Joined: 9/21/2009
Posts: 1047
Location: California
Essentially, the hype behind "comet" Elenin is that every time it is in alignment with the Earth and the Sun, major seismic activity occurs. I say "comet" in quotes because many people are not sure it is just a comet. Others believe that it is a comet and that there is a larger, as of yet unseen, object following it.
I apologize for it being so quiet, but here is one of the first videos I saw on the subject:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qi7wpEIGU0I
After seeing this, I decided to research it a lot more. In my opinion, it is not a brown dwarf star, but I don't believe it's "just a comet" either. I'd also like to note that this is a mirrored video. As in, it was not originally uploaded by that person. The person that uploaded it to that account is not somebody who has more videos I would watch. He appears to be kind of insane...and is trying to lead a bunch of people to caves in the Ozarks... The one video I linked is basically the only one of his that actually presents evidence.
Here are another 2 videos that were made on the subject:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=95zMdTvoqcQhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r7QAZPb-IEQ
They were posted 1 day apart from each other by a user known as 9Nania. Notice the dates of when they were uploaded; that would be March 8th, and 9th, respectively. AKA, 3 and 2 days *before* the Japan earthquakes + tsunami disaster. Hopefully that catches your attention a little bit more.
The most unbiased video I could find that merely presents facts and theories can be found here (it is rather recent at the time of this post):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MizRO-26DGU
About 1:20 is where I'd start paying attention. Unlike the other person mentioned above, this persons videos are worth watching. It is more about factual information than insane theories. One more link I'd like to share is this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Z24fCQUAK0
Starting at about 4:45, it shows all of the alignments that will be occuring from around now into 2012.
This may also be worth a read.
Don't think that my research on this subject is limited to just these links...because it isn't. These videos are just an introduction to the theories of Elenin. Call me a conspiracy theorist or whatever, but I'd simply like to know what the community thinks of this situation (as I stated in my other "conspiracy" thread, I believe many of you are very smart).
They were posted 1 day apart from each other by a user known as 9Nania. Notice the dates of when they were uploaded; that would be March 8th, and 9th, respectively. AKA, 3 and 2 days *before* the Japan earthquakes + tsunami disaster
OH SHIT! Uploading to youtube caused the japanese earthquake! Everyone, quick, switch to dailymotion!
Sage advice from a friend of Jim: So put your tinfoil hat back in the closet, open your eyes to the truth, and realize that the government is in fact causing austismal cancer with it's 9/11 fluoride vaccinations of your water supply.
Essentially, the hype behind "comet" Elenin is that every time it is in alignment with the Earth and the Sun, major seismic activity occurs. I say "comet" in quotes because many people are not sure it is just a comet. Others believe that it is a comet and that there is a larger, as of yet unseen, object following it.
Let me guess: NASA and the entire community of astronomers are in a huge conspiracy to keep this secret, right? Oooh, a conspiracy!
Of course this isn't anything new. It was first proposed in 1995. The source of this information? No less than extra-terrestrials from the Zeta Reticuli star system through an implant in her brain.
Joined: 9/21/2009
Posts: 1047
Location: California
Warp wrote:
sonicpacker wrote:
Essentially, the hype behind "comet" Elenin is that every time it is in alignment with the Earth and the Sun, major seismic activity occurs. I say "comet" in quotes because many people are not sure it is just a comet. Others believe that it is a comet and that there is a larger, as of yet unseen, object following it.
Let me guess: NASA and the entire community of astronomers are in a huge conspiracy to keep this secret, right? Oooh, a conspiracy!
Of course this isn't anything new. It was first proposed in 1995. The source of this information? No less than extra-terrestrials from the Zeta Reticuli star system through an implant in her brain.
First of all, the main point of what I was conveying had nothing to do with a conspiracy theory. I was showing the relationship between seismic activity and solar alignments. These specific alignments included Elenin.
Secondly, at least 90% of people that know of Elenin theories don't think it has anything to do with outlandish ideas about Nibiru. Elenin is passing by the Earth at a distance of approximately 0.232 AU; it is not colliding with it. How about you actually read what I write and take the time to listen to the videos I link before making ignorant statements. I don't appreciate your blatant sarcasm when I'm simply trying to start a scientific discussion.
Oh no, not another one of these threads.
I also didn't care about youtube, and only read some excerpts of that paper, personally I'd never have the balls to publish something like that.
It all looks like an anecdote I heard sometime ago, where a scientist has to test the validity of the hypothesis "all odd numbers greater than 1 are primes" and does the set of experiments: "3 is prime, 5 is prime, 7 is prime, 9 is not prime, 11 is prime and 13 is prime".
Conclusion: out of 6 experiments, 5 favor the hypothesis, then it must be true.
