the speed tricks should save more than 10 seconds, I think. it should speed up pirate's fortress a bit and GBT boss key skip
I'll try to go on with the route now
We could also push PF+GBT after SHT and throw a Zora game back in there. This way we should be able to do the speed tricks and have enough money to do snowhead first.
I think this way should come out ahead of the others. What do you guys think?
We SoS out of PF at least once anyway. Where we SoS does not matter...
Edit:
Ah no doesn't work. We would have to little Chus for SHT... sorry
But I'm still nto convinced, that those speed tricks will save more than 10 seconds. I would really like to see your calculation on that.
The 50 Rupees after STT take MUCH less than 10 seconds.
As you can see in this video, shooting the guay after the temple takes less than 3 seconds. Equipping the light arrows also takes about 3 seconds. The light arrows are unequipped when reequipping the explosives for SHT, so no time is lost there. That plus the slower Twinmold battle comes to a total of no more than 10 seconds.
Also, we skip 7 bomb timers and a superflip by using up all the bombchus, a total of about 20+ seconds. Even without factoring in the extra required rupees, STT first still looks to be faster. And again, we have to get those 10 rupees between buying explosives for SHT and buying explosives for STT. 10 rupees will be more feasible than 50 in the temple, but I don't believe there is a place where they can be collected quickly.
EDIT: Fixed video link
EDIT2: Not to mention, STT last would require an extra bomb drop inside the temple, and that would cost about 3-4 seconds. Seems pretty clear.
We could also push PF+GBT after SHT and throw a Zora game back in there. This way we should be able to do the speed tricks and have enough money to do snowhead first.
I think this way should come out ahead of the others. What do you guys think?
We SoS out of PF at least once anyway. Where we SoS does not matter...
Edit:
Ah no doesn't work. We would have to little Chus for SHT... sorry
But I'm still nto convinced, that those speed tricks will save more than 10 seconds. I would really like to see your calculation on that.
we are able to do Snowhead as the second temple with our current route already.
We have enough explosives after Milk Road and PF part1, but it should be still best to do WT in one trip, then GBT, then STT and finally SHT
The 50 Rupees after STT take MUCH less than 10 seconds.
As you can see in my video, shooting the guay after the temple takes less than 3 seconds. Equipping the light arrows also takes about 3 seconds. The light arrows are unequipped when reequipping the explosives for SHT, so no time is lost there. That plus the slower Twinmold battle comes to a total of no more than 10 seconds.
No we can't combine it since we have a 3-item limit.
Going to snowhead after STT would be fastest like this:
at twinmold battle we equip: Fire Arrows, Ocarina, Deku mask
warp to Ct buy stuff, yadda yadda, warp to Woodfall, get over to FF,
at Fairy fountain equip: Chus, Bombs
with your way we have one item slot to little and we have to switch out the normal Arrows against light arrows, which ads a whole new start-screen, which results in it being 10 seconds (ok maybe 8).
If we do Snowhead before STT we definatly save a full quip-cycle.
Which makes both ways about even, imo.
Also, we skip 7 bomb timers and a superflip by using up all the bombchus, a total of about 20+ seconds. Even without factoring in the extra required rupees, STT first still looks to be faster. And again, we have to get those 10 rupees between buying explosives for SHT and buying explosives for STT. 10 rupees will be more feasible than 50 in the temple, but I don't believe there is a place where they can be collected quickly.
With 10 Chus more we can substitute 5 Mega hovers with normal hovers (normal hovers eat up Chus like they are nothing).
3 normal hovers span the distance of 1 mega hover. A mega hover takes 5 seconds, a normal hover 1 second.
So on every substituted mega hover we save 2 seconds. Since we can substitute only 5 Mega hovers that makes 10 seconds saved total.
I did my math here. ;)
For what else? There is only one spot where we can do a recoild flip afaik.
Look I'm not here to kill everybodys buzz or something. I just want to make sure that we have the best possible route...
