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Posted: 6/9/2006 1:52 PM
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Bag_of_Magic_Food
He/Him
Active player (277)
Joined: 5/29/2004
Posts: 5712
Well, even still, I saw real gameplay videos that used the look-down tactic, and I'm pretty sure they were just going for the in-game time.
put yourself in my rocketpack if that poochie is one outrageous dude
Posted: 6/12/2006 3:07 AM
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nfq
Player (93)
Joined: 5/10/2005
Posts: 1204
there's a way to save like 2 seconds on dam: Ramza0071: for the lock Ramza0071: use kf7, waste like 10 bullets at you pass by the lock Ramza0071: guess what happens The Illu: door is open in the tunnel =-O Ramza0071: yes The Illu: omfg Ramza0071: that door before you tag the computer Ramza0071: that slow ass door is wide open Ramza0071: it works almost all the time Ramza0071: problem is Ramza0071: at least 1 or 2 guards more are in the tunnel
Youtube channel | Goldeneye and PD TAS times
Posted: 6/12/2006 9:58 AM
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Rising_Tempest
Player (166)
Joined: 4/27/2006
Posts: 304
Location: Eastern Canada
Time to leave, Dr Doak. Total time for the facility is 54 seconds. I was able to finish the level at 48 secs,,, but had to wait for the objective with Trevelyan to complete. I tried to be entertaining while I waited. If anyone knows of a way to speed up his dialogue, this time could be improved by up to six seconds. There are two places where I miss (a lot) on purpose. This was to get guards to open doors. I have a shitload of free time tomorrow, so I should have the Runway done within 24 hours. Now, I'm gonna to bed.
Posted: 6/12/2006 10:05 AM
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Wouter_Jansen
Joined: 10/31/2005
Posts: 329
Location: The Netherlands
for runway, use the grenade strat, that means, pick up grenades at start and skip the tank and use these for the drones. the first 3 drones been done this way in 37ish speed, it's just the last drone you'd need to work out then.
Posted: 6/12/2006 10:12 AM
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Wouter_Jansen
Joined: 10/31/2005
Posts: 329
Location: The Netherlands
wips are useless to me, game keeps running slow and again the guard shot in first dam tunnel misses, he gets a backboost and then strafes into the wall. if you want my input for each level, your best bet is to make separate videos of each one, in avi.
Posted: 6/12/2006 11:10 AM
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Halamantariel
Player (104)
Joined: 1/30/2005
Posts: 562
Location: Québec, Canada
Wouter Jansen wrote:
wips are useless to me, game keeps running slow and again the guard shot in first dam tunnel misses, he gets a backboost and then strafes into the wall.
Make sure the "Raw data" checkbox is UNCHECKED for correct playback of this movie. I think that might be your problem because he did the same thing you described when I watched it with the option checked. Hope it works!
Posted: 6/12/2006 6:35 PM
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Wouter_Jansen
Joined: 10/31/2005
Posts: 329
Location: The Netherlands
hmm that worked yeah it still runs slow though and I don't feel like rewatching all prior levels every time. facility; you sure you opened all doors asap? nice warp through 2nd door after 3 guards in hallway don't do such a huge strafe change for doak Trev can be right at the stairs when you come down you can destroy all tanks with just 2 mines and use 3 mines for boosting I'm sure you could do straighter lines in some places, like when leaving console
Posted: 6/13/2006 5:58 AM
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Ersatz
Joined: 8/9/2004
Posts: 139
Location: Washington State
I like everything i see
Posted: 6/13/2006 6:10 AM
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BillBull
Former player
Joined: 5/22/2004
Posts: 462
Same here. This is quickly becoming my most anticipated movie yet. Keep up the good work, Rising Tempest!!
Posted: 6/13/2006 7:08 PM
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Ersatz
Joined: 8/9/2004
Posts: 139
Location: Washington State
could we get another AVI WIP?
