Post by Fabian

Posted: 11/24/2006 10:25 AM

Post subject: I hate these people... sad day for TAS

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asteron

Joined: 2/16/2005
Posts: 462

I don't know if you all know about this already but I was going through digg and found the following link with 2000+ diggs. http://www.digg.com/gaming_news/6_year_old_Autistic_girl_plays_game_by_only_dodging_bullets Someone made a simple enough bullet-dodging gradius movie which is fine but then attached a ridiculous message about the game being played by some poor 6-year old autistic girl named Asheley. Looking at the youtube comments it looks like a great deal of people actually believed this and took on the author's charge to "spread the word". That someone would take advantage of a difficult condition like autism just to sensationalize a deceptive tas video is just sick in my opinion. I can only hope that brazen fraud like this doesn't sour people's minds against the legitamate TAS community.

This signature is much better than its previous version.

Posted: 11/24/2006 10:38 AM

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moozooh

Senior Moderator

Joined: 8/4/2005
Posts: 5770
Location: Away

Uhh… There's nothing sad for TAS, actually. Also, why do you care for idiots who can't see at least five different but obvious evidences that it isn't a human play?

Warp wrote:

Edit: I think I understand now: It's my avatar, isn't it? It makes me look angry.

Posted: 11/24/2006 10:43 AM

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Baxter

Skilled player (1402)

Joined: 5/31/2004
Posts: 1821

moozooh wrote:

Also, why do you care for idiots who can't see at least five different but obvious evidences that it isn't a human play?

Well... I'd say: Why do you even care for idiots who don't even know what six year old means? If you even watched a six year old play a video game, you know what I'm talking about.

http://tasvideos.org/Baxter.html

Posted: 11/24/2006 2:10 PM

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Zurreco

Former player

Joined: 8/1/2004
Posts: 2687
Location: Seattle, WA

It looks like a lot of users can see right through this guy's lies from the get go, so not all is lost. Still, lying about the nature of a movie to get youtube views is retarded.

hi nitrodon streamline: cyn-chine

Posted: 11/24/2006 3:06 PM

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CtrlAltDestroy

Active player (325)

Joined: 2/23/2005
Posts: 786

"If she doesn't shoot why's the score so high?" Somebody should make a video reply where they slow down the very beginning of the movie to show the "Loaded Gradius 3.000" message.

Posted: 11/24/2006 4:06 PM

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Warp

Banned User, Former player

Joined: 3/10/2004
Posts: 7698
Location: Finland

Somehow the word "fake" when used in the context of TASes still irritates me a lot. One of the comments says: "need I remind everyone of how everyone thought that one smb3 video was real and it turns out it was fake." Seems like people use "fake" when they mean "it was not what I thought it would be". However, that's not really what the word means. It has a much much stronger negative connotation to it. Well, I suppose I just have to learn to live with it.

Posted: 11/24/2006 4:09 PM

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Zurreco

Former player

Joined: 8/1/2004
Posts: 2687
Location: Seattle, WA

Well, it was passed off as a real time play by some super-reflexative autistic 6 year old. I think it is fake in the sense that it is not what it was claimed to be. What does fake mean, if not "not what it was claimed to be?" You worded it oddly by saying "it was not what I thought it would be," because everyone thought it would be a superplay by an autistic 6 year old, rather than a tool assisted play. Care to elaborate?

hi nitrodon streamline: cyn-chine

Posted: 11/24/2006 4:13 PM

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Warp

Banned User, Former player

Joined: 3/10/2004
Posts: 7698
Location: Finland

I was referring to Morimoto's SMB3 video, which this person commented "turned out it was fake". I was not referring to this gradius video.

Posted: 11/24/2006 4:15 PM

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JXQ

Experienced player (750)

Joined: 5/6/2005
Posts: 3132

I've used the word fake when I describe these runs to others that aren't sure what TASing is. If they inquire farther, then I explain the process, and that it's not technically "fake". I'm pretty sure I used the word "fake" when I first saw SMB3, though I wasn't sure exactly how it was constructed at the time. Fake is just an easy, quick explanation that will tide over the less curious.

<Swordless> Go hug a tree, you vegetarian (I bet you really are one)

Posted: 11/24/2006 4:45 PM

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Warp

Banned User, Former player

Joined: 3/10/2004
Posts: 7698
Location: Finland

My problem with that word is that it can give a very wrong impression of what is it about. "Fake" has the same connotation as "cheating" and "hoax", ie. something made to deceive people. If someone claims that a piece of glass is a diamond, but it turns out that it is fake, there's deception there. "Fake" is something which may look valuable but in fact is worthless, just a cheap copy, something with no value at all. In other words, "fake" has a very negative connotation to it, which is something I'm not happy about when people talk about TASes. I'm not happy with people getting the impression that TASes are worthless cheap fakes made by cheating and with the intention to deceive.

