentAns,{Ans(AüA
End
Lbl 0
ClrHome
A
As ais523 put it, that's some pretty serious mojibake for anyone without the proper fonts installed, so I recommend viewing the source code from the TI Basic Developer site on the Snake wiki page if you're interested but I wanted to include it here so it's clear exactly how little code this game is derived from.

Speedcoding

The highlight of this TAS, and really, the only reason to watch it, is the speedcoding (writing source code as fast as possible) at the beginning of the run. I was inspired by Bisqwit's NES emulator speedcoding project, which I've always been amused by. When I started looking into making a TI-83 run many months ago I discovered that it was possible to load an .x8p file or create a movie but not both at the same time, so I started down the path of writing a game. I jumped in without considering the consequences and immediately got stuck because I, er, didn't *really* know how to use a TI-83 calculator, or at least not how to write a program with one. I initially thought I could literally type the commands out, but that doesn't work - after reading the TI-Basic starter kit page I discovered you have to delve into each menu, such as the Prgrm menu, and select the symbol for a For loop, or an If, and even to write a = operator. I considered writing a complex Lua script but opted to enter everything manually, and the process became much faster once I realized I had to start thinking like an EMACS user.
Of course, by doing it by hand I encountered a number of issues when I missed ) characters or mistyped list symbols and I caused myself great pain as hexing everything in kept causing desyncs. There is a substantial amount of lag that changes depending on where things are on the screen which makes hexing a nightmare. There are lag frames every time you enter a menu, every time you create a newline, pretty much lag any time you repaint the screen in any way other than writing a single character on the same line. After entering all of these commands manually I exit programming mode and enter execution mode which starts the game Snake. I opted to make no changes at all to the source code to stay faithful to the published code, although I later regretted not increasing the drawing speed.

Why I chose Snake

When I was a teenager I had a Compaq 386 20 MHz luggable with an orange plasma display and I had a copy of a math learning game called Googol. You can play Googol Googolpede here in a browser. Googolpede was a great way to practice my math facts - you'd have to run your snake into either T or F to answer questions, and it could be quite challenging - you'd have to solve the equation while avoiding walls or yourself. It left a deep imprint on me and I've enjoyed Snake ever since - I was thrilled it was highlighted at AGDQ 2014, but I digress.

About *this* variant of Snake

This simple variant of Snake has some quite interesting features considering how compact it is:
* Segmented snake parts and stuff to eat that shows up inside you!
* The ability to wrap around the edges of the screen!
* The ability to phase through body parts at the edges!
* Snake coiling!
* Really bad controls!
* RNG that isn't!
* Really slow movement that gets even slower when you press buttons!
Needless to say, the game is quite abusable, and thankfully has an obvious ending (although it takes quite a while to get there, but more on that in a moment). For starters, the game moves the head of the snake 5 frames before the end of the snake is advanced forward, as if you're growing and shrinking repeatedly. The result is you can't directly chase your own tail and you have to be one segment behind it. Additionally, after drawing your new snake location on the screen, directional button presses for the next 5 frames will impact what happens when the next segment is drawn, and button presses after that point affect what will happen after the one after that is drawn. In other words, you have to press buttons in advance, which is unnatural and annoying.