Posted: 6/17/2006 12:56 AM
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Rising_Tempest
Player (166)
Joined: 4/27/2006
Posts: 304
Location: Eastern Canada
Small update. I've managed to complete the runway with a less than stellar 0:39 using the grenade strat. While the movement I used is much less than optimal, and loses 2 or 3 seconds, the most optimal path this way is impossible, simply due to the sheer amount of damge the drones do, and their infallible accuracy at close range (which happens to be how close you need to be to throw the 'nade far enough). The way I moved through the level, I was able to "fake out" the drones to not get ripped to pieces while I threw the grenades. Still, a faster time with this method seems incredibly unlikely. So, I will likely redo the level using the tank strat, I should end up with 38,,, maybe 37 seconds. I'll also have the surface done as well by the time I have a new WIP up,,, it's a pretty simple level. In addition, it seems I may be able to improve the time on the previous levels, maybe by a second or two on the dam, and if I played the facility perfectly, I might make 53. But I'm a lazy bastard, so I'll do all that in a second run at a later time.
Posted: 6/17/2006 2:48 AM
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nfq
Player (93)
Joined: 5/10/2005
Posts: 1204
For surface, you could try boosting with the grenade launcher while backstrafing, that way you don't lose much health.
Youtube channel | Goldeneye and PD TAS times
Posted: 6/18/2006 9:24 PM
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Rising_Tempest
Player (166)
Joined: 4/27/2006
Posts: 304
Location: Eastern Canada
Fire in the hole!! I've finally got a runway playthrough I'm pleased with. I must've started over from outside the hut 7 times,,, and the last throw for the missile battery took 3 hours to get right. I was able to fail a 0:36 without the missile battery being destroyed, but because of the grenade's four second fuse I had to wait. I had also tried blowing it up when I passed by on my way up the runway, but I had to break out of my line to do so, and I actually lost time, though I don't have to wait at the plane this way. The surface is next, and it probably wont take as long as this did to complete. It's a kind of boring level for a speedrun, but I will try to make it interesting anyway I can.
Posted: 6/18/2006 10:30 PM
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Wouter_Jansen
Joined: 10/31/2005
Posts: 329
Location: The Netherlands
PLEASE make save states at the end of each level and upload them.. unless you redid the first 2 levels, then I said nothing.
Posted: 6/19/2006 8:53 AM
Post subject: Uhh...
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pirate_sephiroth
Active player (308)
Joined: 2/28/2006
Posts: 2275
Location: Milky Way -> Earth -> Brazil
New systems TAS of 2009
It's really cool, but... Why Bond's always staring at the ground? Did he lose his contact lens?
"Genuine self-esteem, however, consists not of causeless feelings, but of certain knowledge about yourself. It rests on the conviction that you — by your choices, effort and actions — have made yourself into the kind of person able to deal with reality. It is the conviction — based on the evidence of your own volitional functioning — that you are fundamentally able to succeed in life and, therefore, are deserving of that success." - Onkar Ghate
Bisqwit wrote:
Drama, too long, didn't read, lol.
Posted: 6/19/2006 11:29 AM
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nfq
Player (93)
Joined: 5/10/2005
Posts: 1204
Did you try to do 37 with the tank, that might have been easier. Maybe you should test if looking at the ground saves ingame time since many people seem annoyed by that. It obviously saves frames, but because this game lags so much, the frame counter doesn't seem to match with the ingame time. I made avi's of Facility and Runway
Wouter Jansen wrote:
PLEASE make save states at the end of each level and upload them..
You can make your own save states if you want.
Youtube channel | Goldeneye and PD TAS times
Posted: 6/19/2006 4:25 PM
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Mitjitsu
He/Him
Banned User, Experienced player (532)
Joined: 4/24/2006
Posts: 2997
TAS of 2007 N64 TAS of 2007
Pretty good Tempest, you only need two mines for the gas tanks and there wasn't really anything to fault in the runway. What setup are you using out of intersest because the movements are very un-N64 like. Surface should be easy, the only difficulty it will cause is the long diagonal sequences which have to be done without twiching to alter the path. I tested it a while ago but could remember the outcome, but is it possible to blow the padlocks in surface with a grenade. Its good to see that you maximised your use of damage boosts from all perpectinves.
