Posts for Comicalflop


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Shadow Byrn wrote:
Comicalflop... you DA man! It seems you are working on 3 or more BIG games right now...I hope you can get them done eventually...
you and me both, buddy. well, I don't know about JFG and OoT is technically upcoming until a complete TAS route is devised.
VANDAL wrote:
(and sub-sequently more frustration towards desyncs).
why it was desynching so in early in the game I don't know. I was under the impression that MM desynchs frequently, and OoT rarely, so I dunno what the dealio was with that.
mmbossman wrote:
Big doesn't even describe it. Oot is likely to be 5.5+ hours, MK 64 will likely pass 500,000 rerecords by the time it's done, and JFG is another 3-4 hour long ordeal. If you manage to complete all of these at the same time somewhere in 2009 I'll nominate you for ninja on the spot. Or at least master of dedication.
Yeah, OoT will be long, MK64 more likely 200,000 rerecords not 500,000, and again don't know what the future of JFG holds since both MK64 and OoT (moreso MK64) have taught me a lot about making perfect TASes. To be honest, JFG is very unoptimal in my eyes. I am in no position to receive a ninja title. dedication praises I can see, but in no way do I fit the ninja bill.
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Ersatz wrote:
I have no idea what happened at Frappe Snowlands but it blew my mind...
This is a well known FS shortcut... I'm a bit disappointed that I won't have mushrooms.
Titus Kwok wrote:
I thought you were just screwing around, there... took me completely by surprise when you won.
Expect this to be a common theme in the run :)
mmbossman wrote:
bkDJ wrote:
those were some good video edits, almost had me believing this, on april fools day. :P
I dunno, MK64 does some wacky stuff with out of bounds placement. Lets just say I wouldn't be surprised if the was real or fake.
Yeah, generally the only solid parts of the game are the tracks. most everything else is there for us crazy people to find shortcuts :P With the stuff Weatherton and I brainstorm, the final product will be so beyond having words to describe it. Practically every day that Weatherton and I chat on IM we come up with a new shortcut or new application of an older one, and it's not rare to come up with many shortcuts in a few hours.
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Man, desynchs suck.... Anyways, one night of frustration later: OoT 100% up to Deku Shield 3.6 seconds faster than Guano's.
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by skip I don't mean physically skip the items needed to get 100%, but skip to do things faster and when backtracking get the skipped stuff faster. don't know how much of that can happen... I ran into a desynch and need to redo, but I encoded my 40 rupee route, all the way up to and inside the shop, 2.7 seconds faster than Guano's. only slight mistakes, I had to wait 14 frames to slash the bush for 3 rupees so that was unavoidable, during sidehopping I made a quick angle adjustment that ended up being 3 frames slower in collecting the blue rupee, maybe need to roll on the stones a little better, besides that, flawless. Wiki pages anyone can edit, I don't want some nublet coming along and screwing with it (unless that page has editing privileges? I know schtuff.com has editing privileges that I can assign)
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There will be backtracking to get these. Kid Link (or Adult, by glitching in, most likely Kid Link) will get the other 2 in Deku Tree (or I might get all 3, dunno at this point) and adult link WILL get the rest in dodongos. currently 78 frames ahead when exiting the tunnel after getting the word... lost 10 in trying to get 3 from 1 bush, and trying to whack more bushes to make skipping the blue rupee in the shop possible, and maybe find a concrete way to skip the "look with Z" dialogue. Maybe a sidehop-jumpslash? I might maybe put the route on schtuff.com, so that both of us can edit it without needing to send documents back and forth. and maybe add links within the route to make subsection routes, like within dungeons and such, or to make alternate paths.
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SMW lends to a superior walkathon, as there's way more things to do when crawling along, and many neat tricks were done to speed up, get past an impossible area or simply add entertaining things while hopping along. yes vote.
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.fmc? shouldn't it be .smv?
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lovely, was jump-kazooie-cancelling that quickly frame faster? should Sami do the same movement?
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He does bring up a good point though. What line do we draw when we judge the game instead of the player's input itself?
