People having an actual discussion about a topic is an embarrassment to this website... Why, exactly? Because the subject is feminism?
Men (since there seem to be quite a few vocal men in this thread), please heed my advice: stick your necks out just a little bit for women. Try to recognize some of the difficulties that women face in your communities. Ask them what you can do to help.
I think that's called white knighting?
but most of the critiques I see here (I'm looking at you, Mitjitsu and Warp) are far off-base or paint it with too broad a brush.
Criticizing the part of the movement that has the most influence in society, the part that has the loudest voice and which can do the most harm to society, is completely warranted. "Not all X are like that" is not an excuse to deter criticism of that loud minority.
That's the portion of the movement that causes changes in policies and laws, changes that are often veering towards the unconstitutional, and are against the fundamental human rights. The part that promotes and engages in gender and racial discrimination, and would want to enforce it by law. Criticizing this portion of the movement is completely warranted, and even urgent, even if "not all" feminists are like that.
I have, in fact, some time ago written a more or less formal statement of why I oppose modern "progressive" feminism, and rather than repeat it here, I'll just link to it: http://grindedgear.blogspot.fi/2016/01/why-i-oppose-progressive-feminism.html
People having an actual discussion about a topic is an embarrassment to this website... Why, exactly? Because the subject is feminism?
Because it is full of straw-man arguments from people who seem to know next to nothing about feminism aside from what they read on Men's Rights forums.
Warp wrote:
I think that's called white knighting?
And if a woman takes a stand on your behalf when it comes to certain men's issues (which they should!) is that also white knighting? Ask some women what they think about "white knighting". Yes, advocacy can be taken too far, but I'm simply arguing that you should gently speak out when you see something that's unfair to women. Don't talk to me about it. Talk to important women in your life.
Warp wrote:
Criticizing the part of the movement that has the most influence in society, the part that has the loudest voice and which can do the most harm to society, is completely warranted. "Not all X are like that" is not an excuse to deter criticism of that loud minority.
You have a point here. The segment of feminism that you refer to certainly deserves criticism for lowering the discourse. But what you have done is made blanket statement after blanket statement, insisting that all feminism is like that. Be the bigger person, raise the level of discussion.
Warp wrote:
That's the portion of the movement that causes changes in policies and laws, changes that are often veering towards the unconstitutional, and are against the fundamental human rights. The part that promotes and engages in gender and racial discrimination, and would want to enforce it by law. Criticizing this portion of the movement is completely warranted, and even urgent, even if "not all" feminists are like that.
I have, in fact, some time ago written a more or less formal statement of why I oppose modern "progressive" feminism, and rather than repeat it here, I'll just link to it: http://grindedgear.blogspot.fi/2016/01/why-i-oppose-progressive-feminism.html
I find your views to be thoroughly out of line with reality. Look past Tumblr and other superficial sources and try to find actual feminist discussion. Yes, there are some real scoundrels with simplistic worldviews there, but there are also very good and thoughtful people who are trying very hard to do what's right. And that's all I'm advocating for you-- try to be thoughtful, do what's right, and make the world a better place.
Eh, whatever. I tried.
People having an actual discussion about a topic is an embarrassment to this website... Why, exactly? Because the subject is feminism?
Because it is full of straw-man arguments from people who seem to know next to nothing about feminism aside from what they read on Men's Rights forums.
Warp wrote:
I think that's called white knighting?
And if a woman takes a stand on your behalf when it comes to certain men's issues (which they should!) is that also white knighting? Ask some women what they think about "white knighting". Yes, advocacy can be taken too far, but I'm simply arguing that you should gently speak out when you see something that's unfair to women. Don't talk to me about it. Talk to important women in your life.
Warp wrote:
Criticizing the part of the movement that has the most influence in society, the part that has the loudest voice and which can do the most harm to society, is completely warranted. "Not all X are like that" is not an excuse to deter criticism of that loud minority.
You have a point here. The segment of feminism that you refer to certainly deserves criticism for lowering the discourse. But what you have done is made blanket statement after blanket statement, insisting that all feminism is like that. Be the bigger person, raise the level of discussion.
Warp wrote:
That's the portion of the movement that causes changes in policies and laws, changes that are often veering towards the unconstitutional, and are against the fundamental human rights. The part that promotes and engages in gender and racial discrimination, and would want to enforce it by law. Criticizing this portion of the movement is completely warranted, and even urgent, even if "not all" feminists are like that.
I have, in fact, some time ago written a more or less formal statement of why I oppose modern "progressive" feminism, and rather than repeat it here, I'll just link to it: http://grindedgear.blogspot.fi/2016/01/why-i-oppose-progressive-feminism.html
I find your views to be thoroughly out of line with reality. Look past Tumblr and other superficial sources and try to find actual feminist discussion. Yes, there are some real scoundrels with simplistic worldviews there, but there are also very good and thoughtful people who are trying very hard to do what's right. And that's all I'm advocating for you-- try to be thoughtful, do what's right, and make the world a better place.
Eh, whatever. I tried.
You come here and insult people for having a discussion,and wanna say they're embarassing someone.I'm not bringing straw arguments at all.Women tend to show their preferences on the more gender equal countries and this preferences are clear,i have the data to back it up.I'm pretty certain cultural stimulus have an impact on these subjects too,so i'm not going as far to say they're negligible but the real problem lies in expecting this perfect balance in the statistics as way to prove equality.If that's the case,things will never be equal,for the very innate differences of the sex.
TAS i'm interested:
megaman series: mmbn1 all chips, mmx3 any% psx glitched
fighting games with speed goals in general
Because it is full of straw-man arguments from people who seem to know next to nothing about feminism aside from what they read on Men's Rights forums.
Be careful, you are getting out of line, and too personal.
I find your views to be thoroughly out of line with reality.
I would find it genuinely surprising if you weren't aware of what has been happening eg. at many universities in the United States during the last couple of years. And it's not something that is just remaining within universities. We are getting more and more things like a law proposal in New Zealand trying to reverse the burden of proof, or the BBC engaging in blatant racial discrimination in hiring.
My objections are perfectly in touch with what has been happening in the real world.
The problem with feminism is that it refuses to acknowledge that we are a dimorphic species.
There are radical feminists who think that even biological sex is a social construct [1] [2], but generally feminists accept that we are dimorphic biologically speaking. But they think that our gender identity and such is formed by "society", and our brain, mind, body and their interactions has little, if anything, to do with gender identity.
Many feminists reject objective knowledge and the traditional definition of science, because feminism has its roots in critical theory (a neo-Marxist philosophy), which says that objective knowledge is impossible [3]. There are even things like "the feminist method". Maybe we'll have that in the future instead of the scientific method.
[1] http://www.autostraddle.com/its-time-for-people-to-stop-using-the-social-construct-of-biological-sex-to-defend-their-transmisogyny-240284/
[2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WtsHv7iUZSE
[3] http://www.iep.utm.edu/frankfur/ ("On the basis of Habermasian premises, indeed, there can be no objective knowledge, as positivists claim, detached from intersubjective forms of understanding. Since knowledge is strictly embedded in serving human interests, it follows that it cannot be considered value-neutral and objectively independent.")
See also: http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/feminism-epistemology/
And, this conversation is no longer about the wage gap. Good night.
I am still the wizard that did it.
"On my business card, I am a corporate president. In my mind, I am a game developer. But in my heart, I am a gamer." -- Satoru Iwata
<scrimpy> at least I now know where every map, energy and save room in this game is
