Posted: 6/7/2009 12:46 AM
Post subject: Gradius 3
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UNKNOWNFILE
Joined: 12/16/2006
Posts: 21
Location: Toronto, baby!
So I've been looking at this game for a bit now, and it would seem like a good candidate for a playaround run with the simple goal of not killing unless it's for speedups or if it's a level boss. What I've done so far is made a small test that only kills a few enemies in order to max out speed, and then fly around all the bullets. There are two things that I'd like to know, the first being is if this would actually make for a good submission (I'm looking at somewhere around half an hour considering the length of the levels), and the second is how to fix the sound so that it plays correctly.
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Posted: 6/7/2009 2:54 AM
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Derakon
Joined: 7/2/2007
Posts: 3960
People tend to complain about "No killing except..." rules. How much room is there to play with the enemies if you still are required to kill each one? I remember the SNES Gradius 3 TAS leaving some enemies alive fairly long, for example.
Pyrel - an open-source rewrite of the Angband roguelike game in Python.
Posted: 6/7/2009 4:32 AM
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System_Error
Joined: 7/25/2007
Posts: 109
IMO, get speed down to get everything (if that even works in the arcade), then kill nothing else. Make sure you get reduce too, because that makes for small dodging action! Don't even kill the level bosses - every one of them will die on their own after a period of time (at least in the SNES version; I assume it's the same here). If we really wanted to go true pacifist, you'd only kill two yellow enemies for two speedups so you can survive the plant boss. We gotta draw the line somewhere, though. I'd still love to see a run where the bosses die on their own, though, if only for mindless boss bullet dodging.
Posted: 6/7/2009 11:37 PM
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UNKNOWNFILE
Joined: 12/16/2006
Posts: 21
Location: Toronto, baby!
I just realized that this "no killing" goal is impossible for the moai stage, because you need to shoot some in order to get through. There's a large wall of them and so far as I see it is impossible to finish the game under these circumstances. Also, yes, it is possible to beat the game without beating any bosses, however that means that boss battles alone would take up a good 20 to 30 minutes, making this run last around an hour in total. If I was to go on this path, it'd make a good demonstration, but otherwise not a good run...
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Posted: 6/8/2009 11:31 PM
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System_Error
Joined: 7/25/2007
Posts: 109
Does the arcade version have warps too? If so, you can take the one on the moai stage in order to get by. If not, just kill only the ones in the way. And it always felt kind of weak to me to see the bosses just obliterated by the E.Laser in the SNES version. Sure, it's fast, but it's not entertaining by any means. If you can come up with fights that are entertaining though, then by all means!
Posted: 6/9/2009 9:32 PM
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UNKNOWNFILE
Joined: 12/16/2006
Posts: 21
Location: Toronto, baby!
There are no warps in the Arcade version, except for one at the end of the game that warps you to one of two secret stages. I'll be releasing a WIP later tonight in two flavors: One that kills the first boss, and one that doesn't.
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Posted: 6/11/2009 12:03 AM
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UNKNOWNFILE
Joined: 12/16/2006
Posts: 21
Location: Toronto, baby!
Double posting with a WIP which is on youtube. Stage 1, kills the boss at the end
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Posted: 6/11/2009 12:13 AM
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moozooh
Senior Moderator
Joined: 8/4/2005
Posts: 5777
Location: Away
I have a better idea. Beat the game nine times in a row, record a movie of this for verification purposes. Then start TASing the 10th loop and watch it unfold in all its unbeatable glory.
Warp wrote:
Edit: I think I understand now: It's my avatar, isn't it? It makes me look angry.
Posted: 6/11/2009 12:48 AM
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Derakon
Joined: 7/2/2007
Posts: 3960
That has got to be the most mellow Gradius music I've ever heard. :) Looking at that video, I think you definitely need to max out on Options. They'll give you a lot more room for making designs by flying around, even if you decide to not otherwise max out your offensive capabilities. I like Moozooh's suggestion too.
Pyrel - an open-source rewrite of the Angband roguelike game in Python.
Posted: 6/11/2009 9:20 AM
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moozooh
Senior Moderator
Joined: 8/4/2005
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Location: Away
Maxing out the options also increases rank, making the game even more difficult.
Warp wrote:
Edit: I think I understand now: It's my avatar, isn't it? It makes me look angry.
Posted: 6/11/2009 12:38 PM
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4matsy
Joined: 4/25/2004
Posts: 498
Derakon wrote:
That has got to be the most mellow Gradius music I've ever heard. :)
The funny thing is, it actually kinda fits. It's like...Matrix bullet time with opera music, or something...just an awesome mix. XD Also seconding moozooh's suggestions. BRING ON THE BULLETS
Posted: 6/11/2009 2:33 PM
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UNKNOWNFILE
Joined: 12/16/2006
Posts: 21
Location: Toronto, baby!