If you can convince me that you save more than 10 seconds (15 would be good, 20 perfect.) through the extra chus, I'm faster on board than you can look.
I don't suppose someone could invent a chu megaflip hover? ;)
that's possible, I think
I'll try some stuff mega flip and hyperspeed ESS stuff tomorrow
oh, and here's one example of what we can do with the bombchus:
bombchu superslide through barrels over to hookshot
and there are more uses, I think ;)
No we can't combine it since we have a 3-item limit.
Going to snowhead after STT would be fastest like this:
at twinmold battle we equip: Fire Arrows, Ocarina, Deku mask
warp to Ct buy stuff, yadda yadda, warp to Woodfall, get over to FF,
at Fairy fountain equip: Chus, Bombs
STT first we wouldn't have the fire arrows, so it'd be
- At Twinmold: Arrows, keep bombs and bombchus on
- After Twinmold dies: Light Arrows, Ocarina, Deku Mask
- At Fairy Fountain: Hookshot, Chus, Bombs
One extra pause.
Slowking wrote:
Azorae wrote:
Also, we skip 7 bomb timers and a superflip by using up all the bombchus, a total of about 20+ seconds. Even without factoring in the extra required rupees, STT first still looks to be faster. And again, we have to get those 10 rupees between buying explosives for SHT and buying explosives for STT. 10 rupees will be more feasible than 50 in the temple, but I don't believe there is a place where they can be collected quickly.
With 10 Chus more we can substitute 5 Mega hovers with normal hovers (normal hovers eat up Chus like they are nothing).
3 normal hovers span the distance of 1 mega hover. A mega hover takes 5 seconds, a normal hover 1 second.
So on every substituted mega hover we save 2 seconds. Since we can substitute only 5 Mega hovers that makes 10 seconds saved total.
I did my math here. ;)
The chus used, specifically, are:
2 extras to cross gap in pirate's fortress (instead of superflipping) (2 seconds)
1 to recoil flip into first egg (instead of using a bomb) (4 seconds)
1 to recoil flip to the third egg (instead of using a bomb) (3.5 seconds)
2 to hover out of bounds in PF to the fourth egg (instead of using 2 bombs) (7 seconds)
2 to hover out of bounds in GBT (instead of using 2 bombs) (7 seconds)
Skipping those would still leave us with only 9, meaning an extra bomb hover in SHT (4 seconds)
Plus, if we leave SHT with less than 8 bombs, we'll have to get the bomb drop near the Ikana owl to be able to superslide into Stone Tower, costing another 2.5 seconds at least.
Total time lost by saving 9 chus for SHT first: ~27.5 seconds
Total time lost by doing STT first: ~10 seconds.
EDIT:
MrGrunz wrote:
bombchu superslide through barrels over to hookshot
How exactly is this done? does it require a bomb as well, or just a bombchu recoil flip->ESS or something similar?
at the first ikana trip, we SS to do owl, sidehop to the plant, pull out bomb, recoil flip down to the river
normal SSes are still faster than hyper ESSing, because you have to wait 5 frames longer until you can start sliding + you need to change your angle for the roll at first, so you are able to slide in the direction you want
because of the new hyper slide thing, we have to change our route a little bit again. it should be also better to use a bomb in deku palace now, because you can immediately pull out the bomb, when you begin sliding
in case if somebody wonders, we can do mega flips and hyper ESSes without bombs just with enemys or bombchus:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sL0oF1lirPa&fmt=22
the hyper ESS from enemys could be useful.
maybe a leaver ESSes after zora mask to north bay or a deku baba ESS to the big octo
I like the video better this way http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uPy0N3-NKr0&fmt=22&flip=1 :D
Well to do it with chus doesn't do us much good since you have to wait for them to go off and for that you can just use a bomb. Unless you can do a megaflip from them in the air without haveing to wait that they go off. That could save time in the PF...
