Post subject: Battle of Olympus improvement
Arc
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(I wanted to keep this away from the other thread that is dominated by Clash at Demonhead.) I've been working on improving Battle of Olympus. What is similar between this game and the Zelda games is that the hero must first collect certain objects that allow access to the villain's lair. In Battle of Olympus, the hero must gather three fragments of love to open the way to Tartarus. Getting the first one is necessary to get the second, and the second is necessary to get the third. -- Actually, the two previous sentences are not technically true. Here's why. I thought about the possibility of breaking the normal 1-2-3 order. I realized that indeed this is possible: This is the barrier in Crete that usually causes instant death if touched. It is normally passed by having possession of the 2nd fragment of love. At this point I had none of the fragments. However, I successfully used the temporary invincibility from taking damage to slip through it. I then killed the boss and took the 3rd fragment of love. It had the usual message, which includes 'the way to Tartarus is now open.' However, when I went outside this was not the case, as Tartarus did not appear where it should. So, I had hoped to catch the programmers being lazy and having it be so that 'if the hero has the 3rd fragment of love then Tartarus opens.' This was not the case, but I was not worried. I could go get the 1st and 2nd fragments still. By my calculations, the 3-1-2 order is almost exactly as quick as the 1-2-3 order - it may actually be about 1-2 seconds faster in theory. I got the 1st and 2nd fragments. After my earlier experience, I had assumed that the programming was such that 'if the hero has all 3 fragments of love then Tartarus opens.' I proceeded to the Tartarus location and... it wasn't there. I then had to figure out what it is that activates Tartarus. I went back into Crete, where the 3rd fragment of love was, and found the answer. This is what activates Tartarus: The true programming is such that 'if the hero goes through the green room exit from Crete with all 3 fragments of love then Tartarus opens.' The background sky changes from blue to pink when the hero goes through the green room exit from Crete. I had thought (mistakenly) that this was due to either having the 3rd fragment or having all 3 fragments. Unfortunately I learned that the pink sky is actually caused by going through the green room exit in Crete, and also that it is necessary to open the way to Tartarus. One other desperate maneuver that I tried was to use the FCEU frame counter to see how many frames into the screen the entrance to Tartarus is. With the pink sky activated, but not the way to Tartarus, I checked to see if the Tartarus door was actually there, but just invisible. However, this idea did not seem to work. So, I cannot use the 3-1-2 order without losing significant time. The programmers have obstructed creativity. Getting the 2nd fragment is impossible without the first, so I will have to use the standard 1-2-3 order and undo some of what I've done. Fortunately, it isn't too difficult to redo this. And my time will still be what I expected, significantly faster than the current movie.
Post subject: Re: Battle of Olympus improvement
Joined: 4/8/2004
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Location: Majorca
Arc wrote:
One other desperate maneuver that I tried was to use the FCEU frame counter to see how many frames into the screen the entrance to Tartarus is. With the pink sky activated, but not the way to Tartarus, I checked to see if the Tartarus door was actually there, but just invisible. However, this idea did not seem to work.
I tried doing this manually using Famtasia but either the door is not there, the door scenery is actually a different one or it's only if you're standing on the ground that you can enter doors. One possible improvement using frame advance is killing cerberus without it actually regenerating heads (or at least not that much), getting faster the olives is obviously where the most time can be shaved but still a pain, I tried also to beat the whole game without any weapon upgrade but it's just impossible to beat cerberus without at least the sword and you can't skip it either, it can be beaten extremely fast with the strongest sword but you have to spend many time getting olives to afford the buy. Did you find any scenery where you could jump out of the screen?? Maybe an effect like the one in Adventure of Link(the one using fairy out of the screen I think) could be triggered so you enter tartarus without any of the hearts. Really can't wait to see this one and see what I overlooked.
Kage bunshin no jutsu!!!
nesrocks
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all very interesting, too bad some things we discover cant be used in the final run. but i'm sure it will be a great improvement, keep it up i know this is a great game (i love zelda 2) but i havent had time to play this one. good luck with your run
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Joined: 8/24/2004
Posts: 2562
Location: Sweden
It's always good to come up with new ideas. This could spawn improvements for further runs, even if it can't improve anything currently. This is generally speaking though. I don't know much about this game. Didn't understand it much when I was a kid.