Run comments

The game starts fairly tamely in part because with only a single segment it's not like you can run into yourself but that starts becoming a problem very quickly (well, if you consider the glacial pace of this game quick). Once more than one segment shows up you start to notice that * food bits show up regardless of whether your body is already occupying that space or not, meaning you have to move yourself out of the way before you can eat it or you'll collide with yourself instead of eating the food and die, unless you're at the edge of the screen. Let me break that down:
You can wrap off the edges of the screen, and if a part of your body is at the edge of the location you're appearing at it's possible to phase through your body (i.e. you're in the same place more than once - sometimes way more than once). Sometimes when you do this your body part becomes invisible leaving land mines for you to find later if you forget where you've been. This property can be heavily abused in the four corners where it's possible to coil yourself by repeatedly phasing into yourself. I use this several times to artificially shorten the snake length, although it takes time and I was going for pure speed since this is likely only Vault material so I avoided it when possible.
It's a good time to note that the RNG isn't actually random. The first game you play will always start with the first * food piece in the lower right, and then the next position is always the same, and so on - in fact, player controls have no impact whatsoever on the RNG, so the only thing you can do is reposition where your snake body is so future *'s appear where you can get to them. This starts to get exceedingly difficult as your body grows to the point that you end up constricting where you can move.
Every time you eat a * your body grows by one and your score grows by 1, starting at 0 points. I'm not sure why yet from looking at the code but when you hit 100 points the next food piece you eat ends the game, showing the score in the upper right corner. I'm quite happy about this, as the next obvious goal choice would be to completely fill the screen which would take another 28 points and the run was way longer than I thought possible as it was.

Sync info

As I've implied above, this was created using only the calculator's 1.02 version firmware (which you can dump from an appropriately outfitted TI-83 calculator using these instructions). This run will desync if using 1.07 firmware.
So, sit back, watch the run on Turbo, and enjoy! Thanks go to adelikat for making the emulation possible and thanks to Spikestuff for the encode.

Noxxa: Claiming.
Noxxa: This is a really interesting run, and its idea of tool-assisted speedcoding to create and then run a game at once is pretty nice. However, there are a few flaws with this particular run that bring it down:
  • First of all, the resulting run is extremely slow-paced and boring to watch. It takes 20 minutes to get 100 points, which means collecting food at an average rate of five per minute, or one per 12 seconds. That is very slow. The game has no sound or visual appeal to speak of, either, as the snake entirely consists of 0s.
  • The game's "random number generation" is completely deterministic, which makes the game trivial to run - as long as you have mapped out a route (and with some practice), it is possible to do a perfect run with ease. The game's controls are bad, but not impossible to work with.
  • While the RNG is deterministic, it can still be manipulated before game start, which could lead to potentially shorter routes and faster times. Neither the author nor anyone else has tested this, but I find it unlikely that the first seed is the best seed with regards to route length. This would need to be checked before we can ascertain whether the run is optimal.
  • The code sample used to create the game in this speedcoding run is a slightly notable example of a game program, but it is by no means official and as such, there is no reason to adhere to using this version, and not a version that may be optimized to be faster, better looking, have better features, or be superior in some other way. To accept a run like this as a speedrun, we need to set criteria as to what game sources we'll allow, and there is no particularly good reason to accept this as an "official" Snake build. Therefore, this run would have to be judged like a homebrew game.
Furthermore, I don't believe tool-assisted speedcoding is a concept that should work its way to the Vault. The Vault was designed as a repository for speedruns of any game that can viably be speedrun, and speedcoding does not fit the same mold. It does not ordinarily speedrun a game, so it does not really belong in the Vault.
Even if it did qualify for the Vault, I would still hold against this run the second and fourth points outlined above, which respectively make the run fail to qualify on TAS-worthiness, and lack of sufficient notability of the game version. The third point also makes me doubt whether the run is optimal.
The tool-assisted speedcoding concept in this run would be good for a showcase run for Moons, but as outlined above, this run has many flaws that make it uninteresting to watch, which means this submission ends up with no good place on the site for it. As such, rejecting.


