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Nice finds everyone. I'm sure we'll discover the fastest route soon. Don't forget that there is also the up+down+jump on tubes arp to skip long levels, for those levels that are goign to be played out normally.
All this is making me so excited to finally get back to the TASing scene and get started.
bkDJ wrote:
haha, wow, THIS is an interesting development. I would support using any glitch necessary for an any% now since it would be so short, and 100%. not sure about the other category cf mentioned though :)
Baxter wrote:
Most logical seems to me one movie as fast as possible with no restrictions whatsoever (any%), and one movie which collects 100% in every level. If it turns out you can go back several times to 1-1 to collect 100% faster, I think that should be banned (for 100% tas), since the goal of these TASes is entertainment after all.
I can see that if a glitched any% run is submitted people won't want to have it obsolete the current movie if there isn't a 100% one yet. Maybe it's better if a 100% movie obsoletes the current movie, and the glitched movie doesn't.
If there is a movie which completes the game as fast as possible, and a 100% movie, an any% nonglitched movie probably doesn't show much more than the other two movies do.
Hm, good points. I suppose I'm ok with this not obsoleting anything, then 100% obsoleting the current any%. I did kind of want to also work on a longer YI run as well, so maybe in the future I'll find myself working with 100% as well. We shall see.
The 100% WIP does use a warp to skip through 2-1 and collects the rest of the flowers/coins in 1-1; we've found some more warps that are doable to do the same thing, plus there is the up+down jump on tubes, so I guess 100% should have absolutely no warps whatsoever, which means the long autoscrolling section in 2-1 needs to be done as well.
laughing_gas wrote:
Gah, this thing is annoying. It seems like the # of eggs you pick up, the # of eggs you use, and the # of eggs you finish the level with all combine to determine where the next level will warp you to. This game is getting close to being King's Bounty.
Well, then theoretically we can go directly from 1-1 to 6-8, right?
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Well. Yoshi Island beaten in under 20 or 30 minutes then I presume?
I better get started then, which could be as soon as this thursday.
And I'd like for there to be 3 categories if that's alright (hm I seem to be saying that a lot recently... but it's true, good games shouldn't have category restrictions) glitchy warped, any% (using only warps not caused by left+right, i.e. the tubes and world map) and 100%.
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Yippee! I'm glad to finally see this completed.
I'm going to withold from voting until I can watch it in its entirety by the end of the week, but I'm most likely going to vote yes. Stellar work from the WIPs I had seen of a classic N64 game that many have played.
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Alrighty thanks. (Can't watch yet, but I will when I get the chance, hopefully as soon as this thursday.)
But I have run into a problem (this is of course assuming that all tubes that you can go down into can lead into a warp to 1-1):
There are too many of these kind of tubes in the game.
I just did a casual look through of tubes, in the first 4 worlds, that you can go down and would theoretically be able to warp, and counted about 15 levels that contained one. This was with watching the published run, not going in the game exploring (I remember the 100% WIP had more tubes that Yoshi went down into), so there's bound to be many more.
This might lead to a sub 1 hour, more boring movie. Which would be no fun at all, and not let me show off the improvements I have conceptualized for those levels. (Again, this is in theory if all those tubes let me warp.)
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I sure hope it's legit. It's a potentially big time saver.
I'm curious about the up+down on tubes... how does it make you skip the animation if you don't use it to warp? do you just go down in the tube faster? I suppose it's best if I can test these things out myself, but I'm still unable to...
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Well, we have a pilotwings topic already.... whereupon it was found that the game desynchs, which was kind of out of place. But hopefully the theory behind a new mupen will help in the stability of recording, which will certainly make many more N64 games TASable that weren't before.
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Me too. Two of my runs in the making would greatly benefit from having a fixed mupen with some new tasty features (mem watching, start from SRAM, record reset, desynch free, etc.)
Best of luck!
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Gocha, I remember you saying there was maybe a warp in world 3 as well.... nice find, skipping the pipe animation is going to be very handy as well, even without warping. I had already surmised a possible 5 minutes could be saved from 1 hour and 38 minutes... looks like it can be by even more.
I'm also very interested in seeing those clips.... while I've been away, each day I've been poring over the published run and trying to mentally conceptualize improvements and new tricks (I already found a frame saver in my 1-1 any% that I had overlooked), and my goal is to have every conceivable trick, glitch, and improvement known before Baxter and I eventually begin working.
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TheFrigz wrote:
I'm not trying to be rude, but has there been any progress made on this run?
always, always feel free to ask me this question on absolutely anything I'm working on.
Tme for another update. 'Nuff said.
Laptop still not back in my hands where it belongs. Am trying to remedy that.
Summer Camp has started, so 10ish hours of my day are now being used constructively. (counter-constructive to movie making. But you gotta know your priorities.)
MMF has not moved a single subpixel.
Biggest update: For those that haven't heard yet, a new mupen may be made that can solve desynching and possibly add record reset functions, which would thereby let me skip 3 trophy receiving cinematics (like the SMK movie.) I would very much like for the run to be made on a mupen with record reset, since that can help me save 3 minutes. The problem? Compatibility; it'd use a new movie file format, and a converter might not work, meaning all progress I have so far would need to be redone.
So 'dat's the scoop. This is reporter Comicalflop with the evening TAS news, you stay classy, planet Earth.
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speedruns.net asks permission from the authors if they can encode their run and publish it on that site, which also gets the youtube treatment. the lower time is from the newly submitted, shorter time from zggzdydp in the workbench.
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you just had to make a new submission when I'm currently unable to view/make runs... :-( Uch such bad timing.
