Uses FCE Ultra 0.98.15 Allow Left/Right Up/Down
  • Takes no damage
  • Aims for fastest time
  • Abuses programming errors in the game
  • Manipulates luck (item drops, enemy movement etc.)
  • Uses a game restart sequence
Allright, this is my first TAS. I chose Zelda 2 as it's my favorite game, and I think it makes an interesting video if done fast. If you were following my progress on the forums, you'll know this is my second attempt. It's 1:28 faster than my first test run, mainly due to more precise play and better planning of items dropped from enemies.
The item drops to refill my magic (or get extra points) drop from every sixth large or every sixth small enemy, and they will drop only one of the two randomly. To get the one I wanted, I had to kill the enemy in a certain position. Most enemies were very co-operative, so this wasn't much of an issue.
What I wasn't aware of in my first run though, was that some enemies do not count toward the six count, such as blue ironknuckles, red armoured stalfos, and the fire wizards of palace five, among some others. This led to some major backtracking, and accounts for about thirty seconds of the time saved from the previous run.
To manipulate encounters on the world map, I had to wait a few frames either on the map or in the last sidescroller screen. Some enemy groups were much more co-operative than others. Random encounters I did get into were deliberate, and overwrit a preset action scene on the world map. Each time I do this it saves a couple seconds.
Now, a few notes about my route,
I do palace two before one as there as more enemies there, enough to get an attack level from points. This allowed me to level up quicker had I done the palaces in order.
Though it's faster to take the one attack level at the end of palace three, and I would end the game with levels of 8/8/1 rather than 7/8/1, this caused a ridiculous amount of problems for palace four.
It was a few frames faster (and more interesting) to get the red jar in the lava room of palace four, as opposed to going back to the entrance room.
Manipulating the encounters in Death Valley was awful. I lost at least a second here from waiting for favourable enemy groupings.
Jumping over the large wall in the Dragonhead room of the Great Palace is at least half a minute faster than going through the dungeon the conventional way.
I skip the candle and cross, they only let you see some things and aren't completely necessary. I skip the magic key as well, but with some very careful planning, I was able to get through palace six without much trouble.
For fighting against most enemies I come across, I use one of two main techniques unless the enemy is vulnerable to the sword beam.
The first I have dubbed the _Whirlwind Slash_. While in midair, if you swing the sword an alternate between left and right every other frame, you can hit the enemy three times in one attack provided you're close enough to them. I sometimes open this with a quick crouching stab followed by a whirlwind slash, allowing four hits in one attack. This is how I'm able to kill enemies so quickly even when my attack is very low. This saved a LOT of time, up until I got the downstab and it became somewhat less useful.
The second is the rapid downstab move I have decided to call the _Jackhammer Attack_ (because it sounds cool). Theoretically, you could press down every frame to hit the enemy but every four attacks or so you'll have to thrust for at least two frames to bounce back off the enemy, otherwise you'll fall through. I tried to do this with upward momentum whenever possible to not lose momentum as I strike the enemy.
I use a mix of both of these on the bosses to take them out as quickly as possible.
For those interested, here is how many hits each boss takes for the attack level I have when fighting them:
  • Helmethead (palace 2)- 16
  • Horsehead (palace 1)- 4
  • Mounted IronKnuckle (palace 3)- 5, 4
  • Gooma (palace 5)- 12
  • Mounted IronKnuckle, again (palace 6)- 3, 3
  • Barba (palace 6)-12
  • Thunderbird (great palace)- 12
Both Carock (palace 4) and the Dark Link take 8 hits regardless of level.
I really have no idea how to manipulate Dark Link's actions, if I could get him stuck in the corner, the fight would be about a half second shorter.
Well, enjoy!
ADDENDUM: I have no idea why I named the character El Ninja. Please, do not ask me.

Bisqwit: Accepted (based on test audience response), and will obsolete the Japanese version movie. The differences of the Japanese and USA versions are too minimal to warrant a movie for each of them. Similar issue was with ヒットラーの復活 vs Bionic Commando.


Joined: 5/15/2006
Posts: 19
Bag of Magic Food wrote:
Yeah, I mean, is that even a masculine noun?
Is spanish for "The Ninja", "el" being a male article. The female version is "la". I find this run very impressive. If I could vote, this would be another yes.
