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Posted: 6/12/2005 11:16 AM
Post subject: Phantasy Star 4
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Sleepz
Former player
Joined: 3/11/2004
Posts: 336
I thought this might be a kinda neat idea. My first try at an RPG is PS4. For those who remember this awesome game, you know that the dialogue and cutscenes play a very important part, and most are unskippable. What I’m trying to do is, instead of just skipping through the dialogue as fast as possible, is to progress the dialogue at an actual conversation pace. I realize it will add a few minutes to the total time, but I’d find it much less entertaining if all the dialogue was skipped over, especially since its an RPG. This way it would be like watching an animated movie and reading the subtitles, and you can actually follow along with the story. The fighting and walking around will still be done at full speed of course. Here’s a WIP: http://members.shaw.ca/richu/PS4WIP.zip There are 3 files in here. Each one is the beginning dialogue, but at different speeds: Fastest speed, Regular speed, and the 3rd most closely resembles regular talking, which I’m trying to go for(I will still fix this a bit). At least watch the 1st and 3rd one, and tell me which one you’d prefer to watch and what you think of the idea. I don’t want to do a whole game just to find out that everyone preferred something else.
Posted: 6/12/2005 11:38 AM
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AdmiralJonB
Joined: 6/20/2004
Posts: 292
Location: United Kingdom
I'm sure almost everybody here would like to see the fastest dialogue, I know I wouldn't but I'm pretty sure you'll get the answer of fastest.
Posted: 6/12/2005 1:04 PM
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Frenom
Former player
Joined: 3/30/2004
Posts: 359
Location: Borlänge - Sweden
I would go for the fastest dialogue.. I was planning a run for this before.. but will take some time to do this run.. and I wont'nt even think about lvl'ing up. =) Im sure that the most could be fixed with luck. But the bosses will be hard =) I will surely look forward on this one.
Wheeeehaaa.. Yaaayy..
Posted: 6/12/2005 3:56 PM
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Highness
Player (71)
Joined: 8/24/2004
Posts: 2562
Location: Sweden
Yeah. Skip ahead as fast as possible. This site is built for pure speed I feel. :) If I wanna read everything I will play the game my self, again!
Posted: 6/12/2005 5:26 PM
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Sleepz
Former player
Joined: 3/11/2004
Posts: 336
I'm just thinking about the majority of people who have never played or heard of this game. Anyone who's played this has most likely been over everything and made it to the end already, so they'd want to speed through the script. For someone new to PS4, they would probably want to catch the story as well as the gameplay. My idea was to make something a little more interactive, not just a plain fast walkthrough. I really don't like doing those. If a video is made, then people could just skip over the cutscenes if they wanted to.
Posted: 6/12/2005 5:31 PM
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Dada
Joined: 11/22/2004
Posts: 1468
Location: Rotterdam, The Netherlands
Well, it depends. If I would do this for Final Fantasy III, for example (assuming that I'm also using the translated version rather than the Japanese version), it would be extremely boring since the dialogue is experienced MUCH better by talking to NPCs and the likes. Also, it's possible to skip a lot of "critical" dialogue scenes simply by not visiting the people that tell you certain information necessary to know where to go. In the case of Final Fantasy III, I'd have to completely alter the course to visit certain people to have the story make any sense. I'm not sure if this is the case for Phantasy Star IV. If it is, then skip through everything as fast as possible. If not, then using a readable speed might not sound so bad. It could be a serperate category--does not skip or speed up dialogue.
Posted: 6/12/2005 5:39 PM
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Sleepz
Former player
Joined: 3/11/2004
Posts: 336
Well that's the thing. PS4 has lots of actual cutscences, and they can't be skipped, so you have to watch them anyways. There's no sequence breaking in this game that I know of. By going as fast as possible, the dialogue goes by too fast to read. Have a look at the WIPs and you'll see what I mean.
Posted: 6/12/2005 6:25 PM
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Marek14
Joined: 6/8/2005
Posts: 4
As long as the dialogues are there, the video can always be paused. I think that the fastest speed would work best here.
