Sonic The Hedgehog TAS by JXQ

Emulator used: Gens 9f & Gens 9f-modified (plays back correctly with either)
  • Aims for fastest time
  • Takes damage to save time
  • Abuses programming errors
  • Manipulates luck
My goal priority was as follows:
  1. Fastest level times possible
  2. Fastest overall time possible
  3. Interesting to watch during waiting sequences
With these goals, I strive for the fastest in-game clock time for each act. This means I will not be slowing down near the end in order to collect a smaller bonus (which could be shorter in overall time). By the same token, I will not optimize only to the game clock, but to the frame counter as well. Frames saved are just as important whether or not it makes a difference on the game clock of a particular level. I occasionally bent this rule (for certain bonus tags, or at the end of the run) on a case-by-case basis.
LevelTimeFrames ImprovedTSC Record
Green Hill 10:241 vs. Xebra-v30:25
Green Hill 20:1735 vs. Xebra-v30:17
Green Hill 30:3111 vs. Xebra-v30:34
Marble 10:46113 vs. Xebra-v20:54
Marble 20:5321 vs. Xebra-v21:02
Marble 31:1373 vs. Xebra-v21:19
Spring Yard 10:2243 vs. Xebra-v20:23
Spring Yard 20:2837 vs. Xebra-v20:31
Spring Yard 30:59156 vs. Xebra-v21:05
Labyrinth 10:4058 vs. Xebra-v20:47
Labyrinth 20:52N/A0:58
Labyrinth 31:08N/A1:28
Star Light 10:22160 vs. HCc-SL10:26
Star Light 20:1718 vs. Ouzo-SL20:22
Star Light 30:44132 vs. Ouzo-SL30:59
Scrap Brain 10:32N/A0:39
Scrap Brain 20:43N/A0:46
Scrap Brain 30:1831 vs. HCc-SB30:20
Final Zone1:13N/A1:13
TSC Records are accurate as of date of submission.
Points of Interest:
  • Green Hill 3 - Robotnik cannot be hit 8 consecutive times. This is because during the first hits, he is moving downward, making it appear as though Sonic is bouncing high enough on his own to land another hit. Once Robotnik moves left instead of down, Sonic doesn't have the necessary height, and must land once to deliver the final blow.
  • Marble 1 - There are two spots where Sonic jumps late, although it's difficult to spot at 100% speed. These pauses are done to manipulate the frame that the moving platform will emerge from the wall later - if it comes out too late, Sonic can't jump directly onto the spiked chandelier above, and must wait two seconds to proceed. Additionally, the number of rings Sonic has when jumping onto the lava can affect which way he bounces, which is why rings are avoided near the pistons earlier.
  • Marble 3 - A block is pushed with extra speed. This happens when Sonic is a certain height above the block and pushing towards it. In normal circumstances, this technique is slower, because Sonic can't jump this low, but here, the block is both at a perfect height and a short enough distance to push that it saves time. At the boss fight, falling into the lava allows the Boss to appear two frames sooner than if the lava was jumped.
  • Spring Yard 3 - Robotnik cannot be hit when at the height of his flying pattern, so there is a slight delay between the 6th and 7th hit.
  • Labyrinth 2 - The extra bonus tags are located about a screen's length before the final sign. Jumping to get them costs 5 frames, and they are only worth 300 points together (as opposed to the 11000 points I do get), so they were skipped. The jumping at the end of the level is just to show that they aren't there.
  • Labyrinth 3 - This was the most frustrating of all the levels for me, but it turned out great. I first did a slightly-tool-assisted preliminary run (to have something to run against; this seems to help me at this game), where I found out I didn't need to stop for air bubbles. When I actually did the fully optimized run, I was running out of air. Turns out that in my preliminary run, I jumped an extra time at the beginning of the water, extending my air, but this wasted about 20 frames. Thus began the quest to optimize this level to death. The names of my backups tell the story best:
    • L3 drown.gmv
    • L3 even closer but still drowning.gmv
    • L3 disgusting how close I am.gmv
    • L3 stupid (bleep)ing water.gmv
    • L3 SWEET GLORIOUS WATER.gmv
Sonic jumps out of the water at the absolute last available frame before he would drown. This makes for an exciting watch!
  • Scrap Brain 1 - The basics of this glitch involve ducking on the platform to enter the wall. Once inside, pressing left will blast sonic to the right at a ridiculous velocity the screen can't hope to match. Because Sonic is going so fast, he can pass through certain walls / obstacles. By the time the screen finds Sonic, he has already ran through an area that normally would require a lot of pausing, due to fire and crushers.
  • Scrap Brain 2 - I was unable to get to the section with the sawblades fast enough to make it under all of them, so taking the hit on the second one was the fastest choice (as I can still take advantage of the third conveyor belt moving to the right).
  • Final Zone - There are two different ways to "finish" the game, each of them getting a different input time, but both fading out the screen at the same time:
    • 18.26.05 - Sonic will run far enough to fade the screen at the earliest time
    • 18.28.15 - Input continues long enough for Sonic to hit Robotnik one last time (not necessary, but sort of anti-climatic if it's left out).
