Posted: 9/1/2012 2:44 PM
Post subject: Sonic TAS runs
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zwataketa
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Joined: 9/1/2012
Posts: 309
Hi, I'm new, but I know how to make a TAS, and I'm trying to make a Sonic 2 TAS run and after that I'm thinking of the other Sonic games. The problem is, I need to know the best routes exactly for the stages and how to do them. For example, I need to figure how to bypass the Chemical Plant 2 thing where the beginning links with the middle of the stage, and for Oil Ocean 2, I need to know how to do the screen wraparound thing (I can do the Mega Sonic Glitch, I have a bit of trouble with getting out of that place you fall in but I'm able to do that much. It would be nice to know EXACTLY how to do it so it doesn't take so many savestates.) Also, my computer has ALOT of stuff on it, so I have trouble getting Long playthroughs (which is why I had to cancel my Majora's Mask Playthrough on Youtube, BTW.) Can you guys help me?
I quit TASing.
Posted: 9/1/2012 2:46 PM
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zwataketa
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Joined: 9/1/2012
Posts: 309
BTW did I post this topic in the right section or should I change it?
I quit TASing.
Posted: 9/1/2012 3:13 PM
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hegyak
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Joined: 3/31/2010
Posts: 1466
Location: Not playing Puyo Tetris
You may want to look into the Sonic threads here: http://tasvideos.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=355&start=0 http://tasvideos.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=337&start=0 http://tasvideos.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=5904&start=0 And: http://tasvideos.org/GameResources/Genesis/SonicTheHedgehog.html
When TAS does Quake 1, SDA will declare war. The Prince doth arrive he doth please.
Posted: 9/1/2012 3:26 PM
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marzojr
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I will also do a shameless self-plug and link to a thread for Sonic tools: http://tasvideos.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=8827.
Marzo Junior
Posted: 9/2/2012 4:32 PM
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WST
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The best way to learn about Sonic tricks is to watch existing movies in frame advance mode. Note that some tricks in this game are subpixel-relavant (need perfect positioning), so sometimes you will not be able to make them by simply exactly repeating the input. As an Amy fan, I also recommend you trying to TAS Amy (there is a set of hacks allowing playing as Amy), she has many abilities that are great for TASing (for example, she is definitely the best for spin-dashing through objects — it’s her strongest side).
S3&A [Amy amy%] improvement (with Evil_3D & kaan55) — currently in SPZ2 my TAS channel · If I ever come into your dream, I’ll be riding an eggship :)
Posted: 9/13/2012 1:31 PM
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zwataketa
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Joined: 9/1/2012
Posts: 309
Okay, hopefully I can figure out those zips. My first TAS run of Sonic 2 won't have zips, though, just getting through very quickly. I'll also be playing as Tails, BTW. Unfourtanetly I can't play right now (grounded), but I can plan, which is an important part. Now to figure out the best non-zip routes ...
I quit TASing.
Posted: 9/13/2012 3:54 PM
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zwataketa
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Joined: 9/1/2012
Posts: 309
Also that first run wont be to break any records, but ill also make a second run later on to beat the REAL record. I've done my homework on the subject ... OH, and my homework for school, too.
I quit TASing.
Posted: 9/13/2012 4:55 PM
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zwataketa
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Joined: 9/1/2012
Posts: 309
Im allowed to use that LUA scripting thing to skip the score tally in the TAS run? Isn't it supposed to 'look like it was done on the game but with inhuman skill?' Or is that an exception?
I quit TASing.
Posted: 9/13/2012 5:56 PM
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hegyak
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The LUA script can be used, since there's nothing really going on during that point of the game. But, the entertainment value may go down, since your basically skipping it and standing still/off screen.
When TAS does Quake 1, SDA will declare war. The Prince doth arrive he doth please.
Posted: 9/13/2012 7:17 PM
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zwataketa
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Joined: 9/1/2012
Posts: 309
Im not focusing on the entertainment for the record run im gonna do (AFTER my first run), but i guess i could do it just for fun in my first try. But i doubt i could do any funny scenes as tails alone during those parts. :P anyways, my record run (recap: the SECOND run I'll make) will just be focused on beating the record time. I'll even look up at the end of each act to make the ground go off screen and decrease the lagframes. That run is for speed only. And if the extra script for skipping it is allowed, then the better the time!
I quit TASing.
Posted: 9/13/2012 7:25 PM
(Edited: 9/14/2012 1:22 AM)
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marzojr
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You have to understand that the skipping is done by fast-forwarding the movie until certain conditions are met; the movie (the generated gmv file) will not be any shorter, and anyone playing the gmv without using the script will not see any skipping.
Marzo Junior
Posted: 9/13/2012 8:18 PM
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zwataketa
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Joined: 9/1/2012
Posts: 309
Oh ... Bummer --'
I quit TASing.