Let me guess: NASA and the entire community of astronomers are in a huge conspiracy to keep this secret, right? Oooh, a conspiracy!
You are missing so much, Warp.
NASA is conspiring with the Illuminati to prevent telescopes from even observing the Elenin comet. However, a group of Free Masons has broken through the barrier, by posting to the private site known as 'youtube' to distill knowledge to free thinkers. You see, when Elenin passes closest to Earth, it will put fluoride in our drinking water and destroy all research on miracle cures for cancer. This will allow the Illuminati to take full control of the government, thereby forcing everyone to worship a new god. Its genius.
Sage advice from a friend of Jim: So put your tinfoil hat back in the closet, open your eyes to the truth, and realize that the government is in fact causing austismal cancer with it's 9/11 fluoride vaccinations of your water supply.
Joined: 9/21/2009
Posts: 1047
Location: California
DarkKobold wrote:
Warp wrote:
Let me guess: NASA and the entire community of astronomers are in a huge conspiracy to keep this secret, right? Oooh, a conspiracy!
You are missing so much, Warp.
NASA is conspiring with the Illuminati to prevent telescopes from even observing the Elenin comet. However, a group of Free Masons has broken through the barrier, by posting to the private site known as 'youtube' to distill knowledge to free thinkers. You see, when Elenin passes closest to Earth, it will put fluoride in our drinking water and destroy all research on miracle cures for cancer. This will allow the Illuminati to take full control of the government, thereby forcing everyone to worship a new god. Its genius.
Yeah DK, encourage more of that false info!! Good plan! o/\o
I hate to explain a joke, but well, the point was that it's absurd to derive any sort of scientific validation out of a set of data without any theoretical background that would consolidate it as unbiased and accurate enough to arrive at the conclusion.
The amount of experiments in the example is COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT and serves only as a form to evidence such absurdity.
Anyway, this sort of stuff has been around for years, especially in 1999, when many religious and pseudo-scientific movements postulated that the passage to the year 2000 and the arrival of the new millenium would cause severe changes to the world or other weird stuff like that (and the widespread belief that a bug in computer dates would cause economical havoc when changing from 1999 to 2000), even serious areas of science dedicated to studying this but fortunately they realized they didn't have to bother.
I have a friend who messages me in a semi-daily basis with this conspiracy theory stuff and so far I've failed to convince him that it's stupid. To me, all this pseudo-scientific stuff originates from a widespread misconception that the scientific genius is the guy who stays away from the literature, constantly gets into trouble for rebelling against current paradigms and ad nihilum comes up with an extremely innovative theory that will be ignored until he dies, when everybody suddenly realizes the genius he was and grants him his well deserved praise.
This idea couldn't be more wrong, I can safely tell you that there are no scientists that can generate groundbreaking discoveries through independent research on a regular basis and encourage you to be really skeptical of their claims if they say so. Experiments may not lie, but people do.
Of course, the story of Newton deriving the laws of gravitation or Hamilton discovering the fundamental operations of quaternions while walking across a bridge is much more romantic than a series of letters exchanged between mathematicians and physicists of the time, and for this reason, it will be told for hundreds of years.
This idea couldn't be more wrong, I can safely tell you that there are no scientists that can generate groundbreaking discoveries through independent research on a regular basis and encourage you to be really skeptical of their claims if they say so. Experiments may not lie, but people do.
I agree 100% with this, with one exception. Dr. House. As long as it isn't Lupus, he can discover any disease's origin, treatment, and cure, all within 60 minutes, minus commercial breaks.
Sage advice from a friend of Jim: So put your tinfoil hat back in the closet, open your eyes to the truth, and realize that the government is in fact causing austismal cancer with it's 9/11 fluoride vaccinations of your water supply.
The Arixv is a very important resource for physics and astronomy. But it is not peer reviewed. That means that something being on the arixv is no guarantee for its quality, and it has its fair share of crackpot articles. After reading this one, I can confidently say that it is one of them.
Theoretically, it seems to be based on the old and discredited idea of shadow gravity, but this is only mentioned in passing - no actual attempt is made to explain anything. The bulk of the article deals with correlating various earthquakes with the alignment of Earth and various other bodies. I guess this is based on the idea that alignments cause gravitational shielding under shadow gravity (nevermind that this has been thoroughly looked for but never found).
The biggest problem is that the alignments are allowed to be pretty imprecise. So imprecise, in fact, that it seems like every day of the year may qualify as some kind of alignment: The article states that there are 30-40 alignments a year, and they are at least 3 days long each, but most are much longer (see table 3: typical lengths seem to be 10 days or so). No wonder he manages to find an alignment for every earthquake! This would have been obvious if he had attempted to estimate the significance of this, i.e. the likelihood that as good a match as the one he found could have happened through pure chance.