Thus, the input could be terminated two seconds earlier and still make it to the ending.
Suggested description: Somewhat fast bouncing around. The lack of a spin-dash makes the strategy a bit different than the other Sonic runs. Completed without collecting any emeralds.
Suggested screenshot: Frame 11.49.33 or 12.06.04
The curse has been broken, enjoy the run!


TASVideoAgent
They/Them
Moderator
Joined: 8/3/2004
Posts: 15541
Location: 127.0.0.1
This topic is for the purpose of discussing #907: JXQ's Genesis Sonic the Hedgehog in 18:28.25
Former player
Joined: 6/15/2005
Posts: 1711
Let me be the first to say what a great run this is, and I'm sorry for not being able to help out more. Awesome job.
Zoey Ridin' High <Fabian_> I prett much never drunk
Joined: 5/17/2004
Posts: 106
Location: Göteborg, Sweden
Very good run, on a long-cursed and delayed game. Heartily agree about the end-of-movie call: the important thing is the speed & quality of the actual run, not the size of the movie file. Also, I'm not quite sure interpersonal conflict really belongs in a run submission text, but meh.
Skilled player (1826)
Joined: 4/20/2005
Posts: 2161
Location: Norrköping, Sweden
Allow me to throw yet another YES vote on this. :) Very nice work, my favourite part was on the third stage, where you practically flew above the entire level. Pure awesomeness. Three, umm I mean, two thumbs up! :)
Spacecow
He/Him
Joined: 6/21/2004
Posts: 247
Location: New Hampshire
Easy yes. Great work, JXQ!
Xerophyte wrote:
Also, I'm not quite sure interpersonal conflict really belongs in a run submission text, but meh.
As much of a jerk as xebra was in the planning thread, I'd have to agree. IMO it'd be best to just let it go.... grudges aren't healthy :)
Player (71)
Joined: 8/24/2004
Posts: 2562
Location: Sweden
Wow! Already finished eh? I gotta watch this run some day. :D To tired right now. But I smell a YES-vote heading your way.
JXQ
Experienced player (761)
Joined: 5/6/2005
Posts: 3132
Spacecow wrote:
As much of a jerk as xebra was in the planning thread, I'd have to agree. IMO it'd be best to just let it go.... grudges aren't healthy :)
I don't intend to hold a grudge. I included that section in the submission because it temporarily affected the quality of the run and how much motivation I had to work on it - the submission guidelines say to "describe the making of the movie." I also thought my message of not being bullied was important to voice. Thanks for the comments guys!
<Swordless> Go hug a tree, you vegetarian (I bet you really are one)
Quietust
He/Him
Emulator Coder, Former player
Joined: 7/14/2004
Posts: 250
A very impressive run! Now I just have to get up and finish my new Sonic 2 speedrun and everyone will be happy.
* Quietust, QMT Productions P.S. If you don't get this note, let me know and I'll write you another
Player (81)
Joined: 3/11/2005
Posts: 352
Location: Oregon
Good job.
ideamagnate| .seen aqfaq <nothing happens> DK64_MASTER| .seen nesvideoagent * DK64_MASTER slaps forehead
Active player (437)
Joined: 4/21/2004
Posts: 3517
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Quietust wrote:
A very impressive run! Now I just have to get up and finish my new Sonic 2 speedrun and everyone will be happy.
Hurry! ^_^ JXQ my man, what can I say, I just watched and enjoyed every frame you played and this is truly a shhweet Christmas present for us. Im MIGHTY impressed how fast you completed this magnificent run, a true role model for us kids who never gave up despite what happened in the Sonic thread :) JXQ rocks! Of course voting Yesh.
Nitrogenesis wrote:
Guys I come from the DidyKnogRacist communite, and you are all wrong, tihs is the run of the mileniun and everyone who says otherwise dosnt know any bater! I found this run vary ease to masturbate too!!!! Don't fuck with me, I know this game so that mean I'm always right!StupedfackincommunityTASVideoz!!!!!!
Arc wrote:
I enjoyed this movie in which hands firmly gripping a shaft lead to balls deep in multiple holes.
natt wrote:
I don't want to get involved in this discussion, but as a point of fact C# is literally the first goddamn thing on that fucking page you linked did you even fucking read it
Cooljay wrote:
Mayor Haggar and Cody are such nice people for the community. Metro City's hospitals reached an all time new record of incoming patients due to their great efforts :P
Former player
Joined: 8/15/2004
Posts: 422
Location: Minnesota
Very very good. I have no complaints. You have done an excellent job. There is no doubt this deserves a star. Excellent job especially on the Labyrinth and Scrap Brain Zones. Those were always the hardest to get through and it's awesome to finally see them done perfectly.