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I'm not sure how I feel about this run. For one, tool-assisted speedcoding is a completely unexplored area that is potentially fascinating and worth trying. This movie being first of its kind (to my knowledge, if you exclude the ACE "write-a-game" stuff) also deserves recognition for that fact alone. On the other hand, there are several very significant issues that will not be easy to work out. 1. Choice of platform. The amount of platforms where our current tools can handle both the programming environment and the end result can be counted on one hand, and frankly, all of them are horrible except DOS. TI-83 is particularly horrible because of its many limitations and the fact that it's a dead platform. 2. Choice of game. Snake isn't exactly best TASing material no matter how you put it. This particular implementation is also notable for being absolute worst at potential entertainment value. There's absolutely no reason whatsoever to watch it beyond the first ten seconds. I also dislike rulesets that allow the snake to wrap around because that makes it trivial even in realtime. 3. Obsoletion chain. Considering that writing the game is technically part of the TAS, nothing prevents a contender from writing a different game, even if it only differs slightly, to take advantage of the TAS part, because we don't have authorities on game rulesets. This issue alone warrants a discussion on whether TASVideos is the right place for tool-assisted speedcoding.
Warp wrote:
Edit: I think I understand now: It's my avatar, isn't it? It makes me look angry.
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I just realized that BizHawk only supports the TI-83, not the TI-83 Plus which also supports flash applications. I hope somebody will implement this in the future. I watched the full movie, and I've got to say that while it's interesting to see a version of Snake with screen-wrapping, I quickly lost interest in it due to the ridiculously slow pace of the game and the poor programming. I literally started doing household chores while the movie was playing and had more fun doing so, no joke. The TI-83 is not powerful hardware, and TI-BASIC is pretty slow to interpret as well. Such programs are really hard to optimize. I'm not quite sure why an assembly version was not picked to avoid the performance issue. Even when only considering TI-BASIC programs, I'm also concerned as to why this particular version of Snake was chosen. For reference, here's a list of compatible Snake programs written in TI-BASIC. As you can see, it's an overcrowded genre. Considering that anybody can easily hack a program in TI-BASIC does not help. Considering all this (excluding my concerns about this run's optimization from my last post), I decided to vote No despite the novelty. I think the TI-83 and TI-84 series are good candidates for TAS, but I also think that just like hacks or other homebrew games on this site, the game itself must be original and well-made in order to make it interesting, which isn't the case enough here in my opinion.
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SmashManiac wrote:
Even when only considering TI-BASIC programs, I'm also concerned as to why this particular version of Snake was chosen. For reference, here's a list of compatible Snake programs written in TI-BASIC.
Indeed, there are quite a number of them. Keep in mind that I had to enter everything by hand and the longer the program takes to write the longer the run would be (unless someone figures out a way to sanely wrap Lua around everything, which would be a bit of a chore). Also take note that I was deliberately picking a game that has been published for a long time to try to avoid the whole homebrew debate, although that's a fairly weak stance on my part; I don't want this to be considered homebrew for the purposes of the debate as that brings in a whole other can of worms, and this run introduces enough of those as it is. I honestly didn't realize exactly how long the run was going to end up being until I was two thirds of the way through and by that point I was committed. If there is agreement that it would be permissible to change the source code to benefit TAS'ing, in theory we could change some aspects of the code to make things go faster, but I was deliberately avoiding doing anything like that, for better or worse. Just to make it clear, I made this and I consider it about as fun as watching paint dry. It was just as bad making it, trust me. This is Vault material and a first pass at this genre in the hopes that the attention it creates gathers more interested TAS'ers. Thanks for the feedback!
I was laid off in May 2023 and became too ill to work this year and could use support via Patreon or onetime donations as work on TASBot Re: and TASBot HD is stalled. I'm dwangoAC, TASVideos Senior Ambassador and BDFL of the TASBot community; when healthy, I post TAS content on YouTube.com/dwangoAC based on livestreams from Twitch.tv/dwangoAC.