Arc
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Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 534
Location: Arizona
The improvements are mainly from olive collecting, bosses, and some other minor things that perhaps only Jackic will notice. I don't think that jumping out of the screen is possible since it normally acts like a ceiling when the hero gets up that high. However Pegasus can pick up the hero and fly out of the screen so... I'll see if I can learn anything about that. I started the topic as information to those that are interested in Battle of Olympus and maybe as general encouragement to consider supposedly impossible routes.
Joined: 4/8/2004
Posts: 82
Location: Majorca
You did bosses faster? I really can't wait to see what you did. I would suggest you more time-saving try outs but there are not too many things I didn't try, I even tried to lure a monkey to push me to the limit of the screen where you would normally ride the dolphin to see if I could make the screen scroll without the dolphin therefore without buying the ocarina.
Kage bunshin no jutsu!!!
Arc
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Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 534
Location: Arizona
I've finished this, however I'm going to check to see whether or not I can save any more time against Hades. I did it quicker than the time I was aiming for, so I'm pleased about that. I'll submit it on Feb 3rd or 4th.
Joined: 4/8/2004
Posts: 82
Location: Majorca
As someone said, don't leave for tomorrow what you can do today XD. Edit: Just saw it, and, what can I say?, that was the coolest videogame movie I've seen in a long time. The things I was surprised the most were, in no particular order, the way you skip the bush in Peloponnesus without using an enemy to give you a boost, the way you managed the Hydra to always get out at the same place, going right then left when getting an object to gain acceleration, using the harp airborne in order to save time, NOT using the harp to kill Harpy (I tried and couldn't) and when I saw the way you managed Cerberus I just had to take my hat off, congratulations, will you be doing "The Adventure of Link" next?
Kage bunshin no jutsu!!!
Post subject: The Battle of Olympus improvement
Active player (324)
Joined: 2/23/2005
Posts: 786
Zero7 discovered a glitch in Battle of Olympus which is an oppertunity for huge improvement. http://www.samus.co.uk/cad/olympus.fcm Apparently this L+R glitch in the Zelda 2 engine carried over to this game. Neither I nor Zero7 have any desire to run this game (we know practically nothing about it) but we invite anyone else to give it a try and improve the current record. I think this would be really interesting as a run. Unlike the Zelda 2 run which warps to non-sensical places, this run would actually have to use this glitch the entire time and carefully time the movement (stopping to kill an enemy for an olive, for example)
Joined: 7/13/2005
Posts: 19
Nice way to start my time here, find a glitch that can lower a run's time extremely (>_>;;) I can't wait to see the glitch used in a run, it'll probably be nuts near the end after someone gets the 60 olives..
Attempting:Snoopy - Magic Show (GB)
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So... now after Foda's heavily sequence-breaking TAS... Who will make a 100% completion movie? :) That acquires all items of the game (salamander skins only until the amount they're needed to buy the shield) and kills all bosses.
nesrocks
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hey stop tempting me, i have a 64-bit task to finish! :) problem with this would be getting 60 olives then 70 olives then 80 olives :P
Post subject: Un-speedrun movie info - Battle of Olympus
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Joined: 1/12/2007
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I'm trying to clear up some unknown bits(literally) of info for a Battle of Olympus password generator. To this end, I'd like to know if a more leisurely/more complete movie has been made than the slowest FCEU movie on the site. Note that I'm not asking someone to make it, I'm just asking for it to be provided if it's already been done. This seems like the sort of place to find someone who would know about one. The current run has provided me with 1 new bit of info for certain(bit 01 of memory address 00F4 stands for the "Hermes is Gone" message being seen. He replaces zeus in his temple. It's unset after meeting Hermes there), but there seem to be other definitively used bits to fill in. The F0-F4/F5 data is encoded into the password, so identifying the used bits will allow me to take those bits into account. If you could help me, I'd appreciate it, and probably be able to respond with a password generator in due time.