Player (88)
Joined: 1/15/2006
Posts: 333
Location: Bangkok, Thailand
I hate to be the nay sayer, but I voted 'meh' anyway. I enjoyed Arc's run (although admittedly, I haven't watched it in a few months), and this run is faster, but somehow, it just doesn't seem optimal. The very first thing that made me scratch my head occurred less than one minute into the run. At frame 2323, you remain motionless until frame 2356, and full 33 frames, while you wait for an enemy to move to the side. Later on in the run, you manipulate the pathing countless times; could this not have been done here? Perhaps by waiting one or two frames to exit the castle? After this I began to question other things. Every time I saw you bounce backwards off of an enemy, or a breakable brick, I had to ask myself if that was really optimal, although I don't know enough about the game physics to say otherwise. Then there were boss key grabs that were visibly not optimal. The next big thing that bothered me was the Carock fight. I can understand your wanting to lessen the monotony of a battle which is more or less brainless. Jump around, dance to the music, play with the enemies. But when a spell is cast, I just don't feel that there's any good reason to be less than optimal. I very much enjoyed the rest of the boss battles, which were all insanely fast. I also enjoyed the trick to do the downward thrust multiple times to kill enemies quickly without losing momentum. The run is great, don't misunderstand me, but I think it could be better.
print reduce(lambda x,p:p/2*x/p+2*10**1000,range(6643,1,-2))
Joined: 5/3/2004
Posts: 1203
Just a comment to all you Carock naysayers ... what about the fight looks inoptimal? It takes him 8 hits to kill the boss, same as anyone else, and none of the shots missed, and Carock fires them all at the same rate as he would had any other strategy been used. I thought the Carock fight was very creative and I'm surprised everyone is giving him so much flak about it.
1-2-3-4-5-6-7-8
1-2-3-4--56-7-8
Until you can show the first pattern is definitively faster than the second pattern, just give it a rest. The timing looks identical on paper. Personally, I think the run looks great.
Player (71)
Joined: 8/24/2004
Posts: 2562
Location: Sweden
It would be cool if someone could manipulate Carock enough to land all hits at once, or atleast as near as possible. :D
Former player
Joined: 7/2/2005
Posts: 309
Location: Baltimore, MD
I watched this a couple days ago and throughly enjoyed it. Who knew that Link had the whirlwind attack (or whatever you called) before LttP? I also liked the rapid down-stabs. Anyway, great job on this one, voting YES.
Guybrush: "I'm selling these fine leather jackets." Wally: "Really?" Guybrush: "No. I 'm lying." Wally: "In that case, I don't want one!" Currently working on: Nothing at the moment.
Joined: 5/3/2004
Posts: 1203
Highness wrote:
It would be cool if someone could manipulate Carock enough to land all hits at once, or atleast as near as possible. :D
As far as I can tell it's only important that the last one be as near as possible.
Player (88)
Joined: 1/15/2006
Posts: 333
Location: Bangkok, Thailand
xebra wrote:
As far as I can tell it's only important that the last one be as near as possible.
I think you're probably right. I'll do a small analysis to confirm this when I get home. EDIT: The following is a table of when a spell was realeased, when it hit him, and the difference between the two. Release is defined as the frame it appeared on the screen, and a hit as the frame Carock turned blue.
spell  release     hit  diff
----------------------------
   1:   112858  112866     8
   2:   112907  112913     6
   3:   112956  112964     8
   4:   113005  113097    92
   5:   113054  113105    51
   6:   113103  113146    43
   7:   113152  113195    43
   8:   113201  113209     8
As you suggested, a new spell is released every 49 frames, regardless of the user's actions. I apologize for making a false assumption. However, the last spell could have been two frames faster, as demonstrated by the second (he was partially inside the spell when he blocked it), but this is hardly anything to argue about.
print reduce(lambda x,p:p/2*x/p+2*10**1000,range(6643,1,-2))
Editor, Reviewer, Experienced player (979)
Joined: 4/17/2004
Posts: 3109
Location: Sweden
Arc>Overall, it should be published but not obsolete mine. The differences between versions make the Japanese version significantly more difficult. And people will be missing out if the Japanese version completely disappears. While I'm usually a strong supporter of "An improvement should be played on the same version" rule, I think a US version should obsolete the Japanese version. - It's more familiar - It has more interesting tricks - It doesn't have loading screens - It doesn't have the leveling restrictions - The previous version is Famtasia which incorrectly emulates some sounds. The only reason that the Japanese version was used at all, was that Famtasia couldn't emulate the US version correctly (the elevators didn't work). I don't see why we should continue to be limited by an obsolete emulator. Given your list of possible improvements, I'm not sure this is the movie to do the job, though. I only noticed a few of your suggestions, for example attacking the dragon late.
Player (206)
Joined: 5/29/2004
Posts: 5712
But doesn't the Japanese version have different music in the small encounter places? Or was that just really bad Famtasia sound emulation?
put yourself in my rocketpack if that poochie is one outrageous dude
Editor, Reviewer, Experienced player (979)
Joined: 4/17/2004
Posts: 3109
Location: Sweden
Both. The Japanese version has different sounds in some places, and Famtasia emulates those sounds incorrectly.
Former player
Joined: 3/30/2004
Posts: 1354
Location: Heather's imagination
JXQ wrote:
Leveling up also can be declined to use the points for something else; allowing for more varied strategy.