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did my research: http://speeddemosarchive.com/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=consoles_older;action=display;num=1167328247;start=15 This is a skeleton route for a SS (no save-warp) 100%. I see many parts that can go in: -go to spirit early and use a death warp. the only thing that needs changing is to lose two more hearts (any% enters the temple with only 2 hearts left), and I'm sure that on the way to spirit temple, and inside the temple itself are more sources of damage that can be received, like the helicopter blade thingie ( I am no OoT junkie so I don't know all the names of everything), jump off the gerudo mountain and possibly angle it to receive damage from a farther/higher jump, collect the skulltula in the haunted wasteland and take damage from it before collecting it, and leevers. inside the temple there is plenty of sources of damage, and when bombchus are collected ocarina warp to the warp point and take quick damage from the leeevers there or, better yet collect the silver gauntlets (unless unnesscessary) and death warp from the fall. -go to dudungos/Jabu Jabu before Hyrule Castle, since this is now possible. -be sure to collect as much stuff in one area as possible, using the tools available to make unreachable stuff reachable. this is to minimize backtracking as much as possible -0 beans nescessary -maybe find a way to skip the sun song, doubtful though, too many skulltulas needed at night -possible to glitch into the water temple sans iron boots, maybe used to get the longshot early -damage boosts to save time in some areas/skip some stuff -use superslides to make nescessary backtracks faster -get farore's wind as soon as possible -access to seamwalks and other boundary violations SDA can't use -the song warps are going to be incredibly useful, so maybe become adult sooner than normal and learn the songs, and make Child II be a longer segment instead of just going back once to get the frog heart piece. those are just a few ideas. but a basic route was formed based on non-save warping, so at least there's something to work on. I also tested sidehopping on straights, you need to press A every 21 frames (the first A on the optimal frame to jump) and for uphills it's shorter, but probably not by A every other frame, and downhill is an even longer wait between presses of A. so pressing A every other frame is most certainly going to lose some frames. Interestingly, making sure to press A on the optimal frame is more what the any% run should be doing instead of 100% since 100% probably can sacrifice frames in making the run go faster, but meh...
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I'm going to make a quick update for those wondering "Where the hell is Moo Moo Farm?" I'm still on the 1st lap, 10 seconds in. my momentum decreased a lot in testing a certain section, and I haven't touched it for a week, instead noodling with a few other games/ideas/activities. (OoT 100% planning, doing a lot of downloading of videos of concepts/wips, and other stuff.) I'll try to get back on track and complete 1 lap of MMF, because once that happens the rest will come quicker since each lap will be identical for the most part and I won't have to test which routes to take between the item boxes. The good news is that Weatherton has been making a *LOT* of progress in testing future courses.
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once again, I have been very late in checking progress and posting thoughts. my only one thought was this: damn, much better/tighter. That's about what the optimization of this game should look like. How much was saved in the plane section? Heck, how many seconds did you save in each lap?
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I dunno, that sky was incredibly dreadful to look at, even worse than runway. I think my eyes were internally bleeding from such bad graphics. Look down is way less painful to watch, I'd recommend to use it.
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Mukki wrote:
I googled mine's and got this. Aside from that it's mostly just me and a bunch of German sites.
no more sonic, that pic must be your avatar now.
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mupen is pretty much where snes9x was before nitsuja made the record reset patch. It stores the sram in a .fla file, and can only record a movie from reset or savestate, no "with sram" option. there is a reset ROM option, so if the same thing for snes9x was done here to make that command still record when it reset, then it would work. depending on how much time a death warp will save, dying might be an option. instead of letting one monster/s whittle away, you might want to be completely reckless and consistently take damage throughout the entire section, so that near the end you'll be low on life. also, deathwarps could save time early on, when you haven't collected many heart pieces. The time needed to devise a TAS non-resetting route, an alternate TAS resetting route, and get the ball rolling completing the deku tree (it will be, besides frame improvements, identifical to the any%, except for 1 extra room for skulltula) I think gives a good enough time frame to make a mupen record reset patch. Edit: currently I'm up to the Kokiri Sword, 55 frames faster than Guano's .m64. I don't expect this amount of frame saveage to be consistent or worthwhile (in the sense that every few seconds I'm playing I'm magically saving time), nor indicative that I should replace him.
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we still have the 3 natural warps between Lost Woods, Goron City, and Zora's Domain. There's also the Owl Warps, some unused warps accessible by glitching (like Zora's Domain > Water Temple) some other warps that I can't remember that are also present. and to make backtracking/general movement over long distances much faster, there's superslides. 40 bomb bag upgrade = lots of room for superslides. 5:45 seems like a good goal. I'm sure that once it gets going, by the time 2:00/3:00 is reached, that enough of the TAS will be done so that a truer idea of the final time can be calculated. (TASing some dungeons/temples/areas can save mucho time, lack of save warps might lose time, etc.) EDIT: How could I have forgotten Farore's Wind?!? For Dungeons only, of course.
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Comicalflop makes no sense, and hence is very unique. But on Facebook I found someone with the EXACT same name as me in New York. I had in the past googled my name, and thought that I was the only Joshua Nyer in existence (since Nyer is not a common last name- mostly Polish/few other Euro country descent, and the family tree doesn't extend that far) but apparently not.