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For what it's worth, I agree with the decision of not writing an original game for this purpose. At least Snake is known and tried enough to have some kind of acceptable frame of reference with regards of code size and performance, and that is preferable in a case like this. That aside, like SmashManiac noted, using assembly would likely be the single largest improvement possible in a genre like this, and I have a suspicion that both parts of the TAS would benefit from it. Btw, mildly off-topic, but the smallest chess programs written in x86 assembly take less than a kilobyte of code (incomplete rulesets have been implemented in as little as 446 bytes, a complete one stands at 831; sources to both are available on the page), there are versions of Tetris and Helicopter in 256 bytes each, etc. Sizecoding has existed for decades, and it is a thing that translates well to tool-assistance, but sizecoding alone doesn't need tool-assistance to demonstrate its results; the second part of a TAS (i.e. clearing the game itself) is the main thing that ties it all together in a continuous movie and makes it a concept worth exploring in my opinion.
Warp wrote:
Edit: I think I understand now: It's my avatar, isn't it? It makes me look angry.
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moozooh wrote:
That aside, like SmashManiac noted, using assembly would likely be the single largest improvement possible in a genre like this, and I have a suspicion that both parts of the TAS would benefit from it.
As I've mentioned a few times it's not possible to both run a program and TAS it, which is why this started out this way in the first place. :) If you can figure out a way to get something in assembly and make a movie file with it please let me know. Thanks again for your feedback, I definitely appreciate it.
I was laid off in May 2023 and became too ill to work this year and could use support via Patreon or onetime donations as work on TASBot Re: and TASBot HD is stalled. I'm dwangoAC, TASVideos Senior Ambassador and BDFL of the TASBot community; when healthy, I post TAS content on YouTube.com/dwangoAC based on livestreams from Twitch.tv/dwangoAC.
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I second Moozooh's post, specifically regarding the obsoletion chain. Neat? Yes. Very much so. Publishable? No no no no, hell no, no, never. This opens up an ugly can of snakes worms where people keep programming their favorite game with ever-so-slight variations and then TASing them. Someone programs Snake with walls, someone else programs Snake with speedup, someone else programs Snake without wraparound, etc. We need to work with games that have some kind of standardized code. The only way I can see a TAS like this being publishable is if there were a standard version of the game that we could compare the code to. I know that there are several versions of Snake for the TI-83, so you would need to pick one of them, duplicate the program (or just have it pre-loaded), and then TAS that. I liked this run, I enjoyed the novelty of it, and I don't ever want to see it published because it will bog down the site with hundreds of crappy customized calculator games.
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Bobo the King wrote:
I know that there are several versions of Snake for the TI-83, so you would need to pick one of them, duplicate the program (or just have it pre-loaded), and then TAS that.
Actually pre-loading would defeat the purpose; existing code would need to be whiteboxed and reimplemented the same way existing TASes are. As in, you're free to analyze, modify, and copy somebody else's chunks of code if needed, but unless it shortens the overall input there is no point doing that. I'm quite sure it's possible to optimize the existing code for any of those games, and therein would be the main challenge (consider existing code as a standing record).
Warp wrote:
Edit: I think I understand now: It's my avatar, isn't it? It makes me look angry.
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The question of if this should be published is based on notability. Is this "the" snakes game for TI-83? How old is it? If the answer is "Yes" and predates this site, it is probably ok to publish.
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subanark wrote:
The question of if this should be published is based on notability. Is this "the" snakes game for TI-83? How old is it? If the answer is "Yes" and predates this site, it is probably ok to publish.
I picked this version of Snake because it had the most hits when searching and the site hosting it has a very long history, i.e. I picked the most prolific variant that has clearly been around for a while and I intentionally chose not to alter it in the hopes of avoiding the homebrew debate. Having said that, I don't have firm data to prove exactly how long this version has been floating around, other than to say it's been around the block so much that it's definitely public domain at this point. :)