Posted: 11/25/2006 2:27 AM

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Blublu

Player (67)

Joined: 3/11/2004
Posts: 1058
Location: Reykjavík, Ísland

It's only a fake if someone is faking it. This story and the video accompanying it is clearly a fake, perpretated by the idiot(s) behind it. On this site, the videos are not fake because we're not faking anything. Simple, really. I wouldn't use the word fake in our context because that, to me, would imply video editing or something of that sort.

Posted: 11/25/2006 2:34 AM

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Zurreco

Former player

Joined: 8/1/2004
Posts: 2687
Location: Seattle, WA

Warp wrote:

In other words, "fake" has a very negative connotation to it, which is something I'm not happy about when people talk about TASes.

Well, if someone attempts to pass a tool assisted movie as a console real time movie, then it IS a fake. If they're using the term fake to describe what we do because of their personal bias, that is a mistake on their part. For the record, though, can you think of any situations where "fake" can be a good thing? I personally find people that, say, masquerade as Santa to make kids happy, are doing more harm than good. The term fake is really only used in a negative sense, since we have other terms that mean the same thing, but don't have the stigma.

hi nitrodon streamline: cyn-chine

Posted: 11/25/2006 2:43 AM

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JXQ

Experienced player (750)

Joined: 5/6/2005
Posts: 3132

Zurreco wrote:

masquerade as Santa to make kids happy

WHAT??? ;_;

<Swordless> Go hug a tree, you vegetarian (I bet you really are one)

Posted: 11/25/2006 5:59 AM

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graviteh

Joined: 4/14/2005
Posts: 45

i think he's saying that "autistic-like" people should view this video to feel encouraged, fake or not. 6 year olds with autism don't know about emulation or savestates. they are the perfect people to foolishly motivate. bah, i suck at trying to get a point across. basically this is just a vid someone would show an autistic 6 year old to make them feel like they can do something if they feel like they are hopeless. but still, this guy is a total fuck for doing this. its not good subject matter

Posted: 11/25/2006 7:39 PM

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Truncated

Editor, Reviewer, Experienced player (969)

Joined: 4/17/2004
Posts: 3107
Location: Sweden

I think we should argue some more about what fake actually means, that will help.

Posted: 11/27/2006 11:50 PM

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Viewer

Joined: 6/4/2004
Posts: 284

What really gets to me is when people say these videos take no skill to make. It's as if they think it's as simple as turning on frame-advance and telling the emulator "Ok, I'm going to sit and watch tv--you call me when you're done".

Posted: 11/28/2006 1:39 AM

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JXQ

Experienced player (750)

Joined: 5/6/2005
Posts: 3132

What, that's not how you do it?

<Swordless> Go hug a tree, you vegetarian (I bet you really are one)

Posted: 11/28/2006 1:47 AM
(Edited: 11/28/2006 2:01 AM)

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OgreSlayeR

Former player

Joined: 7/12/2004
Posts: 524
Location: USA

If only it was that easy. I'd actually get something done.

Working on: Command and Conquer PSX Nod Campaign

Posted: 11/28/2006 2:01 AM

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Warp

Banned User, Former player

Joined: 3/10/2004
Posts: 7698
Location: Finland

In a way, when a speedrunner (those who make regular speedruns) says that making a TAS does not require skill, they are right. However, what they are talking about are the playing skills and reflexes which come after years of playing the game, those which are necessary to perform incredible stunts in real-time. The same kind of skill that eg. a juggler needs to juggle 7 balls at the same time or a basketball player needs in order to be one of the best NBA players. What many of them don't seem to understand or they outright dismiss is the vast amount of hard work which goes into making a top-quality TAS of a hard game (hard to TAS, that is). It requires other type of "skills" to do that, although these skills are more related to knowledge, experience, hard work and patience, not about real-time reflexes. It's the same kind of skill as eg. a painter needs in order to paint the Mona Lisa or a sculptor needs in order to make a statue. It's not about reflexes and speed, but about knowledge and patience. It's really sad that so many speedrunners dismiss these other skills simply because they are different.

Posted: 11/28/2006 2:57 AM

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andrewg

Experienced player (699)

Joined: 2/19/2006
Posts: 742
Location: Quincy, MA

I wish I could juggle 7 balls, I'm getting close. I completely agree with you warp. I'm a speedrunner and I really dont understand how you start to make a TAS run. I have no clue at all. I enjoy that TASes are made because I have something to shoot for. It's just all about experience and practice in whatever you do. TAS runs or speedruns. That's pretty sad if you believe that video was done by a 6 year old.

Super Mario Bros. console speedrunner - Andrew Gardikis