In the Japanese version any level can raise any stat, so you can't decline a level because there's um no reason to.
someone is out there who will like you. take off your mask so they can find you faster. I support the new Nekketsu Kouha Kunio-kun.
JXQ
Experienced player (761)
Joined: 5/6/2005
Posts: 3132
I was going off of Arc's submission listing the differences more than anything, which made it seem like it was an important difference.
<Swordless> Go hug a tree, you vegetarian (I bet you really are one)
Joined: 12/13/2004
Posts: 103
I haven't watched this yet; I want to see really good games as avi-movies... but I'm really longing for this to be processed. Hurry up and encode this now. :)
Joined: 2/27/2006
Posts: 29
Here's what I thought was odd. (BTW: I'm posting this immediately after seeing it, so I haven't watched the whole movie yet; but...) There's a rather well known trick/bug that I used to use on occasion (This was my game back in "the day," as they say.) While you're gaining XP (especially after placing a crystal in a palace, but anytime, really) and you do an UP+A gamebreak, but don't reset or turn off the power, when you start another game, you will resume gaining XP, even if you are using a different game file. What I'm saying is that it is not neccessary to wait for your XP to accumulate before doing an UP+A warp. you could save ~1 second here. since the game starts over tho, this did not look like luck manipulation.
Player (52)
Joined: 10/6/2005
Posts: 138
Location: Oregon
I've never done it myself, but I've read about it. You have to choose 'Save' instead of 'Continue,' and you might have to choose a different save file. And also, whenever you up+a, your experience reverts back to zero, so that would totally nullify the leveling strategy in this run, so instead of getting to upgrade attack or magic, he'd get the opportunity to upgrade his life to 2 every time he used this trick.
Joined: 2/27/2006
Posts: 29
hmmm, good point. I guess he would end up losing any time he'd gain by doing that in trying to make the xp up elsewhere. BTW: I loved this run. I like the path you took, but I really love the whirlwind slash. Believe it or not, I think I saw the guy that did Zelda II on SDA do this when he was fighting the thunderbird (purely by accident if you read his notes)
Player (168)
Joined: 4/27/2006
Posts: 304
Location: Eastern Canada
What happens now?
Post subject: Movie published
TASVideoAgent
They/Them
Moderator
Joined: 8/3/2004
Posts: 15582
Location: 127.0.0.1
This movie has been published. The posts before this message apply to the submission, and posts after this message apply to the published movie. ---- [540] NES Zelda II: The Adventure of Link "warpless" by Rising_Tempest in 49:41.67
Joined: 1/1/2022
Posts: 1716
Just a thought: Do you really need to go to New Kasuto to get the final magic container before heading to level 6? From watching the run it seems like you would save a minute to a minute and a half from avoiding the trip. It looks like you don't need that extra magic at all in Palace 6 as you never drop below 1 magic box remaining. In the final palace, the only time you come close is when you have to cast thunder and jump to kill the thunderbird. You end up with half of one magic box left. Couldn't you find even 1 blue magic jar right before then? or maybe not cast jump against thunderbird? The only way I could see having 1 less magic container might not work is if the number of magic containers you have affects the amount of magic replenished by a red magic jar. Not sure if it does. Like I said, just a thought, feel free to tell me i'm completely wrong :D Regardless, great run!
Former player
Joined: 9/1/2005
Posts: 803
rodthedefiler wrote:
Like I said, just a thought, feel free to tell me i'm completely wrong :D
I recall that you need both level 8 magic and 8 magic 'units' to get the thunder spell, which is required for that bird boss in the final palace.
Joined: 1/1/2022
Posts: 1716
ok, thanks for the info! I never realized you needed max magic to get thunder. Sorry for being uninformed :)
Former player
Joined: 7/15/2004
Posts: 124
I don't think you don't need level 8 magic. The magic containers you do, but I don't think you need the magic levels.
Player (52)
Joined: 10/6/2005
Posts: 138
Location: Oregon
I noticed this a while ago, but was too lazy to mention it. Why exactly is this game listed as "Legend of Zelda 2..." when its title (in the US) is "Zelda II..."? If it's for grouping purposes, maybe they should all be under "Zelda," instead of "Legend." Or something. But in my opinion the names of the games on this site should be accurate.
Editor, Active player (297)
Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 7469
Location: Arzareth
tmont wrote:
If it's for grouping purposes, maybe they should all be under "Zelda," instead of "Legend."
I agree, but whoever last changed those, didn't agree :I
Skilled player (1410)
Joined: 5/31/2004
Posts: 1821
It's now listed at the same spot in the movie list as the first zelda. I think that was the main reason. I think it's a good idea actually, although The Legend of Zelda II might be better than The Legend of Zelda 2.