Sonic 3 & Knuckles TAS "Knuckles" by McBobX in 0:24:38.40
Details
Aims for fastest in-game time
Takes damage to save time
Any% Completion
Heavy glitch abuse
Luck Manipulation
Comments
This is a TAS of Sonic 3 as Knuckles which completed without collecting Chaos Emeralds or Super Emeralds to be Hyper Knuckles.
I used new tricks and glitches possible with Knuckles to reduce the in-game time.In addition,I optimized the 100% run in some acts like Ice Cape where I used the giant zip to reach the second boss and skip the first one.
Joined: 10/6/2011
Posts: 1697
Location: RU · ID · AM
Once again me and Qwerty were a bit too slow… Anyway, going to watch this run, not expected a Sonic submission today :)
Waduh… A year ago I would exclaim “this is suboptimal!” or something… But now I’m a bit more indifferent and less perfectionist than before…
Yes, I can do it a lot faster.
But, at the same time, Yes, I enjoy the run. So, I’m voting «Yes».
And even if the question on the topic asked me whether this should be accepted or no, I would still vote “yes”. Why? I do not know. Maybe because I feel sorry to disappoint the guys who make so much efforts at TASing this game.
Only one question. Would you be so kind, can you please tell me, do you ever see the WIPs of other TASers? Do you know they have channels on Youtube?
No… Two questions… And the second is: why does the second part of your run look so familiar to me?..
S3&A [Amy amy%] improvement (with Evil_3D & kaan55) — currently in SPZ2
my TAS channel · If I ever come into your dream, I’ll be riding an eggship :)
While I can't say for sure whether or not it is optimal, it was quite entertaining seeing some of the new ways levels were handled. I was a bit confused by a couple of the deaths used, though. Unless they reset some RNG thing that would affect things later, they didn't seem to put you into any better immediate position.
Highlights of the run for me (spoiler tagged for those who want to be surprised):
Tails showing up to help Knuckles skip a level.
Knuckles waiting impatiently for the golem in Sandopolis 1. I can just imagine him saying "Hurry up and get over here so I can pound you!"
All in all, a strong Yes vote from me.
PS: Still waiting for someone to do 100% runs on Sonic 1 and 2. Would do it myself if I had the time, skills, and patience to do it.
Waduh… A year ago I would exclaim “this is suboptimal!” or something… But now I’m a bit more indifferent and perfectionist than before…
I'll do it for you: it is suboptimal. One has to look no further than AIZ1, and compare it to this public WIP by WST to see how nearly 4 seconds are lost.
Edit: Wasn't AIZ2 also faster by glitch gliding through spikes instead of panning the camera down? I am almost 100% certain it was, but my memory may be playing tricks on me.
Edit 2: This is painful; in MGZ1, there is no excuse not to enter the diagonal spring, then drop down levels inside the wall. Instead, he goes around the long way, losing seconds.
Edit 3: And he didn't even drop down levels to zip under the boss, but instead ducked down to pan the camera. ARGH.
Edit 4: Also missed the CNZ1 level wrap...
Edit 5: Nowhere near optimal but still beats his IceCap level... (mind you, that was a quick and dirty attempt I made way back then -- I didn't optimize it at all).
One has to look no further than AIZ1, and compare it to this public WIP by WST to see how nearly 4 seconds are lost.
In game time shows a 4 second difference between this run and that WIP at the end of the zone, so yeah, not really optimal.
Still, one has to wonder, if this run does get accepted, would it obsolete the Knuckles run of Sonic & Knuckles (without Sonic 3)? On the one hand, they are technically different games even though S&K is a subset of S3&K. On the other hand, because it is a subset of S3&K, this could be considered a more complete run. I guess that's something for whoever ends up judging this to decide.
Yeah... I could go on, but decided to give up. Voting "no", the mistakes are too obvious and grating (to me, at least).
Edit: Hm. Watching the "& Knuckles" part, it feels like a different person TASed it.
Joined: 10/6/2011
Posts: 1697
Location: RU · ID · AM
Daniel, Lord Bahamut wrote:
What happened in Marble Garden?!
Loss of seconds. For instance, NaturelLorenzo is 13 in-game seconds faster.
Patashu wrote:
How easy is S3&K to hex edit?
Usually quite easy unless there are some objects that rely on global timer, but resyncing is still possible even if desyncs come from them…
Something that surprises me is: this guy already made a Sonic submission before, and he was told to check out existing WIPs before submitting his own runs. Did he even read the discussion page?
(upd) check this out: http://tasvideos.org/Subs-2727up.html
I was a bit confused by a couple of the deaths used, though. Unless they reset some RNG thing that would affect things later, they didn't seem to put you into any better immediate position.
They reset level coordinates. And they do save time, if you are wondering.
it was quite entertaining seeing some of the new ways levels were handled
Which of the levels is done using a «new» way? Can you please show me?
Knuckles waiting impatiently for the golem in Sandopolis 1. I can just imagine him saying "Hurry up and get over here so I can pound you!"
Having got around to watching this, the Sonic 3 part was suboptimal as pointed out by others and the Sonic & Knuckles portion was merely ripped from the published run. While I was somewhat entertained by watching that S&K portion again, I'll be voting no.
Joined: 10/6/2011
Posts: 1697
Location: RU · ID · AM
Daniel, Lord Bahamut wrote:
Sorry, I didn't specify what I meant. How do you end up fighting Sonic's boss while stuck in a wall?
It’s not a new trick. It has been known for a long time and often put in use, even by realtime speedrunners. The boss appears in the wall because act2 terrain is not yet loaded.
S3&A [Amy amy%] improvement (with Evil_3D & kaan55) — currently in SPZ2
my TAS channel · If I ever come into your dream, I’ll be riding an eggship :)
More specifically, the boss appears because MGZ1 and MGZ2 share the same code for dynamic level events. You normally can't get to the location where the boss will load in act 1 (you have to go past the boss arena, which locks the camera too far left), so the original developers didn't realize their mistake; but if you can get to the loopback area (say, by going under the boss arena to prevent the camera from locking), you can get there. And once there, the boss will spawn and lock the camera, which pushes you inside the wall.