Posted: 6/19/2006 6:24 PM
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Wren
He/Him
Joined: 4/11/2005
Posts: 196
Location: Michigan
I am enjoying the run so far... but I really do not approve of looking at the floor so much. Usually I'm all for doing things as fast as possible, but not in this case. It really takes too much away from the movie. The viewer gets no sense of what is about to happen and then bam, there's like a 1 second look up, 1 shot, an Ugh, and then you look back at the floor. Goldeneye is easily one of my favorite N64 games, and I was even part of The Elite for awhile... and I just can't stand seeing things played out like that. If the quality of the movie continues as is, I'd probably vote Yes, as I respect the amount of work this takes to make; but I really do not consider this publish worthy due to not being entertaining. It's one thing to reduce lag, it's another to eliminate 90% of the games visuals.
<i>A little rudeness and disrespect can elevate a meaningless interaction to a battle of wills and add drama to an otherwise dull day.</i>
Posted: 6/19/2006 7:55 PM
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Rising_Tempest
Player (166)
Joined: 4/27/2006
Posts: 304
Location: Eastern Canada
Ok,,, I have the surface done, did it just now, it wasn't too tough. Didn't get as many boosts from guards as I could, but to manipulate boosts from them I had to stray too far from my lines, and I actually lost a couple frames. Boosting with the grenade launcher from behind doesn't really work either,, I thought of shooting it straight up so it would land behind me as I run forward, but the sky and trees are very messed up, at least on my pathetic computer. The textures look MUCH better in the avi's NFQ has made than on my computer, so I think it is just my computer being a douchebag. AKA, I am aware that it only takes two mines to blow up the tanks. I should've used the extra mine somewhere in the level, but didn't think to. Wren, I understand that the lookdown does detract from the movie a bit. I will try not to do it as much hereon. I used it a lot on the Surface, but the sky looks wierd in an emulator, so it may not be a bad idea there,,, Next three levels will not have any lookdown. I think,,, I may make a playthrough of Dam agent with and without lookdown, to see if there actually is a timing difference. Depending on the result, I may consider starting over, though I have put a lot of time into this already. Oh yeah, and Wouter, I could upload savestates for you, if you don't want to make your own. Only, I will only have one up at a time due to hosting restrictions. It may be easier to get them through MSN from me,,, my address is jack_the_second@hotmail.com. I will put up the next WIP when I finish Bunker,,, likely around this time tomorrow, since I will start on it right now. EDIT: Forgot to mention,,, final time on the surface was 1:50. ADDITIONAL EDIT: AKA, the setup I am using is as follows: B - A A - S Z - D L - Q R - W Start-Enter C buttons- ^V<> Joystick Up- U Joystick Down-J Joystick Left-G Joystick Right-K I manually modify how far the joystick is pressed in the input, usually all the way, 99, unless I have to aim or not go so far to get the straightest line..
Posted: 6/19/2006 8:07 PM
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Ersatz
Joined: 8/9/2004
Posts: 139
Location: Washington State
Thank you nfq for encoding... Is the AVI of the runway Tempest's redone version or the original? It looks great from what I can see. About the facility, do you have to wait for "objective D complete" to totally leave the screen at the end there? or is there another objective that has to clear after that?
Posted: 6/19/2006 11:13 PM
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Unknown_User
Joined: 1/1/2022
Posts: 1716
Regarding lookdown, on the console version of GE it defenitely does save time. This was first put into practice on Streets. Before lookdown the world record was 1:15, with several people behind at 1:16. 1:16 was relatively easy to get, but 1:15 was fairly difficult. Once lookdown was employed throughout the stage, 1:15's became fairly routine and the WR was quickly dropped down a second to 1:14. Nowadays at the-elite.net lookdown is used wherever possible, but it's especially effective on Streets, and both Surfaces. I think last I heard, it saves 1 second for every 1:15 that you use it or something in that neighborhood. More can be read about lookdown at http://www.speedrunwiki.com/Lookdown As far as emulated play goes, I have no idea what kind of effect lookdown may have. It may be the same as the console version or not, so it's worth checking into. You should also play more surface 1. 1:50 has been done without an emulator.
