• Emulator used: Mupen 64 Re-recording v8
  • Aims for fastest time
  • Abuses programming errors
  • Manipulates luck

Comments

We started the run with about 1.8 seconds of improvement in mind (A route change at the end of BitFS and a trick at the first elevator in BitS) and we managed to save well over 3 more seconds in the process.

Stage by stage

Before the castle

This was already optimal in the previous run, so the only thing changed here was the camera view.

Inside the castle

First, BLJ'ing on a higher step allowed Mario to start BLJ'ing earlier, because of less air time. This saved 2 frames. Two frames were also saved from optimisation at the BLJ, and 6 more by using a normal jump to glitch through the trapdoor. So overall, 10 frames were saved over the previous run in this section.

Bowser in the Dark World

No frames were saved at the BLJ or BLJ controlling, because it was already optimal in the previous run. At the end of the course, we found out that it was possible to clip the pipe, which saved one frame.
As for the battle, it was already optimal in the previous run.

From BitDW to BitFS

At the BLJ down to the basement, we did three jumps like the previous run, but we did two jumps close together, reducing the delay before Mario can be controlled again, and we did less turning frames. 5 frames were saved at this BLJ.
The DDD skip is 2 frames faster than the one in the previous run, because we managed to do one less BLJ, while still attaining close speeds.
7 frames were saved in this section.

Bowser in the Fire Sea

At the first tier, 3 frames were saved by using a new strat, using a series of dives with three grinds.
At the second tier, 4 frames were saved from different move combinations.
At the third tier, 72 frames were saved by using completely new strats.
At the battle, 1 frame was saved thanks to our positioning while swinging Bowser.
Overall, 80 frames were saved.

From BitFS to BitS

In the lobby, 1 frame was saved by using a base angle that allowed the second dive on the stairs to go further. The seemingly bad starting angle is intended.
In the room with the spiral stairs, 1 frame was saved by using a slide kick to the door instead of the traditional long jump.
In the gallery, one frame was saved by using a jump roll instead of a long jump to the stairs, and 2 more were saved at the long jumps up to the 70 star door. The air time after one of the BLJ's at the 50 star stairs wastes no time, in case you're wondering.
In the endless stairs room, one frame was saved; the strained angle used for the BLJ set up entering the entrance to BitS faster.

Bowser in the Sky

The main improvement here is the trick at the first elevator. This saved quite a number of frames, and the time saved also made the positions of the elevators at the end better, which allowed us to get through them much quicker. A frame was also saved at the end, by clipping the pipe.
At the battle, we did a much better second throw. This unfortunately resulted in a worse setup for the last throw, but still saved 2 frames overall.
41 frames were saved.

Thanks to

BrianRuleZ, for helping out with the run.
Halamantariel, for showing us how to hex edit.
Comicalflop, for giving us Mario's speed address for use with MHS.
Azorae, for support from the start.
Swordless Link. His run served as a good guide for this one.

mmbossman: Accepting as an improvement to the published movie.

Raiscan: Processing. Slowly.