OK, so here's the plan: - Set difficulty to Very Difficult via dipswitches - Kill only if it helps make the game go faster (powerups, bosses and obstacles) - Powerups can only be speedups and options All I have to say now is: BRING ON THE BUBBLES
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Posted: 6/11/2009 2:43 PM
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moozooh
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Joined: 8/4/2005
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To be honest, I'm not sure "very difficult" will yield the same result as higher loops. Probably just maxed-out rank? Needs investigating.
Warp wrote:
Edit: I think I understand now: It's my avatar, isn't it? It makes me look angry.
Posted: 6/14/2009 8:02 PM
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Warp
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Joined: 3/10/2004
Posts: 7698
Location: Finland
I think I have the same opinion about this game as I have about the snes version: A minimum-kills run is fun to watch... for a while. It would be totally awesome if it was unassisted, but being tool-assisted, it's kind of boring. The thing is, there's not much of a challenge in just dodging bullets in a tool-assisted run. And even the visual novelty gets a bit old after a couple of levels. After that it just becomes a sight-seeing video of the game, little else. However, maximal kills in this game is a real challenge, even when tool-assisted. It really needs a lot more work, and some parts can be really difficult. It's also pretty awesome to see everything killed. A maximal-kills run can also dodge bullets by delaying kills for as long as possible, so you get the best of both worlds.
Posted: 6/15/2009 12:47 AM
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System_Error
Joined: 7/25/2007
Posts: 109
moozooh wrote:
I have a better idea. Beat the game nine times in a row, record a movie of this for verification purposes. Then start TASing the 10th loop and watch it unfold in all its unbeatable glory.
Get Reduce up in the house if you do this. Hell, get it up in the house anyway. The lack of it is what disappointed me with the SNES movie as my probably failed memory tells me, and it allows for tighter bullet dodging. Does the Speed Down trick work in this version (get a Speed Down with no other upgrades and you'll get full shields, options, missiles, and I believe a single speed up)? If so, you may want to employ it to kill multiple birds with one stone.
Posted: 6/15/2009 3:12 AM
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Derakon
Joined: 7/2/2007
Posts: 3960
I'm inclined to agree with Warp. A game dedicated to the shooty-shooty without any shooting is missing something important. :\
Pyrel - an open-source rewrite of the Angband roguelike game in Python.
Posted: 6/15/2009 3:57 PM
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UNKNOWNFILE
Joined: 12/16/2006
Posts: 21
Location: Toronto, baby!
Here's a quick start to a 100% kill version, on the hardest difficulty. Because the movie file doesn't allow dipswitches you will need to go and set the difficulty during the RAM ROM CHECKs. This movie doesn't complete the first level yet, I'm just testing the E-Laser... WIP
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Posted: 6/20/2009 5:35 AM
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System_Error
Joined: 7/25/2007
Posts: 109
E-Laser is exactly what I hated about the SNES version. It's just too powerful to provide entertainment; you hardly get a chance to show off making a mockery of boss fights. Twin Laser would provide the most entertainment, IMO.
Posted: 2/17/2011 1:37 PM
Post subject: Arcade Gradius 3?
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Patashu
He/Him
Joined: 10/2/2005
Posts: 4042
On the second loop it has insane amounts of bullets, way more than in gradius 3 for the SNES. Link to video Link to video Link to video Link to video Link to video
My Chiptune music, made in Famitracker: http://soundcloud.com/patashu My twitch. I stream mostly shmups & rhythm games http://twitch.tv/patashu My youtube, again shmups and rhythm games and misc stuff: http://youtube.com/user/patashu
Posted: 1/26/2014 11:07 PM
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Patashu
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Joined: 10/2/2005
Posts: 4042
Gradius 3 [Arcade] Destroy Them All!% TAS WIP I saw on nicovideo. Only first level. Link to video
My Chiptune music, made in Famitracker: http://soundcloud.com/patashu My twitch. I stream mostly shmups & rhythm games http://twitch.tv/patashu My youtube, again shmups and rhythm games and misc stuff: http://youtube.com/user/patashu
Posted: 2/19/2014 11:29 PM
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Patashu
He/Him
Joined: 10/2/2005
Posts: 4042
From this page's break down of the ranking system, it seems that if you are fully powered up and never die, loop 3 Very Hard is as hard as it gets (rank 31/31). http://www.gamestone.co.uk/gradius/forumvb/showthread.php?t=3432 Is there a way to start on a loop besides 1? I've also heard of an option to turn off the slowdown from too many bullets ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYn-PTSR3nc ). It might only be in ports of the game. That would increase the difficulty further.
My Chiptune music, made in Famitracker: http://soundcloud.com/patashu My twitch. I stream mostly shmups & rhythm games http://twitch.tv/patashu My youtube, again shmups and rhythm games and misc stuff: http://youtube.com/user/patashu
Posted: 3/12/2014 7:59 AM
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zaphod77
Joined: 1/13/2007
Posts: 343
slowdown removal is in ps2 port.