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keylie
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Joined: 3/17/2013
Posts: 391
A little heads-up on the current situation. We discovered that getting a Sleeping Bag can save us about 500 frames. I won't tell you why :) The thing is that we get 2 Sleeping Bags at the beginning of the game and we happen to sell them at South Figaro. So starting over from there, about 1h45 to do again... :((. We may improve a bit other things in the meantime, but not much (a Genji Glove strat for Ultros 1 maybe) We are also working on the farming for the sketch glitch, which will be only 3 fights (including an Intangir). We have different magic routes available, as well as many different formations we ran into, so we are still working on the fastest route. Basically, excluding the Intangir, we need 2800 XP for Terra and either 4 AP for Terra or 2 AP for Locke. Also, we are carefully placing save/reset so that we save fights and get the Intangir and sketch fights as early as possible (a 1-step fight into an Intangir when landing on Crescend Island for example). This takes a lot of time, and I've already seen the Opera and the Esper world cutscenes too much!
Joined: 5/29/2004
Posts: 757
keylie wrote:
A little heads-up on the current situation. We discovered that getting a Sleeping Bag can save us about 500 frames. I won't tell you why :) The thing is that we get 2 Sleeping Bags at the beginning of the game and we happen to sell them at South Figaro. So starting over from there, about 1h45 to do again... :((. We may improve a bit other things in the meantime, but not much (a Genji Glove strat for Ultros 1 maybe)
That sucks, but totally understandable as 500 frames is a lot... but damn do you ever got me curious about how the heck the sleeping bag saves so much, other then a quick save n' reset combo like you mentioned later in the post. Sucks you had to redo it all, but definitely will be waiting with great anticipation! Mr. Kelly R. Flewin
Mr. Kelly R. Flewin Just another random gamer ---- <OmnipotentEntity> How do you people get bored in the span of 10 seconds? Worst ADD ever.
keylie
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Joined: 3/17/2013
Posts: 391
Found a little skip which saves 8 seconds. Link to video
Joined: 11/17/2005
Posts: 278
Location: Massachusetts, USA
I was just thinking about how the Sleeping Bag could save you 8 seconds and you posted that! Obviously that's not it and you're going to save 8 more seconds somewhere else too! :) I can't think of it. You probably don't want it for its 0xFD item id. So you must be using it to prevent a game over somewhere? Or maybe for the mp refill? I can't wait for that WIP.
keylie
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Posts: 391
Starting again from Figaro Castle. Here is the list of changes/improvments: - I waited 1 second less in Figaro Castle during the manipulation of Lete River, to get a better NPC placement in the Returners Hideout and to keep getting the best Magitek fight (Battle RNG has a periodicity of 60 frames). - I didn't place Edgar on the last slot for the three battles in the cave to South Figaro. I lose less time by having to switch characters during the three fights rather than entering and exiting the menu (also this menuing was looking bad). - I now have enough money for the South Figaro shop without having to sell stuff. Buying 3 Sprint Shoes and 1 Goggles. Even with selling stuff, I wouldn't be able to buy a fourth Sprint Shoes :( - Vargas fight was a bit different. I used Fire only once instead of twice, and replaced it with two criticals. It should save time as entering in the magic menu makes the battle counter on pause (this counter determines when DAs are unlocked) - Returners Hideout went well. I didn't have time to go to the save point (not a problem). Edgar was a bit far when talking to him, but still ok. - As I didn't have to clip through a NPC, my menuing was just before the River so that I could equip the Genji Glove. I equipped it on Edgar. I lost a bit less than 1s by equipping it and later unequipping it (damn you, automatic optimal) - Ultros fight with Genji Glove went better. I replaced Sabin's Aurabolt with a critical. Originally, I thought I would do one double attack (critical-normal) with Edgar, and a simple critical on his second turn, because I didn't need the extra damage from the second weapon. However, I realized that when you have the Genji Glove but only one weapon, damage of that weapon is halfed!! The damage wasn't enough, so I kept the double attack :( I used that extra damage to replace Banon's second turn with a normal attack. I started using extensively 1-frame escaping to speed up the battle RNG increasing. This saves frames here and there, and can be useful to chain criticals. Overall, I saved 1.5s on this fight. When considering the time to equip/unequip the Genji Glove, I still saved more than half a second. I spent more than 4 hours on this fight, but it's now faster and flowing.
Joined: 8/1/2004
Posts: 178
Sounds like the journey of an enlightened man. Wish I had all this TAS knowledge experience.
<^>v AB X LR s
Joined: 11/17/2005
Posts: 278
Location: Massachusetts, USA
Good luck once again with the route planning after Vector! Although you've got to redo all of the "mechanical" parts of the game first. (Locke's Scenario, Terra's Scenario, Zozo, and Jidoor.) That's no fun.
keylie
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Joined: 3/17/2013
Posts: 391
Another small time saver (about 6 seconds): Link to video
keylie
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Posts: 391
I realised that the sketch glitch erases multiple times the inventory. You can use or move items from the first rewritings if done on the exact frame. This allows to access to a new set of items (and magics and commands). I will update the spreadsheet soon.
Joined: 7/27/2014
Posts: 4
I suppose this is TAS-only, since it's frame perfect.
@oxydoreduction twitch.tv/oxydoreduction
keylie
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Joined: 3/17/2013
Posts: 391
Yes, this is most probably TAS only. Here is the updated spreadsheet Edit: mold 11 with setup 417F (the easiest one) produces Moogle Charm! But I don't know if this mold is accessible or safe.
