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Former player
Joined: 3/13/2004
Posts: 706
Location: Elyria/Oberlin, OH
Well, don't forget, this was a legitimate speedrun done on a SNES. No slowdown/rerecords available. -Josh
but then you take my 75 perchance chance of winning, if we was to go one-on-one, and then add 66 and two-thirds ch...percents...i got a 141 and two-thirds chance of winning at sacrifice
Player (70)
Joined: 8/24/2004
Posts: 2562
Location: Sweden
Yeah! Still though he could have used more training, especially on the moving part. I mean. He runs into walls and stuff and get's stuck there for like a second some times. Even on hardware SNES it could have been made faster. Allso he fiddles some in the menues which seems pretty dumb. Still though, good for being on hardware anyways. I don't think I could have beat him without much training. Still think he could have made some things better though.
Joined: 8/12/2004
Posts: 42
Location: Washington, DC
550 MB at 2 kb/sec? I do NOT think so. Look, here are some more tips. If an enemy attacks you with a physical attack, it is completely possible to reduce the damage to 0. If you can get a Rock Candy, be sure to use it as much as possible without letting it disappear, since it does 200 HP to all of the enemies. Mallow's Thunder attack OWNS the ghosts on the sunken ship. If you do go for the 100 jumps, be sure to get the Super Suit and Jump Scarf ASAP. It helps a LOT. The board on GameFAQs has all kinds of stuff on it so I'll be sure to look at that.
Former player
Joined: 3/13/2004
Posts: 706
Location: Elyria/Oberlin, OH
But the ghosts on the sunken ship shouldn't be an issue. Fire bombs are much more valuable for that area, as they work wonders against King Calamari's tentacles and Johnny's henchmen. I notice in the run that he gets the Lazy Shell weapon but not the armor...would a timeattack require both or neither? -Josh
but then you take my 75 perchance chance of winning, if we was to go one-on-one, and then add 66 and two-thirds ch...percents...i got a 141 and two-thirds chance of winning at sacrifice
Former player
Joined: 8/1/2004
Posts: 2687
Location: Seattle, WA
The Lazy Shell weapon is the strongest weapon for Mario, so its necessary for efficiency. The Lazy Shell armor, although good defense wise, detracts from other stats. Whatever armor Mario is using in the end of the game is the most useful armor available.
hi nitrodon streamline: cyn-chine
Former player
Joined: 3/13/2004
Posts: 706
Location: Elyria/Oberlin, OH
Ah, thanks. Here's something else I wondered: Why doesn't he get Bowser or Geno's best weapons? Do those Bowser's Keep stages take too long? -Josh
but then you take my 75 perchance chance of winning, if we was to go one-on-one, and then add 66 and two-thirds ch...percents...i got a 141 and two-thirds chance of winning at sacrifice
Joined: 9/29/2004
Posts: 39
Has anyone here actually started doing a SMRPG timeattack? I started one yesterday, but I will probably not be able to finish one anytime soon, as I can probably only work on it for maybe an hour per day, and I've never done a timeattack before so I'll probably be going pretty slow at the start. However, I've played through this game dozens of times since I was a kid, and I know just about every trick out there (at least as much as most of the faq-writers on gamefaqs, since I've read through most of them at some point). As I've started though, I've realized that this is going to be hugely complicated for the sake of planning ahead. There are two things you have to balance in how fast you are able to get through the game: skipping things that build up your character's power, and beating each boss as quickly as possible. I was also initially a bit worried that I might get myself into a situation