I was laid off in May 2023 and became too ill to work this year and could use support via Patreon or onetime donations as work on TASBot Re: and TASBot HD is stalled. I'm dwangoAC, TASVideos Senior Ambassador and BDFL of the TASBot community; when healthy, I post TAS content on YouTube.com/dwangoAC based on livestreams from Twitch.tv/dwangoAC.
Dwedit
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TI-Basic is all a bunch of junk. Nothing good can come out of that horrid language. When you got a 6MHz Z80, you need assembly. Uncle Worm is probably the best TI83 snake game. That game uses steering instead of instant directional turning.
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Hi. It was nearly seven years ago that I drudged up the very code that found its way into this TAS. While wikified, this Snake clone is by no means an "official" version by any stretch of the imagination. The language's ease-of-access grants that there are multitudes of attempts in the wild. This one in particular was made to save face for the wiki by replacing a buggier creation that someone else had self-published. I dabbled in the concept again down the road and produced prgmBMAMBA. If you want a higher-resolution play area that doesn't slow as the tail grows longer, yet without invoking z80 Assembly, then that's what it's about. Also, for the sake of spending less time in the editor, several of those early commands assume a "dirty" environment and can omitted if typed from a memory reset. Plus, there are often 2–3 ways of typing any one token if you want to minimize keystrokes. Lastly, z80 Assembly can be entered as hexadecimal strings into the native BASIC editor and compiled. I know of some experts on that, if you're interested. Speak of the devil, I see a Dwedit.
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Weregoose wrote:
Hi. It was nearly seven years ago that I drudged up the very code that found its way into this TAS. While wikified, this Snake clone is by no means an "official" version by any stretch of the imagination. The language's ease-of-access grants that there are multitudes of attempts in the wild. This one in particular was made to save face for the wiki by replacing a buggier creation that someone else had self-published. I dabbled in the concept again down the road and produced prgmBMAMBA. If you want a higher-resolution play area that doesn't slow as the tail grows longer, yet without invoking z80 Assembly, then that's what it's about.
This is some fascinating backstory! I didn't realize that this particular version was made because an earlier version on the site was so poor. Thank you for coming to the forums to post this. How did you find out about this run, if you don't mind me asking?
Weregoose wrote:
I dabbled in the concept again down the road and produced prgmBMAMBA. If you want a higher-resolution play area that doesn't slow as the tail grows longer, yet without invoking z80 Assembly, then that's what it's about.
This is definitely possible if there is consensus that it would be a "better" choice when it comes to subjectivity; I can't say I'm chomping at the bit to do this work a second time as I'm currently focusing on AGDQ 2016 TASBot block prep but it's an interesting idea.
Weregoose wrote:
Also, for the sake of spending less time in the editor, several of those early commands assume a "dirty" environment and can omitted if typed from a memory reset. Plus, there are often 2–3 ways of typing any one token if you want to minimize keystrokes.
If there are any commands I can omit for this specific version I can probably hex them in, just let me know what is safe to delete. I did my best to find the shortest number of keystrokes for each token and then standardized on that - I was surprised to find so many things could be done in more than one way for no particularly good reason, to be honest. :)
Weregoose wrote:
Lastly, z80 Assembly can be entered as hexadecimal strings into the native BASIC editor and compiled. I know of some experts on that, if you're interested.
Now *this* is interesting - this thread repeatedly has people pontificating on being annoyed that I didn't "just run a native game" but the limitation in the emulator that prevents creating a movie in this state isn't likely to be resolved anytime soon so this is perhaps a way to make it happen. It would be awesome if we can figure out a way to use a Lua script to do the conversion automatically. I'm quite interested in this concept and would love to know more. If there are resources you can point at please do so, and thanks for the pointer!
I was laid off in May 2023 and became too ill to work this year and could use support via Patreon or onetime donations as work on TASBot Re: and TASBot HD is stalled. I'm dwangoAC, TASVideos Senior Ambassador and BDFL of the TASBot community; when healthy, I post TAS content on YouTube.com/dwangoAC based on livestreams from Twitch.tv/dwangoAC.