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SilentSlayers and I are working on an improvement to this movie. We are 116 frames ahead at the room where the sword is collected. Most of the improvement comes from keeping the speed through the Zeus cutscene. Anyways, all help is appreciated and if anyone could improve anything we have done would be great! Here is the .fm2: http://www.4shared.com/file/a0UePHwv/KymanSSBattle_of_Olympus_-_Cop.html I used 4shared because microstorage is down at the moment, that link will be replaced once it is back up.
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Is this the "Bit 129" within the password generator that you are talking about? Or 128 or something else? I am not aware of a movie the kind of what you are asking. Yes, I am replying to a post over 4 years old, I know, thank you.
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Bisqwit wrote:
So... now after Foda's heavily sequence-breaking TAS... Who will make a 100% completion movie? :) That acquires all items of the game (salamander skins only until the amount they're needed to buy the shield) and kills all bosses.
Just bumping this thread. I still would like to see a 100% completion movie. It saddens me to see that e.g. Phrygia was completely skipped in the currently only TAS for this game. Kyman, how is your improvement doing?
Joined: 9/1/2013
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Location: Cheyenne, Wyoming
Hello, I am aware that this is a 1 1/2 year bump on top of another 1 1/2 year bump, but I wanted to let the people know that I am seriously considering doing a 100% TAS of this excellent game sometime in the future. However, I'm still a beginning TASer, so I want to hone my skills a bit before tackling this one. Here is a video of my proof of concept. This is a very obsolete video, as I've already found that the Right, Left+Right, Right, Left+Right trick I was using in this video is actually slower than the one FODA uses in his any% TAS (L+R until velocity hits 16, R, L+R). I also optimized this video quite a bit since then, I just wanted to do a quick little video to prove that I am indeed doing this TAS. I'll link a FM2/FM3 when I have more progress on a better run.
"Just lay your weapons down and walk away." - The Spy
Joined: 7/2/2007
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No worries about the bump. We like to keep everything related to a given game in one thread around here. Good luck with the 100% TAS!
Pyrel - an open-source rewrite of the Angband roguelike game in Python.
Joined: 9/1/2013
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Hello all, Here's a quick TAS I did of the game, up to and after the Hydra battle. This run also defeats Lamia and the Lion of Nemea, and grabs the Sandals of Hermes. It ends right after I do a few tricks with Hydra and then skip him altogether. It can be found on Microstorage.
"Just lay your weapons down and walk away." - The Spy
nesrocks
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Looking forward to watching your wip, but I will probably only have time to do so tomorrow.
Joined: 9/1/2013
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Location: Cheyenne, Wyoming
I understand there are plenty of places where I could have done better, but I just wanted to get the feel of TASing down with this game. I'll most likely restart after I run through BoO once or twice. Also, I had a RAM Watch going with the addresses clocking Orpheus' X speed, his ambrosia and olives, and how many more I could get on the level (it starts out with 75 for both.) Is there anything else I should keep a watch of?
"Just lay your weapons down and walk away." - The Spy
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Cameron wrote:
I understand there are plenty of places where I could have done better, but I just wanted to get the feel of TASing down with this game. I'll most likely restart after I run through BoO once or twice. Also, I had a RAM Watch going with the addresses clocking Orpheus' X speed, his ambrosia and olives, and how many more I could get on the level (it starts out with 75 for both.) Is there anything else I should keep a watch of?
http://tasvideos.org/GameResources/NES/BattleOfOlympus.html#ItemDropFormula Also, feel free to add your RAM watch to http://tasvideos.org/Addresses-List.html to help any future TASers for this game.
Joined: 9/1/2013
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Location: Cheyenne, Wyoming
Well? Any opinions on the fm2?
"Just lay your weapons down and walk away." - The Spy
Post subject: battle of olympus wip1
Joined: 3/18/2006
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Link to video
Cameron wrote:
Hello all, Here's a quick TAS I did of the game, up to and after the Hydra battle. This run also defeats Lamia and the Lion of Nemea, and grabs the Sandals of Hermes. It ends right after I do a few tricks with Hydra and then skip him altogether. It can be found on Microstorage.
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Cameron wrote:
This run also defeats Lamia
Defeats Lamia? Are you going for 100%? Good luck! Hoping to see the rest of it :-) This WIP is not very optimal though. You should try manipulating the luck!