Posted: 6/20/2006 12:13 AM
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Rising_Tempest
Player (166)
Joined: 4/27/2006
Posts: 304
Location: Eastern Canada
Ersatz, I had to wait for Objective C (Rendezvous with Trev.) to complete. It actually completes during the fadeout, so you don't see the message. And, the lookdown doesn't affect the time as much as I initially thought,,, my test on the dam agent showed no time difference at 53 seconds,,, so I walked further than the end and paused out on both. I found that it takes about 59 seconds to make a one second difference, unless a lot of explosions and crap makes it lag more than usual. Meaning I could do the facility and runway without lookdown and still get the same times,,, unless they had high decimals (54.99 for example). Silent Thunder,,, I know I have only tied the WR. I am a horrid, lazy bastard and probably wont do the level over,,, yet. I think I will do a second run through after this, since I could probably improve each level a little bit. I don't want to start right over, because there are some levels I really want to play.
Posted: 6/20/2006 12:44 PM
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Wouter_Jansen
Joined: 10/31/2005
Posts: 329
Location: The Netherlands
if lookdown saves less on emulator than on console, it would mean that the times gotten on emulator couldn't even be gotten on console even if it were played as perfectly, since it isn't the same. Dam isn't that good of a level to try it out though, since it's been a mysterious level forever, 53's been gotten without boost, better looking runs with boost have resulted in 54. we don't know why, but there's lag issues for sure. I'd suggest going a long straight line on the surface or something like that. Thanks to the guy that makes the avis. It's pretty cool, I watch them on emulator first, which is all slowmotion for me, then see them in normal speed. Haha, the runway wait at the tank seemed to take like 2+ seconds on emulator and it really annoyed me, but in the avi it all looked great (not the strafes and lines used in the start though). Jack, any reason why you put ',,,' all the time? it's pretty annoying, use a single ',' or '...' or so :p Wren, if you were in the elite, care to tell me who you are? :p I'd say most Eliters have grown to 'love' lookdown and it's like 2nd nature now. Since it's embedded into our minds so much, it doesn't detract any of the amusement for us. I suppose for each level you'd have to first get a perfect run with lookdown, save it, redo it without, and if the time is the same, it's ok to use the one without. But if I know TAS and popular games well, I know that there's been games that they compete for fastest run to the frame precisely. Older runs would have to give up their place for newer ones that are only so many frames faster, not even taking a single second off the older run. I think this game could be that popular.. which would mean, everything fastest would have to be used. As for the save states, I'm a n00b about emulator stuff, so thanks for helping me out there.
Posted: 6/20/2006 1:22 PM
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nfq
Player (93)
Joined: 5/10/2005
Posts: 1204
On facility, you could use four mines for boosting, one mine for the tanks and shoot the remaining tanks with KF7 and/or PP7.
Boosting with the grenade launcher from behind doesn't really work either,,
What about this: http://rapidshare.de/files/23588197/backstrafe_boosting.avi.html About your lookdown test, how can you be sure it was a fair test? Did you play exactly the same way both times? If you lost a second when not using lookdown, how do you know the lag caused that? Maybe you lost a second because you played differently.
Youtube channel | Goldeneye and PD TAS times
Posted: 6/20/2006 10:43 PM
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Wouter_Jansen
Joined: 10/31/2005
Posts: 329
Location: The Netherlands
you go play streets agent and get 1:13 with lookdown, then do it without lookdown with the SAME AMOUNT of boosts and practically the same run. if you really think all of us professional players suck so much that only lookdown can make us more consistent to keep on caking 1 second faster than we were capable of without lookdown, well then that is your opinion, but try to conclude what's REALLY going on and eventually you'll agree.
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