Posted: 6/12/2005 6:38 PM
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TNSe
Emulator Coder
Joined: 10/9/2004
Posts: 453
Location: Norway
Yes, you could also make subtitles for your movie, explaining what is going on. Bisqwit can encode subtitles into the final movie when he renders it :P But I'm really looking forward to this game being done fast, as its probably the only RPG besides FF3j for SNES that I've liked.
Posted: 6/12/2005 6:40 PM
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Dada
Joined: 11/22/2004
Posts: 1468
Location: Rotterdam, The Netherlands
TNSe wrote:
Yes, you could also make subtitles for your movie, explaining what is going on. Bisqwit can encode subtitles into the final movie when he renders it :P
That would be really obtrusive, though. Do you really want a bunch of black translucent screens popping up whenever dialogue is skipped through? It wouldn't be that nice. Plus, it would be an extremely tedious job to actually put them in.
Posted: 6/12/2005 10:06 PM
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TNSe
Emulator Coder
Joined: 10/9/2004
Posts: 453
Location: Norway
Just watched all 3. Talking was just waste of time. Slow too. I could still read everything on fastest, and if it makes it into .avi form you can still play that part slow or even pause at specific frames to read it. I really hope you have the willpower and time to finish this run :)
Posted: 6/17/2005 10:11 AM
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Frenom
Former player
Joined: 3/30/2004
Posts: 359
Location: Borlänge - Sweden
How things going on this one? Any progress, wip's/previews? :)
Wheeeehaaa.. Yaaayy..
Posted: 6/17/2005 1:49 PM
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Spoony_Bard
Former player
Joined: 8/17/2004
Posts: 377
I'd personally like to see a run of this, I started a new game of PStar4 a few weeks back, though I slacked off playing it after I beat Zio. Any ideas on how to manipulate luck? It would be interesting to see if you could manipulate whether or not your characters dodged an attack. Also, you should make good use of Macros. One idea could be, if you needed to level up early on would be to do so when Rune joined the group. Set up a Macro of him casting Gra on the first move, then try and manipulate encounters so you meet nothing but groups of four FireNewts, as that group gives the best EXP and Meseta for that point in the game, I believe. Gra costs 10 TP, and Rune starts with 148 or so, so that's 14 uses you'd have before you lose him in Tonoe. Of course, that's only if you need the levels and cash. I'm not sure how far you could go without much leveling, it would depend on manipulation. But Macros would definately be something to take advantage of during the run.
Posted: 6/17/2005 5:35 PM
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Sleepz
Former player
Joined: 3/11/2004
Posts: 336
Luck can be manipulated by holding or pressing buttons between character actions. You can have characters dodge attacks or choose which characters will be attacked. For leveling, I think it will be necessary for boss fights, at least to get the skills, Crosscut, etc, and made easier by deathables. Not sure it will work on Sandworms though. I think Sandworms were the best exp until Vahal Fort, and they can be fought at any point in the game. They're a bitch to kill though.
Posted: 6/17/2005 5:38 PM
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TNSe
Emulator Coder
Joined: 10/9/2004
Posts: 453
Location: Norway
Wat (water) techniques takes the sandworms *very* fast. Water combos are highly effective, especially ice storm (water + wind, watfui), and can be performed early. Then again its like ages since I played this game so I may be wrong :P
Posted: 6/18/2005 1:55 AM
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Andypro
Joined: 5/24/2004
Posts: 262
Sleepz: I'm glad you've chosen this game, it's a great one. I also vote for the fastest dialog speed setting. I can easily read the text at that speed (although I am a bit of a speed reader). Not only that, but as an above poster said, speed is the main concern on any of these runs for most of us. Sandworms are very awesome for exp. I am trying to think of other areas that would be good. Anytime you can do one combo and take out all the enemies straight away would probably be best for speed purposes. Perhaps the robotics facility near the spaceport (sorry I can't remember names too well, it's been a while). Let us know when you have a wip for us to take a look at. I'm cheering you on and will offer advice if I can!