Posted: 9/14/2012 12:10 PM
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DRybes
Joined: 1/17/2008
Posts: 133
I may be misunderstanding you zwa, but whenever it is possible and does not cost time to do something entertaining, you are highly recommended to do so. That is the spirit of a TAS... when you know it doesn't cost time, screwing around for the sake of showing off, and expressing yourself as a unique author. So I think you have it backwards. There's no need to do anything fancy when you're making a test run for your own knowledge/skills improvement. You certainly get a chance to try things out, see how they look, be an individual. But that's all your decision to make. In an actual record-setting video like the ones we publish, though, entertainment is of the utmost importance. Movies are rated for quality and for entertainment. People will complain if you don't do things that are elaborate or interesting during 'downtime', or if doing something interesting wouldn't have been any slower than doing something boring, but you did something boring. That's the biggest difference between a good TAS and a GREAT TAS. You probably know there aren't always a lot of chances to do this, and every game is different. In many games, playing as fast as possible means little or no room for the author to do what he pleases to goof off. Still other games are the opposite, where the majority of the gameplay is a chance to play around and have fun. Entertainment is in fact so important, that if it can be justified, it's not too rare for TASers to sacrifice a very small amount of speed, in a situation where doing so results in achieving something massively entertaining compared to the absolute-fastest method. You won't really see this on short runs or runs of hotly-contested games, but it is worth knowing. As a community we can be the biggest sticklers for improving a time by every last flippin' frame, and yet we still value entertainment so much that we're willing to give up a few frames if it's truly worth it for the viewing experience, hehe. It's also a lot more fun to make a run with that attitude. I would encourage you to give that type of thinking a try! Best of luck as you learn and improve your skills.
Posted: 9/14/2012 1:00 PM
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zwataketa
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Joined: 9/1/2012
Posts: 309
Well, I'll try I guess. But doesn't that decrease lagframes if I just look up at the end of each act (that includes that glitch where I can keep moving after each act 1), since there's less to appear on screen, it can go faster JUST for my speedrun? Or does the recording not have lagframes?
I quit TASing.
Posted: 9/14/2012 2:24 PM
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marzojr
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When there are lag frames, it would be a good strategy; but the end of act in Sonic games usually have no lag except when they end and the screen fades to black; but when that happens, you can do nothing about the ensuing lag as it is loading the next level.
Marzo Junior
Posted: 9/14/2012 2:39 PM
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zwataketa
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Joined: 9/1/2012
Posts: 309
Well I checked out the world record and, WEEEEEELLLLLLLL ... I think I'll just stick with the Tails alone no Zips run and that Amy Hack that WST requested. ... As soon as I'm ungrounded, I mean. --'
I quit TASing.
Posted: 9/14/2012 3:30 PM
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hegyak
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Joined: 3/31/2010
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Location: Not playing Puyo Tetris
zwataketa, do what you want. I look forward to seeing new Sonic runs. Especially if they are no Zip runs.
When TAS does Quake 1, SDA will declare war. The Prince doth arrive he doth please.
Posted: 9/14/2012 3:53 PM
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zwataketa
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Joined: 9/1/2012
Posts: 309
Ok. I might be able to make funnier moments in other games than in Sonic 2. Just a Pre-warning.
I quit TASing.
Posted: 9/14/2012 7:09 PM
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zwataketa
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Joined: 9/1/2012
Posts: 309
Hey, I checked out that Amy and Sonic 2 thing, and WST, I'll gladly do it when I can. It seems cool, and I can actually think of a few funny scenes to do during the results screns. ;)
I quit TASing.
Posted: 2/17/2013 8:16 AM
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feeuzz22
Former player
Joined: 7/6/2012
Posts: 207
Location: Réunion (FR)
Hi everybody, I'm a beginner to Sonic TASes, and I have a question about Sonic 3 (& K, and other): Why can't Tails bring Sonic in some cases? because of speed? position? is there a second way to bring him?
~ [I]feeuzz
Posted: 3/10/2013 7:03 PM
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feeuzz22
Former player
Joined: 7/6/2012
Posts: 207
Location: Réunion (FR)
Hi everybody, (nobidy seems to know about my last question, but...), can anyone explain to me how to set a third player input please?
~ [I]feeuzz
Posted: 3/10/2013 9:51 PM
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Aglar
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Joined: 11/9/2007
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feeuzz22 wrote:
Why can't Tails bring Sonic in some cases? because of speed? position? is there a second way to bring him?
When Sonic jumps off Tails a timer starts to tick down, decreasing by 1 every frame. When it's down to 0 Tails can once again pick up Sonic. If you hold left/right when jumping off Tails the timer starts at 60, else the timer starts at 18. If Tails hits the ground before the timer is down to 0 the timer freezes, and doesn't start again until Tails flies the next time. This timer can be seen in the Sonic LUA HUD which I guess you're using?
feos wrote:
Only Aglar can improve this now.