It seems many people are still noticing areas of improvement with precision... I'd strongly suggest to delay this, use the same route but get frame perfection i.e. no turboing (it's easier than you may think), and to have someone watch your progress to make sure you are doing everything as perfect as it can be. (I would, but damn inactivity...)
For the raising platform just before Final Fight: I used Maxim's diagonal aerial attack to be closer to the middle and right underneath the floor, then did a diving kick to teleport directly onto where the raising platform would be. However, Juste has A) slow falling water physics and B) only a double jump. I'd have to experiment to see if doing it the way I did with Maxim is possible.
N. Harmonik wrote:
Can we have a No Glitch Run now? I'd like to see that giant boss again.
I would also like to either see or make such a warpless (no wall sinking) run myself.
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I kid you not, that took me as many days as when you posted that until now to figure out just exactly how useful that is, having completely missed that it's done in the published run. Since it's doable in 2-1, which is likely many seconds saved, and can maybe be done elsewhere as well... I'm just concerned if every level has a warp, that'd be kind of boring to see the end of 1-1 for each stage.
But that does give me more motivation to eventually make an any% improvement.
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DK64_MASTER wrote:
comicalflop wrote:
I'm still waiting to get my laptop back. Confiscation sucks.
Looking/sharing porn with the little kiddies at summer camp?
I'll have you know two summers ago the kiddies were looking at inapporpriate pictures on googleimages in the computer lab; I helped facilitate upgraded safety features to prevent such internet misuse. I'm a good counselor, not a bad one.
No, what happened is that my responsibilities slacked a little last week, I forgot to do a massive weeding project and forgot to answer phone calls and such.
On the other hand, I get to go do fun summer things until I get it back (and until camp starts, but I'll TAS after hours then), like beaches, babes, friends' houses, working, etc. I suggest you all go out and try it.
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So you're homophobic, scared for potential children viewers (you say we can't claim there aren't; likewise, I doubt there's as many children viewers as you imply), and against 2 player runs despite them legitimately beating 1 player records with the increased effort that goes into making them. Alrighty then, I learn something new everyday it seems.
As for the run, I vote meh. The game was not appealing to me at all, but you made it not a waste of my time.
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moozooh wrote:
Well, I'll ask you one question then: it might be that this run won't get accepted. Are you still willing to do it? If so, go ahead.
I believe in three things: that there is demand to see such a run, that warpless/no warps categories can be made for HoD without too many people getting upset, and that I have good communication skills to persuade on why a warpless Maxim run should be accepted if the need arises. And if not, I'll still have made a kickass run, and we're not really just aiming to make publications to increase how many movies we have under our names right? So yes, I'm still willing to do it.
The only main immediate problem is that Senor Flop still has no route. (working on it! would reeeally like some assistance!)
Simon Belmont boss rush would be cool; SIMON BELMONT FOREVER! I was planning on doing a Maxim boss rush (my unofficial name for the Maxim warpless run is boss rush, hehe) so that I can make boss strategies on the toughies I'll be facing, but you know how it is when sharing savestates with the same game :-/ maybe when I'm done I'll do 3 boss rushes for each character, then maybe later think about improving a Juste run, or maybe opposite that order.
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Maxim is indeed overpowered (that's actually why I like him, when it comes to character movement and style), but the boss fights won't all look the same, just some of them. The bosses come in different shapes, sizes, behaviors, and amounts of HP, and these factors all will inevitably make the fights look different from the "throw shuriken, then do mirage" technique that is shown against the Living Armor, and first seen against Dracula Wraith in the short run.
Both the shuriken glitch, and the mirage attack are most effective when the boss is very large; there is more room for the shuriken to move inside the boss itself, and thus lead to more frames where the glitch is active and damaging every frame; and a wider size will make it more likely that more "mirage Maxim's" will hit (and therefore also increase the chance that some will be criticals? more hits = more potential criticals). Some bosses are almost Maxim's size and both attacks would not be as effective, and some bosses have different phases that may make either attack ineffective as well (Giant Bat for example.) Also, I calculated Maxim's shuriken attack on Living Armor to deal 1323 damage; his HP was 3375. shurkien then mirage worked perfectly; comparatively, some bosses later on are smaller in size and have greater HP, and that technique will not work as well, or at all.
Also, I believe in variance, so I wouldn't make all 18 boss fights look the same anyways. I'm also assuming that most people enjoy insanely fast boss fights; Maxim puts them to shame, then flies through the castle like a speed demon to the next one, which is what I wanted the run to exemplify.
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I've waited for so long for this to be completed... every single day in my mind I thought "oh Arne is somewhere at this level by now.... how much different will it be?"
There is absolutely no way that I cannot give this a yes vote. Yes, yes, yes all the way. You improved it by so much time, found many new creative glitches and shortcuts, and have given me an incredible benchmark with which to compare for when I decide to complete 102% as I always intended. DKC2 is one of my all time favorite games, Sami's was one of my all time favorite runs, and you have given the community one hell of a TAS. 157k rerecords? 1 year to make? It was so, so, so, so, so worth it. Even though there were minor frame savers that you and myself have noted, it is still incredible.
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I'm glad you're taking the time to speak on everybody's behalf and trying to impose your dislike for mupen and pass it off as what the other 2,00ish members feel.
I have not had the time to get the ROM yet; last time I did, it didn't work for me, so I don't want to waste effort. And this isn't exactly the most popular of all n64 games, so people tripping over themselves to post likely won't happen.
The crickets aren't chirping, but they are watching, so work away.