Former player
Joined: 9/1/2005
Posts: 803
awesome, nice using zipping in a game that doesn't have spin dash :)
Former player
Joined: 8/17/2004
Posts: 377
I don't know Sonic games myself, however this movie looks well done, compared to the other Sonic runs on the site, so yes vote from me.
Joined: 10/21/2005
Posts: 2
Can someone please post the correct key config.
Player (206)
Joined: 5/29/2004
Posts: 5712
Correct key config? Isn't it just three buttons per controller? And doesn't Gens tell you so?
put yourself in my rocketpack if that poochie is one outrageous dude
Former player
Joined: 7/14/2005
Posts: 103
very nice. loved the single frame from drown part.
Former player
Joined: 7/2/2005
Posts: 309
Location: Baltimore, MD
Holy TAS Batman! This Sonic run is amazing!! Very well done, I've never seen the first three stages done that fast. This is truly a work of art, and done in such short time too. Definate YES.
Guybrush: "I'm selling these fine leather jackets." Wally: "Really?" Guybrush: "No. I 'm lying." Wally: "In that case, I don't want one!" Currently working on: Nothing at the moment.
Joined: 11/29/2005
Posts: 317
Location: Sao Paulo - Brazil
If I could vote, I would certainly vote YES.. But I can't vote =/ (am I a lurker?).. So.. Impressive ones: When you fly over the stage, when you go up in Labirynth, last stage.. Very nice one!
Emulator Coder
Joined: 10/9/2004
Posts: 453
Location: Norway
very nice :D Finally!!!
Joined: 5/3/2004
Posts: 1203
As always, your personal attacks warm my heart. You no doubt still have negative feelings towards me, so I encourage you to further explore your grievances in this thread, or whichever public forum you deem appropriate. On to the run:
  • No surprises here, I still think your playing style is spastic to the extreme. Considering you lose time against existing WIPs in a number of places, I'm surprised you weren't willing to make greater allowances in order to make your play look smoother and more effortless. Just as an example, if you have to tap back and forth in quick succession, it's very difficult to see you doing it if you are balled up, and thus looks a lot less choppy than otherwise.
  • You did not discover the optimal path for Marble 1, Marble 2, or Spring Yard 3, at the very least. You also missed a minor collision/boost in Labyrinth 1, though by itself it's not enough to improve the clock. The other levels use paths better than anything I have knowledge of.
I'm curious, why do you single out my Spring Yard 1 as being excellent when you improved comparatively less on some other levels? Other than the errors I have mentioned, the choppiness of Sonic's movements, and your inability to bury hatchets, the run is good.
Player (206)
Joined: 5/29/2004
Posts: 5712
But you're the one who's always saying mean things like "you're always saying mean things" so I think you'd better look at yourself first
put yourself in my rocketpack if that poochie is one outrageous dude
Joined: 11/16/2005
Posts: 46
lol nice 3rd level
JXQ
Experienced player (761)
Joined: 5/6/2005
Posts: 3132
Thanks to everyone for the comments! Questions to answer (for xebra, since no one else asked questions): There were two levels where your WIPs stayed on the screen after hitting the sign, and I included those in the "frames gained" column. The two levels were Green Hill 2 and Spring Yard 1, in each of these I gained only one frame before the sign; the rest were the result of choosing to not stay on the screen until after the score counting screen started. That's why I singled Spring Yard 1 as good, along with the entire v3 WIP you did. As far as smoother / effortless play - to me, the run doesn't look more playable by a human if it's smoother, but still perfectly cutting corners, making jumps, and so forth. It also is no secret that my weak point of making runs is the aesthetics. For example, in the Super Demo World, anything that looks remotely cool was probably done by Fabian. I was the frame hunter, and that's how I do these runs the best. (Edit; trying to explain better) I also never cared for the idea of optimizing as much as possible, and then picking and choosing which optimizations to discard in trade off for a smoother watch. I would feel like I was wasting frames in areas that I knew could be done faster. As far as losing time against existing WIPs, I tried hard to avoid this. Perhaps I don't have these WIPs you speak of? For each level that I had a run to go against, I did the same thing I was doing at the beginning of the run in the forums; making a bunch of checkpoints and comparing times to make sure I wasn't falling behind for part of the level, even if I gained some frames earlier. I'm not saying this couldn't have happened, but it was something I tried to minimize very much.
You did not discover the optimal path for Marble 1, Marble 2, or Spring Yard 3
I'm curious, do you know off hand how much these improvements would add up to? One more question, do you think you'll ever continue work on your run? Competition breeds perfection, they say.
<Swordless> Go hug a tree, you vegetarian (I bet you really are one)
Joined: 11/16/2005
Posts: 46
I think this should get a star if you didn't get hit by that ball in Scape Brain 2. I know what did was the fastest, but new viewers might be turned off by it. (Since star'd runs are intended to get new viewers started) And... Next: Super Mario Bros. 3 (no warps) Can't wait =)
Joined: 9/17/2005
Posts: 47
Most entertaining run since chip 'n dale 2-player. Awesome.