Posted: 6/18/2005 9:07 AM
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Helldhaz
Joined: 2/22/2005
Posts: 15
Location: Essex, UK
TNSe wrote:
Wat (water) techniques takes the sandworms *very* fast. Water combos are highly effective, especially ice storm (water + wind, watfui), and can be performed early. Then again its like ages since I played this game so I may be wrong :P
Yeah, you're mostly right. Water and wind (Wat and Zan) combine to make 'Blizzard', which can do around 800 damage on the Sand Worms if you use Nawat/Nazan.
Perhaps the robotics facility near the spaceport
Do you mean Nurvus? I guess it is pretty good for levelling early on (Zio is a pain).
Helldhaz
Posted: 6/19/2005 2:20 PM
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Frenom
Former player
Joined: 3/30/2004
Posts: 359
Location: Borlänge - Sweden
I have been playing around a little bit and I think the best place to exp is just before you enter Ladea Tower. There you got tons of Sandworms. To bad that Alys is still alive at this point. Another good place to exp is in the cave just before Kadary or just above Aiedo if you want say so. Mainpulate luck so got a fight with 3 jellyblob-thing creatures and kill 1 of them so they transforms to a big one.
Wheeeehaaa.. Yaaayy..
Posted: 6/19/2005 9:28 PM
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Sleepz
Former player
Joined: 3/11/2004
Posts: 336
http://members.shaw.ca/richu/ps4.zip I erased about 2 hours work and now back in Tonoe. My plan for leveling is groups of 4 newts before Tonoe, so Chaz has tsu and Hahn has wat, and then sandworms after getting Rune again in Ladea Tower. If you have any ideas or suggestions, let me know. I'll start setting up savestates from now on so you guys don't have to watch from the start over and over again.
Posted: 6/20/2005 12:18 AM
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Spoony_Bard
Former player
Joined: 8/17/2004
Posts: 377
It desyncs for me in the battle with Igglanova, in the third round, instead of picking the Macro, it starts scrolling down through the list, then cancels out of the Macro menu, then pauses, then goes back into it, then, well, I shut it off at that point. My rom is "Phantasy Star - The End of the Millenium (U) [!].bin", like your movie file. Not sure what this is about... Aside from that, I have one quick question: In the room where you talk to Hahn the first time, why didn't you do so one square to the right? I think the time spent waiting for him to walk back into the square above that would have been faster than the time spent walking an extra square to the left, then back to the right to reach the stairs. But maybe I got something wrong...
Posted: 6/20/2005 6:37 AM
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Frenom
Former player
Joined: 3/30/2004
Posts: 359
Location: Borlänge - Sweden
Good work. Are you planning to fight some down in the basement? If so you should buy 2 titan slasher to Alys, 2 titandaggers to Hahn and a Titansword to Chaz. If you dont have enough cash you could always unequip all Runes stuff and sell them. >:) He get new things later on :P EDIT: Forgot... "Suprise attacks" could be hard to manipulate. But it works if you push the buttons in different directions just before the screen goes/fades to white.
Wheeeehaaa.. Yaaayy..
Posted: 6/20/2005 6:56 AM
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TNSe
Emulator Coder
Joined: 10/9/2004
Posts: 453
Location: Norway
That was nice so far, like how you get some nice fast xp. A request, whenever you post an update, please include a savestate. For those of you who experience desynchs, make sure that your buttonconfiguration is the exact same. With 2 player 6 button I experienced desynch at Igglanova. put it to 3 button, no problems
Posted: 6/20/2005 6:58 AM
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atro_city
Active player (255)
Joined: 4/24/2005
Posts: 476
A request, whenever you post an update, please include a savestate. I thought skipping through a movie by using savestates didn't work in Gens...
[URL=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcuV2JdaBYY]Streets of Rage 3 (2 players)[/url]
Posted: 6/20/2005 7:03 AM
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TNSe
Emulator Coder
Joined: 10/9/2004
Posts: 453
Location: Norway
It better :(
Posted: 6/20/2005 7:37 AM
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AdmiralJonB
Joined: 6/20/2004
Posts: 292
Location: United Kingdom
It works as long as you have the movie loaded as read only.
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