Joined: 7/27/2014
Posts: 4
Thanks kilaye for the updated spreadsheet. Mold 11 formations: - Soldier *2 + M-TekArmor - M-TekArmor - Were-Rat + Repo Man - Commander *3 - GloomShell *3 - Tentacles
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keylie
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All the better setups producing Moogle Charm end up in a crash (417F mold 11, 4167 mold 4). I will stick with 4126 mold 1 for now. There is another very useful trick: as the rewriting by the sketch glitch is very laggy and takes time, it is possible to swap items in the middle of an inventory rewriting. For example, setup 41BF mold 1 produces 0 Flame Shield in slot 55. This is bad because we want at least 2 Flame Shields for Leo against Kefka. However, the sketch glitch rewrites the quantity of the 254th slot but not the type of item. By swapping slots 55 and 254 at a very specific frame, you will move the newly produced Flame Shield to slot 254 before that slot gets rewrote, resulting in 160 Flame Shields! Other ideas that will probably not be useful: we can merge the item list with the command list by swapping characters during the Goggles glitch. This can be helpful to: - use the command Possess, which is an instant kill, as a replacement to Bababreath. However, the corresponding item is not useable in battle - use the command Mimic to mimic the Engulf - use the battle script to move to the next tier, which allows us to access to other formation molds while still being in the Triangle Island. The formation loaded depends on the aiming of the command. We can flag the corresponding item to have the aiming byte we want, so we have a bit of freedom on the target formation. The binary representation of the aiming value is the following two-bytes integer:
0 0 foe6 foe5 foe4 foe3 foe2 foe1 0 0 0 0 char4 char3 char2 char1
By aiming our party, we can have access to formations [1;15] By aiming the ennemies, based on the fact that formations 6, 7 and 8 are available on the Triangle Island, we have access to formations 1024 * [1;15]. All those formations are glitched because there are 576 formations. Unfortunately, the two Zone Eater formations (335 and 501) are not accessible.
Joined: 11/17/2005
Posts: 278
Location: Massachusetts, USA
It's now a three-dimensional spreadsheet! Memory address, contents, and time. Could any non-Triangle Island formation ever be worth it though? Say for example the Moogle Charm from formation 11 worked out. Would it be worth it to fly over there, get the Moogle Charm, and then fly over to the Triangle Island? Especially if the TAS magic route involves even a single Intangir there's just no way. I started looking at the new ways to cast Engulf that the new spreadsheet shows. And then I realized, duh, getting Engulfed outside of the Triangle Island is useless. And the Intangir already provides a fast "Engulf" that doesn't play the Engulf animation 3 times. (Also, summoning the Zone Eater outside of the Triangle Island would be an accomplishment, but it would also get you stuck.) Leo using Flame Shlds is pretty sweet though! That could save a whole minute!
keylie
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I tested all the ways to get Moogle Charms. Only mold 1 and 7 give them without any long freeze. Here is the old route:
Battle 1: setup 41BF mold 1 -> Flame Shield
Battle 2: setup 417F mold 1 -> Gem Box
          setup 4126 mold 1 -> Moogle Charm
Battle 3: setup 417F mold 1 -> flag Black Belt
          setup 41BF mold 1 -> flag Goggles
          setup 41BF mold 1 -> flag Moogle Charm
          setup 41EF mold 1 -> make ennemies targetable
          Goggles glitch to get Engulfed
(EDIT: It should be possible to make the two 41BF into one by using the swap trick) Here is the current considered route:
Battle 1: setup 41BF mold 1 -> Flame Shield
Battle 2: setup 417F mold 1 -> Gem Box
Battle 3: setup 417F mold 1 -> flag Black Belt
          Goggles glitch to get Engulfed
Battle 4: setup 4183 mold 7 (against Zone Eater) -> Goggles (already flagged) + Moggle Charm (already flagged)
Here is an alternative route:
Battle 1: setup 41BF mold 1 -> Flame Shield
Battle 2: setup 417F mold 1 -> Gem Box
Battle 3: setup 41FF mold 1 -> Partisan (already flagged)
          Goggles glitch to trigger the tier change (command 0x20) using the Partisan (item 0x20), to load a mold 7 formation
          setup 4183 mold 7 -> Goggles (already flagged) + Moogle Charm (already flagged) + flag Black Belt
          Goggles glitch to get Engulfed
(EDIT: triggering the 0x20 command that way is crashing the game. I guess I will give up this route.)
keylie
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Joined: 3/17/2013
Posts: 391
Here is WIP 8: Link to video
jaysmad
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Joined: 12/1/2006
Posts: 629
Location: Mom's
Now that's what i call ending with a bang! WTF happened? Also very cool Mega Armor battle. Keep it up, mate.
keylie
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Posts: 391
Final time is 3:11:39. Video will come.
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More teasing. HHS and now you :(
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Patashu
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keylie wrote:
Final time is 3:11:39. Video will come.
Nice work!
My Chiptune music, made in Famitracker: http://soundcloud.com/patashu My twitch. I stream mostly shmups & rhythm games http://twitch.tv/patashu My youtube, again shmups and rhythm games and misc stuff: http://youtube.com/user/patashu
ars4326
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Loving how much attention the old-school RPGs are getting this year! Can't wait for submission!
"But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him." - 1 Corinthians 2:9
keylie
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Last part: Link to video I will work on the submission text and subtitles for the YT video. It may take a while.
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Joined: 9/17/2014
Posts: 368
Location: France
verry good continues at is by google translate
ars4326
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That was AWESOME. So many choices for screenshots... ...and a lot more entertaining that spamming Joker Doom!
"But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him." - 1 Corinthians 2:9
PJ
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Joined: 2/1/2011
Posts: 181
Location: Western NY
Hahahaha that final fight. Spectacular. Great work, keylie!
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