upthorn
He/Him
Emulator Coder, Active player (392)
Joined: 3/24/2006
Posts: 1802
Sir VG wrote:
I mean, come on. The different route taken is OBVIOUS.
So I'm told. But comparing the youtube video to my memory of the previous run, I simply don't see it. And I don't like the game enough to watch the old one to refresh my memory. This movie's Bowser in the Fire Sea route is not memorable to me either. It doesn't help that the route in the first half or more of the level is 100% identical to the old version (I'm told). And so, not seeing any glaring amazing obvious differences between this one, I voted "meh" to the idea of it obsoleting the currently published movie.
Silent_Slayers wrote:
Read the improvement submission text, then watch the video again. Then afterwards, watch SL's video. If you still are having problems seeing the improvements, I honestly do feel bad. Countless others have seen and appreciated the improvements, clearly it's there and viewable to others, give it a chance.
I gave it a chance. The movie, just like the last one, was not memorable. None of the improvements to the zero star route have been memorable. Only the very first zero star had a memorable route change to the movie it immediately obsoleted. It now occurs to me, though, that I was responding to the wrong question ("Do you think this should be published?"). If I had voted based on the question the poll actually asks ("Did you enjoy watching this movie?"), the way I always say that everyone should, my vote properly should have been "No." And if this is how you respond to a viewer stating an honest, neutral opinion, I'd hate to see how you react to actual criticism.
How fleeting are all human passions compared with the massive continuity of ducks.
Sir_VG
He/Him
Player (40)
Joined: 10/9/2004
Posts: 1914
Location: Floating Tower
So I'm told. But comparing the youtube video to my memory of the previous run, I simply don't see it. And I don't like the game enough to watch the old one to refresh my memory. This movie's Bowser in the Fire Sea route is not memorable to me either. It doesn't help that the route in the first half or more of the level is 100% identical to the old version (I'm told). And so, not seeing any glaring amazing obvious differences between this one, I voted "meh" to the idea of it obsoleting the currently published movie.
If that's how you feel, that's fine. Though I do think pretty much every other video did take the left route, but I didn't look at any old video just to say "ZOMG U R WRONG HE TAKES DIFFERENT ROUTE!!!!!!1" though. But I guess I don't blame you for not being too excited, given there's been HOW many movies made of SM64, even just of 0-Star routes?
Taking over the world, one game at a time. Currently TASing: Nothing
Former player
Joined: 12/27/2006
Posts: 532
Location: Göteborg, Sweden
upthorn wrote:
So I'm told. But comparing the youtube video to my memory of the previous run, I simply don't see it. And I don't like the game enough to watch the old one to refresh my memory. This movie's Bowser in the Fire Sea route is not memorable to me either. It doesn't help that the route in the first half or more of the level is 100% identical to the old version (I'm told). And so, not seeing any glaring amazing obvious differences between this one, I voted "meh" to the idea of it obsoleting the currently published movie.
I would understand your vote if you didn't actually like the game, and you thought it shouldn't be published at all because the game sucks. But this? You don't notice a 5+ sec improvement in a 5:30 video. You vote "meh" because you didn't see the difference. So what?! It's faster, what else do you need? It seems you have no grudge against the game itself, so what's the matter? If you can't spot the improvements it means you just don't know enough about the game. "Yeah I didn't like this run because I didn't understand what you did in it so I won't vote yes" This is what you're doing.
Silent_Slayers wrote:
Pretty much what I was saying, I was just ruder (more rude?). :P
Ruder.
My published movies [03:45:05] <Naohiro19> Soulrivers: ... [03:45:19] <Soulrivers> ? [03:46:35] <Naohiro19> <Soulrivers> No! <Naohiro19> So? <Soulrivers> Yes! [03:46:48] <Naohiro19> joke
Senior Moderator
Joined: 8/4/2005
Posts: 5777
Location: Away
Soulrivers wrote:
"Yeah I didn't like this run because I didn't understand what you did in it so I won't vote yes" This is what you're doing.
What's wrong with it? If people were obliged to know the game to a required level of expertise before stating their opinion on a TAS, we'd have SDA's closed verification system instead.
Warp wrote:
Edit: I think I understand now: It's my avatar, isn't it? It makes me look angry.
Former player
Joined: 1/17/2006
Posts: 775
Location: Deign
Jeez Upthorn what's your problem? Voting meh on a run that you don't care one way or the other if it is published is pretty ridiculous don't you think? Pffff looser
Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign aqfaq Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign Deign
Former player
Joined: 12/1/2007
Posts: 425
upthorn wrote:
Only the very first zero star had a memorable route change to the movie it immediately obsoleted.
So a completely new overall route is required to be worth submitting? A -1 star run isn't possible, skipping the moat isn't possible, so this is the best it's gonna get.
Active player (328)
Joined: 2/23/2005
Posts: 786
Watched on YouTube, voting yes. Upthorn: Try asking yourself this question: if this were the first 0-star run you saw, would you have been entertained? This movie is in frame wars now, so being un-entertained just because you have seen a previous version of the movie is... kinda biased.
Joined: 5/2/2006
Posts: 1020
Location: Boulder, CO
Nice improvment
Has never colored a dinosaur.
Joined: 11/11/2006
Posts: 1235
Location: United Kingdom
z0MG wrote:
A -1 star run isn't possible, skipping the moat isn't possible, so this is the best it's gonna get.
Where have I heard that before?
<adelikat> I am annoyed at my irc statements ending up in forums & sigs
Joined: 6/22/2007
Posts: 181
Location: Eastern Michigan University
Regardless of what people vote this run will get published, why all the silly bickering?
Skilled player (1444)
Joined: 7/15/2007
Posts: 1468
Location: Sweden
okaygo wrote:
Regardless of what people vote this run will get published, why all the silly bickering?
This is TASvideos.
Raiscan wrote:
z0MG wrote: A -1 star run isn't possible, skipping the moat isn't possible, so this is the best it's gonna get. Where have I heard that before?
I think he means the route is as good as it is going to get (which is pretty likely). I hope that he does not think this is a perfect run though.