where no matter how many times I restore state, the boss kills me, but after thinking about it I realized that given the fact that the game is beatable with Mario at level 3, I don't think that would be an issue. What is more of an issue is that if I end up skipping too much stuff, I will end up taking more time to defeat bosses, wheras if I spend more time building up, I can defeat bosses more easily, but it takes longer. I'm hoping to strike as good a balance as I can, but it's going to take a lot of both long-term and short term planning. After viewing the 3:55 movie, I'm convinced it can be done in FAR less time, because there are a number of tricks I don't think he utilized to their potential or not at all, even besides the fact that it wasn't tool-assisted. There are a few things I still want to know about the game that I haven't seen covered in any FAQs or guides, or maybe just not the ones I've read. I'll throw some of these out there to see if anyone knows... 1. How much damage does a pure water do to Zombor if you use it against him? Is the damage affected by "attack up" status (Geno Boost, Energizer, Power Blast, Quartz Charm, etc)? 2. Does item-induced "attack up" status stack with the Geno Boost? (Same applies for "defense up"). My guess is no, but I can't quite remember if I've ever tested that for sure. 3. Is there a list of the exact magic/attack power/ defense power of every boss in the game anywhere? It would be helpful for planning's sake to know these things in advance so I can prepare better for each boss. 4. Does anyone have savestates from the game throughout different points? They would be helpful so I can test different things in advance, again for the sake of planning ahead. 5. At what points are random events seeded? In particular: - Who an enemy attacks, what type of attack the enemy uses, how much damage the enemy does, whether attacks hit or miss - Whether the "lucky" egg game is for EXP or coins A aesthetic question: in the 3:55 recording, the author states that he doesn't use the get-a-star-and-die technique on purpose. Would people consider it "cheap" or otherwise degrade the quality of a time-attack if I did this? For the record, I am thinking about only doing it once in Land's End/Belome's Temple, since at that point you can get two stars in a row and die at Belome rather quickly, whereas the stars in Bandit's Way and Kero Sewers are not really worth doubling. I am undecided on the one in The Sea as well. Josh: in response to your last question here, I assume he doesn't get Bowser or Geno's best weapons because in order to get them, he would have to go through the two "battle" doors of the six in Bowser's keep, which are the two longest.
Former player
Joined: 6/27/2004
Posts: 550
Location: New York
I've asked this recently about a different game, but does this one use L+R+Start+Select? If so maybe you could use it. If not, I think dying after getting a star would be fine if you can make it so that you will only need to take a single hit after getting the star in order to die. Unless getting a star heals you, I forget. It's been awhile.
Former player
Joined: 4/16/2004
Posts: 1276
Location: Uppsala, Sweden
?I? ?t?h?i?n?k? ?t?h?i?s? ?i?s? ?t?h?e? ?k?i?n?d?a? ?g?a?m?e? ?t?h?a?t? ?w?i?l?l? ?r?e?q?u?i?r?e? ?l?o?a?d?s? ?o?f? ?t?i?m?e? ?t?o? ?g?e?t? ?a? ?g?o?o?d? ?m?o?v?i?e? ?o?u?t? ?o?f? ?i?t?.? ?A?n?d? ?i?f? ?i?t??s? ?y?o?u?r? ?f?i?r?s?t? ?t?i?m?e? ?a?t?t?a?c?k?,? ?m?a?k?e? ?s?u?r?e? ?i?t??s? ?g?o?o?d? ?f?r?o?m? ?t?h?e? ?s?t?a?r?t? ?;?)? ?I? ?t?a?l?k? ?o?f? ?e?x?p?e?r?i?e?n?c?e?,? ?i?t??s? ?n?o?t? ?t?h?a?t? ?f?u?n? ?t?o? ?r?e?a?l?i?z?e? ?a?f?t?e?r? ?2?0? ?h?o?u?r?s? ?y?o?u? ?h?a?v?e? ?t?o? ?s?t?a?r?t? ?a?l?l? ?o?v?e?r? ?a?g?a?i?n? ?;?)? ?A?n?y?w?a?y?s?,? ?I? ?w?i?s?h? ?y?o?u? ?g?o?o?d? ?l?u?c?k?!?