Additionally, the choice of Elenin here is not well motivated - there are countless other bodies of the same size category (3-4 km in diameter), and more are being discovered at a tremendous rate. Any one of those would probably produce just as good "matches" with earhquakes as Elenin.
Finally, let us do a quick back-of-the-envelope calculation of Elenin's ability to cause earthquakes using proper physics. For Elenin to disturb the Earth's interior, it is not enough that it pulls at the Earth - it must pull stronger at some parts than other. This is possible, since some parts of the Earth are closer to it than others. Such differential forces are called tidal forces. Unlike the direct pull from Elenin, which scales as 1/r^2, its tidal forces scale as 1/r^3. Specifically, the tidal acceleration from Elenin at the surface of the Earth is 2*Rearth*G*Melenin/d^3, where d is the distance to Elenin. At its closest approach (much closer than it is now) it will be 0.2338 AU away from the Earth. This gives an acceleration of 5.3*10^(-19) m/s^2, which is over 40 trillion times weaker than the tides from the Moon, which we experience all the time.
It should also be mentioned that while alignments are important in many superstitions like astrology, they have no important role at all in neither Newtonian gravity or general relativity. The only reason why an astronomer might be interested in an aligment is to study the atmosphere of a planet by having starlight shine through it. Note also that orbits in the solar system are not 2D, but 3D: They do not all occur in the same plane (though many objects almost do). Thus the 2D plots used in the article and first youtube video (I did not look at the others) are insufficient for determining alignments (not that they matter anyway).
To summarize: The theory is nonsense. The method is nonsense. The article is nonsense. And the video is nonsense.
It was entertaining, though, and it was a relief to see that few people here were taken in by it.
Seconded.
It's also a very good point how these people who preach about alignments and how they cause all kinds of catastrophic effects on the Earth never seem to mention or acknowledge the effect of the Moon on the Earth. This effect is larger by several orders of magnitude than the effect any other astronomical body has on Earth (with the possible exception of the Sun), yet it's never linked to earthquakes or anything else. If gravitation from other bodies were affecting earthquakes, the Moon would be by far the biggest cause.
In the end, there's always a hint of supernatural astrological thinking behind these hypotheses, even if they are not explicitly mentioned. The roots are certainly in astrology.
Joined: 9/21/2009
Posts: 1047
Location: California
...hmm...interesting...
I'd like to point out the date that video was uploaded, and that currently, it is August 21st in the west Pacific.
Edit: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=by-AWkBThMs
Make that 3 7.0+ in an hour and a half.
Joined: 9/21/2009
Posts: 1047
Location: California
Warp wrote:
sonicpacker wrote:
...hmm...interesting...
I'd like to point out the date that video was uploaded, and that currently, it is August 21st in the west Pacific.
Did you know that over 1400 earthquakes of magnitude 5 or higher are recorded each year?
Yes, in fact I did. Did you know that there were 3 6.0+ earthquakes in 1 day just a couple days ago around Japan? Did you know that 7.0+ don't happen extremely often, and to predict it 9 months in advance based on actual evidence and not guesswork is fairly impressive?
Note: I edited my post from before this one to include that there has been 3 7.0+ earthquakes in just an hour and a half.
Did you know that over 1400 earthquakes of magnitude 5 or higher are recorded each year?
Yes, in fact I did. Did you know that there were 3 6.0+ earthquakes in 1 day just a couple days ago around Japan? Did you know that 7.0+ don't happen extremely often, and to predict it 9 months in advance based on actual evidence and not guesswork is fairly impressive?
Did you know that earthquakes often happen in close succession? Having 3 major earthquakes around Japan within one day is not surprising at all. On the contrary, it's expected: If there's one big earthquake, it's expected for there to be many others soon after. The continental plates seldom settle up in one go.
There are thousands of significant earthquakes around the world every year. Hence predicting an earthquake on a specific day has a pretty high chance of being correct. Make enough predictions and some of them are bound to "predict" big earthquakes. Especially effective if you afterwards choose from the many predictions only those which happened to "predict" earthquakes which get in the news.
Since earthquakes happen almost every day, it's expected for them to happen also in days where there are planetary alignments. Correlation does not imply causation (in other words, just because planetary alignments happen at the same time as earthquakes doesn't necessarily mean one causes the other).
Think about it in the opposite direction: If planetary alignments cause earthquakes, then what causes earthquakes when there are no alignments? Couldn't a more reasonable explanation be that it's the same reason that causes all earthquakes, rather than some of them being caused by planetary alignments and the rest by something else?
to predict it 9 months in advance
I'm curious to know why you think the timeframe is of any significance. What does it matter if the earthquake was "predicted" the previous week or 20 years ago? What difference does that make? It's not like earthquakes become more and more certain (and hence easier to predict) the closer they are to happening. This is not weather forecasting.