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I believe I played this implementation of snake (or one very similar) in high school. I suppose a different seed may allow for more corner abuse, but overall it seemed pretty well routed. The code entering portion was pretty cool, I do recall browsing through the clunky menus for operators. Yes vote from me
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dwangoAC wrote:
How did you find out about this run, if you don't mind me asking?
I've lurked here for longer than I can remember, going back to NESVideos era. Here's a thinly-adjusted, 83 (non-plus) edition of the file: BMAMBA.83p No longer a relevant version we're working with. New keypresses you'll encounter:
AxesOff, 2nd ZOOM ▼ ▼ ▼ ► ENTER
ZStandard|ZInteger, ZOOM 6|8
Xmin|Ymin, VARS 1 1|4
nMin|nMax, VARS 1 ◄ 4|5
I%|PV|PMT|FV|P/Y|C/Y, 2nd x^-1 ► 2|3|4|5|6|7
Horizontal|Vertical, 2nd PRGM 3|4
Pt-Off(|Pxl-On(|pxl-Test(, 2nd PRGM ► 2|4|7
n, 2nd 0 LOG ENTER
Finance vars have fixed locations in memory, so they're referenced measurably faster than the letter variables. Same story goes with the Seq iterators (n, nMin, nMax), plus those assume integer values only. At any rate, see the level of elasticity that any TI-83/84/+/C/SE submission will present -- it'd require a high level of renown and canonicity of whatever is being messed with on these devices for the results to transcend mere concept status. But I agree with you that Snake is an OK choice for a practice piece. To motivate working in ASM, there is a backdoor on the TI-83 that surreptitiously begins with Send(9... Regrettably, as a pure–TI-Basic devotee, I'm lacking in details, so I must redirect you to the folks at Cemetech where they can tell you more. Edit: Oh yes, and this version doesn't have wrap-around. We appreciate constraints, don't we?
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Brilliant. Ever since I learned about the problems with TI-83 TASing, I thought it would be great to do a speedcode TAS that then plays the game. I agree that Snake is not the best choice, but I'm voting Yes because this is a great proof of concept. Perhaps Drugwars would be another good game choice for the TI-83?
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Chamale wrote:
Perhaps Drugwars would be another good game choice for the TI-83?
Is that a TI-Basic game? I'm.. not at all familiar with it and the name seems unappealing to me but I'll take your word for it. :) I'm more interested in the BMAMBA variant but I won't be taking on anything else myself for the time being while I focus on AGDQ 2016 preparations. Thanks for the feedback!
I was laid off in May 2023 and became too ill to work this year and could use support via Patreon or onetime donations as work on TASBot Re: and TASBot HD is stalled. I'm dwangoAC, TASVideos Senior Ambassador and BDFL of the TASBot community; when healthy, I post TAS content on YouTube.com/dwangoAC based on livestreams from Twitch.tv/dwangoAC.
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Should've saved this for *cough* *cough*, dwango... The idea may seem novel at first ("Ooh, look! It's a never-before-TASed system!"), but when you put it into practice, it just... ehhhh. I'm sorry if I come across as a total jerk by saying this, but this movie is unwatchable. You write the code into the calculator, and play the game for twenty minutes. Problem is, due to the sheer limitations of the system, the program itself runs as slow as molasses, and there is no sound. In addition, there already exists a movie of a different, more graphically advanced port of Snake which makes TASing it on the TI-83 entirely redundant and superfluous. I'm afraid I can't vote any better than a No. Were this to be submitted on you-know-which-day, it would have been entirely fine. However, it wasn't, and I'm going to leave it at that.
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om, nom, nom... minty!
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Please note that I created User movie #26379843736052819 based on work from Weregoose and scahfy which implements a different version of Snake named BMAMBA but in the process Weregoose determined that the emulation in Bizhawk is about half the speed of what it should be. Before I attempt another TI-83 run the emulation speed needs to be resolved but I think this alternate version is worth looking at as it uses a Lua loader to make the programming process far faster.
I was laid off in May 2023 and became too ill to work this year and could use support via Patreon or onetime donations as work on TASBot Re: and TASBot HD is stalled. I'm dwangoAC, TASVideos Senior Ambassador and BDFL of the TASBot community; when healthy, I post TAS content on YouTube.com/dwangoAC based on livestreams from Twitch.tv/dwangoAC.