/Walker Boh
Player (70)
Joined: 8/24/2004
Posts: 2562
Location: Sweden
I don't think including dying or resetting is cool. I think it should be avoided at all times, besides in that kewl Rygar run. :D
Joined: 4/26/2004
Posts: 213
Location: Montréal, Québec
I suggest you do a test run first without worrying about getting frame perfection and perfect menu handling.
Former player
Joined: 7/14/2004
Posts: 104
How long does snes9x allow you to record for? I once recorded 2+ hours of something, and it no longer recognised the save states as part of the movie. The SMV file had just exceeded 1,000,000 bytes at that point. Can't it record for longer than 2 hours?
Former player
Joined: 5/22/2004
Posts: 462
Player (70)
Joined: 8/24/2004
Posts: 2562
Location: Sweden
Heh.. I hate limits. Worst thing ever invented! :D
Former player
Joined: 5/22/2004
Posts: 462
blah double post
Former player
Joined: 5/22/2004
Posts: 462
Calculus is the bomb-diggity
Joined: 8/31/2004
Posts: 298
Location: Falun, Sweden
Could you explain what you ment whit that?
Bein' away for like five years, and not a single new post in the ZSNES forum... :'-(
Former player
Joined: 5/31/2004
Posts: 375
It's a limit.
Joined: 4/26/2004
Posts: 213
Location: Montréal, Québec
Dan_ wrote:
lim       f(x)=(x-2)/((x^2)-4) = (x-2)/(x+2)(x-2) = 1/(x+2)  = 1/4
(x -> 2) 
fixed
Former player
Joined: 5/22/2004
Posts: 462
Don't laugh at me because I made a stupid mistake... (my teacher would kill me for that :) ) I can still do this though
lim              f(x + Δx) - f(x)
(Δx -> 0)        ----------------
                        Δx
And now back to your regularly scheduled Mario RPG discussion.
Former player
Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 706
actually, you should include the limit signs in each step up until you substitute in the end otherwise they don't logically follow. And yes, I'm being overly pedantic. :P
lim           (x-2)/((x^2)-4) 
(x -> 2) 

= lim        (x-2)/(x+2)(x-2) 
   (x -> 2)  
 
= lim         1/(x+2)  
   (x -> 2)   

= 1/4
Joined: 9/29/2004
Posts: 39
Getting back to the *recording* limits, one possibility I had thought of was exploiting the passage from the Kero Sewers to Land's End to skip over half the game, and therefore I was thinking it would be conceivable to do a game in around an hour or less, especially with Star/death abuse right afterwards in Land's End, to level up from essentially level 2 or 3 to the teens, 100-jump Belome2, then get the Super Suit and Attack Scarf in Monstro Town, making the rest of the game more brute force. However, I've been trying possible ways of jumping the cliff with the Shyguy in the sewer passage section of Land's End, and I haven't met with any success. If any of you is able to do this, please let me know. (The idea is on the first run through of Kero Sewers, you jump on top of a ghost, run away from battle, and as soon as you go back to the main screen, jump again in midair to reach the inaccessible pipe to go to Land's End... but then you're stuck by a cliff). So this means that the run is probably going to take at least two hours of gametime, and I run the possibility of exceeding SNES9X's current limit. I may be able to do it without exceeding the limit, but that remains to be seen. If I do hit the limit, would I be able to continue recording using the next version of SNES9X when it comes out?