Agare Bagare Kopparslagare
Joined: 11/11/2006
Posts: 1235
Location: United Kingdom
Still, it's a strong claim to say anything is the best it's going to get when it comes to TASing..
<adelikat> I am annoyed at my irc statements ending up in forums & sigs
Joined: 7/10/2008
Posts: 56
I am still amazed how far this game has come in TASing. It will be interesting to see if this game can be broken any more to cut off a large chunk of time instead of just a few frames Amazing job on the run!
i see...
Active player (315)
Joined: 8/25/2006
Posts: 287
z0MG definitely meant that avoiding bowser 1 is most likely impossible, but you can never know for sure. :P
Active player (436)
Joined: 9/27/2004
Posts: 650
Location: Canada
The last couple(?) of versions of this movie have all felt the same to me. Yes, I did notice the route change in that one bowser level. But it didn't really feel any "faster" or "better" overall. I guess you could say that I am biased or whatever because my feelings are not based on the frame counter, but that's just how I feel. It's a good run and all. I was entertained. Probably about as entertained as when watching the other 0-star runs, anyway.
Former player
Joined: 12/1/2007
Posts: 425
Raiscan wrote:
z0MG wrote:
A -1 star run isn't possible, skipping the moat isn't possible, so this is the best it's gonna get.
Where have I heard that before?
no idea. yes, I was obiviously talking about the route.
Former player
Joined: 10/6/2007
Posts: 330
Location: B.C Canada
I didn't like the camera angles as much, but the new routes made it all worth it. Yes Vote.
upthorn
He/Him
Emulator Coder, Active player (392)
Joined: 3/24/2006
Posts: 1802
Soulrivers wrote:
I would understand your vote if you didn't actually like the game, and you thought it shouldn't be published at all because the game sucks.
If that were the case, I'd have voted no. As opposed to meh.
But this? You don't notice a 5+ sec improvement in a 5:30 video. You vote "meh" because you didn't see the difference.
Yes. I didn't see any difference, so I don't care one way or another whether it's published, so I voted "meh". instead of "yes" or "no". Are you saying that I misunderstood the poll choices, and "meh" should be reserved for runs that I have the utmost disrespect for?
CtrlAltDestroy wrote:
This movie is in frame wars now, so being un-entertained just because you have seen a previous version of the movie is... kinda biased.
Frame warring is ridiculous. People should put their efforst into making new material, not making minute changes to old material. Basically, I hold the opinion on movie improvements that most people hold on additional TAS categories: If you can't see a significant difference from the old version, then it shouldn't be done. Think of how much unnecessary work the encoders have to devote to making each AVI that's published. Think of how much the queue gets clogged. Think of how much work the TASers are putting into making the same old wheels a tiny bit smoother when they could be working on the engine of a totally new car. Granted, this is perhaps not the best of examples, since there is, appearantly, a difference that is visible to everyone but me, but dammit man, wouldn't you rather see something new?
How fleeting are all human passions compared with the massive continuity of ducks.
Former player
Joined: 3/31/2005
Posts: 192
Location: Argentina
upthorn wrote:
wouldn't you rather see something new?
Old, new, I don't care as long as it entertains me. Also, did I read that right? You didn't like Mario 64? Uh, nevermind. I suppose no game can please absolutely everyone, even if they're masterfully made.
Joined: 7/2/2007
Posts: 3960
I see Upthorn's point; I love Super Metroid to bits, but the last couple of any% TASes haven't really done anything for me since they've been nigh-identical to their predecessors. The last time I really was surprised was with Hero's one, because I'd never even considered going to the Wrecked Ship right after getting the powerbombs (and for several other reasons). I respect the fact that some people want to get absolutely perfect runs, though, and I think it's worth taking the time to encode the runs if only to recognize the effort that was put into them. Yes, I'd rather see a totally different run than a new iteration of an existing run that uses the same route 98% of the time, but people work on what they want to work on. If I want to see a new run, I should make it myself.
Pyrel - an open-source rewrite of the Angband roguelike game in Python.
Former player
Joined: 6/25/2006
Posts: 138
Location: Fort Collins, CO
This run looked WAY cleaner to me than the last run. Good job! Yes vote.
Active player (348)
Joined: 3/21/2006
Posts: 940
Location: Toronto, Canada
While I was disappointed with the lack of lava-boosting, it was still great to watch. Yes vote.
My current project: Something mysterious (oooooh!) My username is all lower-case letters. Please get it right :(
Player (121)
Joined: 2/11/2007
Posts: 1522
theenglishman wrote:
While I was disappointed with the lack of lava-boosting, it was still great to watch. Yes vote.
There was lava boosting, it just wasn't useful. But yeah, I agree with you on that Mr. TEM. I vote for finding a way to skip the intro, it's breaking my tab key.
I make a comic with no image files and you should read it. While there is a lower class, I am in it, and while there is a criminal element I am of it, and while there is a soul in prison, I am not free. -Eugene Debs
Active player (315)
Joined: 8/25/2006
Posts: 287
I vote for finding a way to skip the intro, it's breaking my tab key. Lol. For some reason holding "+" makes mine go faster when it is at 1000% rather than using tab.
Hoe
Joined: 7/31/2004
Posts: 183
Location: USA
What the fuck happened to this site? I have not been around in a while, but what I always liked about it, is that it was a programmatic dissection of things which honestly didn't need it, just as a hobby in peoples free time -- people who enjoyed it got together. It wasn't gamefaqs where people would get at each others throats over pointless crap. I, and no one else, really give a shit if you did not enjoy the game, get over yourself. I'm not 14 years old anymore, sorry if you are (even if not physically). This run was awesome. I followed whoevers runs from the time of his early 120 star test runs, must of watched 90% of them released. It's insane how far it has come, and I'm glad to see other enthusiasts carrying the torch as others have left, or simply in the spirit of competition. But, ya, they're tool assisted speed runs, not political campaigns. If this gets voted in, your kids aint being drafted into a war.[/i]