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I'm pretty sure that everything that I did in the .m64 is on the first possible frame. I looked at each thing that needs a button press, and found the first frame to do so. I think in pressing start at the intro screen I did faster, selecting A as name and selecting the file was the same time, pressed A on the earliest frame for all the dialogues, and also made Link leave his house optimally. 14 frames in such a long N64 game is small potatoes, but Mario Kart 64 taught me so much about perfection in TASing, which I would apply to this game as well. One MAJOR oversight I had in a TAS route vs. the segmented route is that there is not going to be 100+ savewarps and such from the segmented (can't believe I forgot about this.) There are so many parts in the segmented run where you finish a section and then go back to Link's house in Kokiri. So that probably mixes everything up. I think in the game you can quit playing and warp back to your house anyways, so when it's beneficial to do so it might be used, but not every time you beat a difficult segment. How could I forget this? one reason 100% is going to rock is that once a few heart pieces are collected, there's never going to be the annoying "beep-beep, beep-beep" of having low health! (unless a death warp is used.) 98 pages is a lot of thread to look through, but I'm aiming to document every "if only we could do that/TAS techniques" trick/route strat. soon (maybe today) I'll try and post the segmented route so that we can work off that. And about turbo, I was mainly thinking about long side hopping in one direction sections, and finding the optimal alignment angle to turn. turbo would make it easier, but I realized I can bring it down to 25%, button mash A, and that'd work just as well, just to find the perfect alignment angle. And yeah Frame Advance would be used in the end.
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It is game specific. It does not work in OoT, MM, or Starfox 64. practically all other N64 games I've tested/played have the turbo work fine with the TAS input plugin. so maybe N-Rage will have to be used. does that allow a controller to be plugged in, and switch back and forth like with the TAS Input Plugin?
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It's this exact part- right click the box- that doesn't work. the check mark will fade in and out really fast, and it will not register at all.
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very sure.
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My older brother got the fierce deity mask a few years back. the MM guidebook was essential to do so. OoT 100% is also all items, heart containers, masks, stuff in the menu, so it's also varied as well. But enough of MM vs. OoT, let's get the ball rolling! I'm going to go sort through the 98 pages of SDA thread, and first, copy/paste their route as the skeleton, and second, pick out all the tricky stuff they couldn't do. off the top of my head, there's zora domain > Lake Hylia, Dodongo Cavern bombchu staircase, leave Lon Lon Ranch over the fence via bomb/cuccoo boost, Deku Tree wall clip, many other wall clips in general, supersliding (makes hikes across Hyrule better) and some discrepencies of route decisions of what's hard vs. what's easy (a TAS could do the harder route without worry.) There's plenty more I'm sure. I myself am considering this for the future (it'd be nice if MK64 was done and there was a solid TAS route complete. At least I know one can possibly be done in the foreseeable future.) At the moment that I get the green light, I already have a .m64 up to Kokiri forest, ending just before sidehopping down the ladder, 14 frames faster than Guano's (gained by exclusive frame advance for dialogues, and making the roll inside the house real tight.) My only complaint is that the TAS Input plugin doesn't allow the turbo function to work, which bites, especially for sidehopping segments or other parts that'd be easier with turbo. (am I going to have to do it with N-Rage, a plugin I am very unfamiliar with?)
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liked the new batch of optimized baked goods. at the charging bulls, I don't feel as if that part was handled fast enough. it seems that on a mostly flat surface that normal speed can be attained, but it seemed like Glover was struggling at times to maintain a good velocity.
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Most of the brokenness I'm familiar with is OoT, which comes from seeing an OoT TAS, snooping around at SDA, and the HUGE plethora of youtube videos, hence why I wanted outside opinion specific to MM. (and the fact that most of the places YE's segments visits has some sort of shortcut/glitch. that's a lot of Hyrule that's buggy.) I know MM has the goron bomb boost, superior hover staircases, good sequence breaks on its own, fly in mid air, but those I got from an occasional youtube vid, the 3:37 speedrun, and Mukki's wip. I haven't seen the MM 100% (it's kind of outdated, so besides route/sequence breaks it won't have much to offer again correct me if wrong) so I don't know what that has to offer. so then here's a better proposal: who wants to modify the OoT 100% route to be TAS, in the hopes of becoming implemented soon, and who wants to formulate TAS improvements to the MM 100%, to be implemented once someone truly crazy comes along or the desynch issues is fixed?