Joined: 9/29/2004
Posts: 39
Ok, I've started doing a trial run through the entire game as others have suggested before actually recording everything, and I'm glad I chose to do so. This is effectively letting me decide exactly how I'm going to play each battle in advance, so the only thing I'll have to do when I'm actually recording is the platform aspects of the game - getting from point A to point B as quickly as possible. One thing I'm still uncertain about is whether to defeat Culex or not. In the live Speedrun, he doesn't, but that's because it would be extremely difficult and time consuming to do so in real time until later in the game, which would then involve going back to Monstro Town, and wouldn't be worth it as much by then. However, I would be able to do so the first time I get to Monstro Town - I would get the Super Suit and Attack Scarf, equip them on Mario, then perform 100 Super Jumps on Culex before Culex even gets to bring his crystals into the battle. This should get rid of about half his hitpoints. Then Geno does a Geno Boost on Mario, Bowser uses the Lucky Jewel, and Mario does as many Super Jumps on Culex as is necessary to kill him. Battle complete in essentially a single round of combat (everyone would have gotten to attack once, except Mario who went twice). The pros of doing this would be : - 488 Experience per character, which would guarantee to level up everyone at least once, some of them twice at the level I would be at then - Quartz Crystal, which is a GREAT item, since it increases all your stats by 150%, making you much more powerful, and enabling you to defeat enemies much more quickly. Note that a timed Geno Boost does the same thing, however the disadvantage of a timed Geno Boost is that it uses up a turn of battle for Geno that he could be attacking, which IMO is a waste for all battles except maybe the final Smithy Battle, since the battle could be over shorter if Geno was able to use his turn to deal damage. In particular, I plan on giving this item to Bowser, which will make him much more effective for the rest of the game. The con of course is that it would take about 4 minutes maybe. (about 150 super jumps plus one round of enemy combat) Any ideas of whether this would be worth it or not? I can time the battle when I get to it to see just how long it ends up, but it would be a real pain to do one trial run with defeating culex and one trial run without, especially since that would affect how I spent my money toward the beginning of the game - with culex I would need to have enough money to get the Shiny Stone plus the Lucky Jewel by the time I left Moleville (which I can easily do, btw). Any suggestions? (By the way, I've since answered all my questions from my first post on this thread)
Player (70)
Joined: 8/24/2004
Posts: 2562
Location: Sweden
If you ask me I would love to see Culex get a big spank. I've always enjoyed played against him in the actual game. To see him killed in a matter of minnutes would be even more fun, since I'm used to battle him aprox 10 minutes or so. :D For the time though.. Not sure if it will be worth it. You would need to test it out. If it decreases ending the game with one second or just a frame it will be well worth spent if you ask me. I would vote to go for Culex no matter what anyways. Cheers!
Joined: 10/9/2004
Posts: 18
Hello all, I noticed you guys talking about my run. I'm glad you enjoyed it and yeah, I know it's not perfect, but I think my movement in the overworld was pretty smooth for the most part EXCEPT on some of the flower launchers. A funny thing about those is that I usually did those well but when I messed up I wouldn't restart because later on things get crazier. I was just so happy to finally get past a boss or whatnot and left it in. Oh well. Another thing is "fiddling around in the menu." I'm assuming this is during the fights...the fights are fairly random, so sometimes I need to look at what I have and see how long I can last before having to use something. It'd be much easier on an emu since you could just start the battles over until everything falls into place perfectly. I don't get the weapons in Bowser's Keep because that's a good 20+ minutes of fighting for nothing of real value (Bowser/Geno's attack values are pretty low, another 10 or whatever won't help much -- Mario does the heavy lifting, anyway). I'm interested in the shortcut to Land's End from Kero Kero, I've never heard of it...is it real or conjecture? What happens when you come out the other side? Can you access all the towns and locales between Kero Kero and Land's End or is it all blocked off? Do you automatically get the stars and the Princess/Bowser/Geno or do you finish the game with just Mallow? That sounds freakishly weird, I never knew you could do that...sounds pretty amusing. As for the star-death trick, I'm pretty confident that Radix wouldn't allow that on the SDA, maybe as a separate category. And for my purposes it would slow me down anyway since I beat the game fine without using it. However, when combined with the above trick (if it exists??) could certainly allow someone to beat the game in an insanely fast time. I can only imagine how fast someone levels up there when they're level 4 or whatever, lol. David "marshmallow" Gibbons http://www.gamefaqs.com/features/recognition/1486.html http://www.planetquake.com/sda/other/other.html
David "marshmallow" Gibbons
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