Posted: 2/23/2017 8:58 AM
Post subject: New category for SMB1?
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DangerBK
Joined: 2/23/2017
Posts: 8
Location: Colorado
Not too long ago I decided the time had come for me to learn how to do a TAS. I've watched them for a long time and was always super interested in them. I'm a software engineer and I like the idea of probing the innards of a game. So I decided, as is recommended by this site, to take on SMB1. However, I didn't want to just do a speedrun because obviously that's been done a million times and no scrub like me will come close. So I decided on a different goal that I thought would be fun for me to make and for others to watch. 100% Kill All Enemies. Basically what it says. Every level and every enemy that can be killed (some can't I've found) as quickly as possible. At the time of writing this I'm halfway through World 6 and I posted a preview on Reddit. I was shocked that other people thought this was a pretty neat idea and someone suggested I look into getting it published here. I have read through the requirements and it seems like I check off all the boxes. I use FCEUX and know how to export an FM3, I have a YouTube channel to post an encode to, people seem to think it's cool, and all the other stuff. I just wanted to I guess make sure there's nothing that I'm not thinking about that would be better addressed earlier rather than later. Also I guess this would be a new category so how does that work if it even does at all. Here's a link to the Reddit post. https://www.reddit.com/r/TAS/comments/5vkizu/heres_a_preview_of_my_smb1_100_kill_all_enemies/
Posted: 2/24/2017 1:11 AM
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Nach
Emulator Coder
Joined: 3/9/2004
Posts: 4588
Location: In his lab studying psychology to find new ways to torture TASers and forumers
Unless the enemies are killed in the most entertaining way possible, the run probably will not find much interest here. Mario himself will also have to progress as quickly as possible while killing all the enemies.
Warning: Opinions expressed by Nach or others in this post do not necessarily reflect the views, opinions, or position of Nach himself on the matter(s) being discussed therein.
Posted: 2/24/2017 2:07 AM
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DangerBK
Joined: 2/23/2017
Posts: 8
Location: Colorado
Nach wrote:
Unless the enemies are killed in the most entertaining way possible, the run probably will not find much interest here. Mario himself will also have to progress as quickly as possible while killing all the enemies.
Oh ok I didn't know that. My bad. I guess nevermind.
Posted: 2/24/2017 2:23 AM
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Lex
Joined: 6/25/2007
Posts: 732
Location: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Very cool idea! While I agree with Nach in that the run must be optimized (compromising on clear time as little as possible) and creative (timing enemy kills or fireballs to musical cues?), I think if executed well, it would be fitting for this site.
Posted: 2/24/2017 3:30 AM
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Patashu
He/Him
Joined: 10/2/2005
Posts: 4045
DangerBK wrote:
Nach wrote:
Unless the enemies are killed in the most entertaining way possible, the run probably will not find much interest here. Mario himself will also have to progress as quickly as possible while killing all the enemies.
Oh ok I didn't know that. My bad. I guess nevermind.
If your TAS isn't optimized enough to be published on the site proper, you can still post it on the forum topic and people will watch and enjoy it: http://tasvideos.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1337&start=1100
My Chiptune music, made in Famitracker: http://soundcloud.com/patashu My twitch. I stream mostly shmups & rhythm games http://twitch.tv/patashu My youtube, again shmups and rhythm games and misc stuff: http://youtube.com/user/patashu
Posted: 2/24/2017 5:18 AM
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DangerBK
Joined: 2/23/2017
Posts: 8
Location: Colorado
Patashu wrote:
DangerBK wrote:
Nach wrote:
Unless the enemies are killed in the most entertaining way possible, the run probably will not find much interest here. Mario himself will also have to progress as quickly as possible while killing all the enemies.
Oh ok I didn't know that. My bad. I guess nevermind.
If your TAS isn't optimized enough to be published on the site proper, you can still post it on the forum topic and people will watch and enjoy it: http://tasvideos.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1337&start=1100
Well I definitely have put effort into properly optimizing it. While I am a beginner I believe it to be not bad. Making it as fast and as optimized as possible is definitely my goal. Having Mario destroy everything on screen is certainly entertaining but I want technical expertise to be an entertaining part as well. I also believe that the Kill All Enemies run presents new and interesting issues in the run that don't normally need to be considered. There are also some enemies that I believe to be unkillable. For these reasons I think that the category is complex enough to be interesting and entertaining to others. There is one problem I am having an issue with that I was hoping someone here might be able to help me with. I need some information on the specifics involving subpixels and the flagpole glitch. So far I haven't been able to successfully do one and I know that is the fastest strat other than flag pole glitch by enemy so I want to include it. Is there anyone here that would be a good person to talk to? I tried reading through the SMB thread but it is super long. I also did some research on the internet and people talk in general about how it is done but I haven't found a detailed explanation on the numbers and theory behind why and how it works.
Posted: 2/24/2017 2:36 PM
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BigBoct
He/Him
Editor, Former player
Joined: 8/9/2007
Posts: 1692
Location: Tiffin/Republic, OH
You might take a look at our Game Resources page for SMB. http://tasvideos.org/GameResources/NES/SuperMarioBros.html
Previous Name: boct1584
Posted: 2/24/2017 7:17 PM
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feos
Site Admin, Skilled player (1256)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11495
Location: Lake Char­gogg­a­gogg­man­chaugg­a­gogg­chau­bun­a­gung­a­maugg
NES TAS of 2011
I like this idea btw. No guarantees it will be accepted, but I think people are gonna enjoy. Also consider absorbing #2908: HappyLee's NES Super Mario Bros. "lowest score" in 14:32.80.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Posted: 2/24/2017 7:29 PM
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BrunoVisnadi
Editor, Skilled player (1348)
Joined: 12/28/2013
Posts: 396
Location: Rio de Janeiro, Brasil
SNES TAS of 2020 TAS of 2015 SNES TAS of 2015
Maybe you know already, but this wasn't mentioned here: There are accepted SMB1 runs that don't aim only for fastest time, such as the walkathon run and the 'maximum coins' run. Walkathon: http://tasvideos.org/2676M.html Maximum coins: http://tasvideos.org/2977M.html As Nach said, speed still needs to be the secondary goal, though.
My YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCVoUfT49xN9TU-gDMHv57sw Projects: SMW 96 exit. SDW any%, with Amaraticando. SMA2 SMW small only Kaizo Mario World 3
Posted: 2/25/2017 12:02 AM
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DangerBK
Joined: 2/23/2017
Posts: 8
Location: Colorado
BrunoVisnadi wrote:
Maybe you know already, but this wasn't mentioned here: There are accepted SMB1 runs that don't aim only for fastest time, such as the walkathon run and the 'maximum coins' run. Walkathon: http://tasvideos.org/2676M.html Maximum coins: http://tasvideos.org/2977M.html As Nach said, speed still needs to be the secondary goal, though.
Yes I've seen the walkathon and max coins run. The max coins run is amazing! I would say my goal is kill everything AND do it as fast as possible. Speed is not taking a back seat. What I'm imagining is that Mario is Liam Neeson from Taken. He has a particular set of skills. Basically just cold blooded murdering of everyone until he gets his girl back lol. I finished version 0.1 of the full run today. Obviously a TON of optimizations to be had and I technically missed a bad guy on 1-2 I didn't notice until watching the whole thing back. One thing I can say in retrospect is screw bullet bills and piranha plants. They were a nightmare in certain places. Especially the piranha plants in 8-4 because some of them were impossible to one cycle. I think my favorite thing about the kill everything run is the difficulty. I'm hoping someone sees it and tries to do it faster because the complexity is very high compared to a normal smb run. I could imagine there are many many ways to do it.
Posted: 2/25/2017 12:05 AM
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DangerBK
Joined: 2/23/2017
Posts: 8
Location: Colorado
feos wrote:
I like this idea btw. No guarantees it will be accepted, but I think people are gonna enjoy. Also consider absorbing #2908: HappyLee's NES Super Mario Bros. "lowest score" in 14:32.80.
Thanks for the encouragement!! I know it might not be accepted but I'm ok with that. I did it mostly because I wanted to learn TAS and also because it was super fun to do it. Every section of every level was like doing a fun puzzle. Plus the finished product is very rewarding. I will definitely check that out. I saw it but haven't watched it yet. Right now I'm just trying to get the first run to the end of the game finished.
Posted: 2/25/2017 12:07 AM
(Edited: 2/25/2017 1:09 AM)
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DangerBK
Joined: 2/23/2017
Posts: 8
Location: Colorado
boct1584 wrote:
You might take a look at our Game Resources page for SMB. http://tasvideos.org/GameResources/NES/SuperMarioBros.html
Yes I've already read all of that. I've figured out wall jumps and other things like starting from a stop quickly that were applicable to the run. The only thing I haven't figured out is the flag pole glitch. The description on the game resources page has basically no detail. In a nutshell it says get inside the block at the bottom lol. What was there was not enough for me to get it to work after hours of experimenting. At this point I'm just going to need some more information about subpixels etc. My guess is that you need to be at the block edge at the time of a subpixel jump to push you inside. I'm hoping someone will know more specifically how that works.
Posted: 2/25/2017 1:07 AM
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DangerBK
Joined: 2/23/2017
Posts: 8
Location: Colorado
Just finished uploading what is basically an extremely rough first draft of the full run. LOTS of optimizing to do and I mean this is my very first TAS. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_vdd-kpppo Needs flag pole glitch on all levels. I missed one bad guy I didn't notice until watching later. Need to recheck start from stop inputs. Also need to investigate where other glitches could be beneficial for killing enemies.