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Mukki, you're the most hardcore person with the chutzpah to do MM any%, I'd be surprised to find someone *more* dedicated than you, adept at minimizing desynchs with a different style of TASing, and the patience with a desynch laden-game. Because OoT is more stable, there's a very up-to-date speedrun in the works (the 100% MM is *very* old) and has a larger fanbase/anticipation, I think it should be done first. (regardless, MM any% should be finished before 100% MM, just to see if it's even possible to complete with all the desynchs.) when it comes down to MM 100% vs. OoT 100% (plus some other general notes concerning the both of them): I predict them both to be average out to the same time, 6ish hours, give or take. this may vary; it could be the sub 7 goal of the OoT speedrun may be the limit, despite tool assistance. MM is very strange; there are drastically faster ways to play the game since the speedrun was made, and based on the 3:37 vs. 2:40ish ratio of any% MM to any% MM TAS, I expect the 100% MM to drop similarly way below an expected level. This causes a tricky problem: the run goes in 4 cycles. you can use songs to speed up time to accomodate for the faster pace of a TAS, but calculating when to speed up and manage time perfectly to match the events that you have to be present for will be beyond painstaking. Similarly, revising the OoT 100% route to be suited for TAS is no walk in the park either. there are many conditional reasons for the segmented route, and being able to do some glitches/sequence breaks might throw off the order in which you'll end up doing things, and the route is best described as a web; take out one strand, and the thing falls apart, you have to build it from scratch. Many TASable shortcuts/route ideas will throw the rest of the route into chaos. Interestingly, both runs have a solid route laid out; the bad part is that each needs would need a major overhaul. Much of the time saved in either run will be from TAS precision/speed, so it's tricky to calculate how much time will be saved from a route change and how much time is saved by doing a boundary glitch. in MM, being able to do one temple 5+ minutes faster might throw off timed events. for OoT, you might be able to quickly beat one dungeon saving mucho time, warp somewhere, and use a boundary glitch, but then the speedrun's route, which was optimal in its case (months of research went into it) becomes null for the TAS. (those are just two random examples.) Exploration: the OoT any% skips so much stuff, the 100% is like a pleasure cruise through the parts of the game that were missed. MM any% skips stuff but not as fervently as OoT. you still visit *most* of the places, and 100% is more about showcasing all the items and sidequests involved with masks. Entertainment: which game is better? Probably not a good question to ask, but it seems pertinent. I'd say OoT and MM any% are about on par with each other, in terms of amount of action, similarity of action (they're both N64 zelda games, but regardless) coolness in stuff that's skipped, and plain beating the game in an unprecedented time. but the games differ slightly in their 100% goals. and which is better, running through Hyrule collecting heart pieces and skulltulas, or roaming around Termina trying to solve mini quests? I'm going to make a quick synopsis of what I think the OoT 100% will look like, based on watching the segments and from what a TAS can offer from the any%. I have not fully watched the MM 100%, (I assume similarly the MM any% TAS quality will be inserted) but I am less familiar with how entertaining that 100% speedrun is, so if someone wants to fill in what that one was like. OoT is going around collecting hearts and spiders, but in doing so every square inch of Hyrule has to be explored. it was a bummer that most of the game was skipped in any%, so it's a bonus to see the entire game. the good news is that these other sections of the game are *mostly* broken about as badly as the places the any% went to. pretty much every location has glitches, techniques, or new findings that make them completable in a fast, entertaining manner. while there's the drudginess of having to go on a nice fetch quest and walk all over the place, the new techniques discovered lead to some new warps, some clever pre existing warps, and new methods of travel (superslide) that make running around in Hyrule not as much of a bore. Also, is the process of attaining said spiders and hearts. with the new glitches/techniques discovered, shortcuts have been found in the attaining of these. that, plus clever use of the hookshot/boomerang can be used to very quickly nab these and leave in a hurry. I really do not expect the general pace of the run to stop/slow down at any point. (I'm reminded of the All Souls AoS run in a way.) All 5 temples will be done, all dungeons will be completed (all in fast manner of course) and the whole game will be given the TAS treatment. it is also a very good opportunity to show how the entire game is broken, not just the any% route. There are a myriad of many documented tricks and glitches in other parts of the game that will be able to see the light of day in this run. I really hope that in the future we will have 4 published zelda runs, but with the discrepencies of a new discovery for the OoT any% (even if this new trick doesn't work, the any% was nearing completion, despite a hiatus from the author.), the steady progress of the MM any%, the unproven potential of MM 100% (plus the fact that MM desynchs like a mofo), I believe that the OoT 100% should be given focus. that was a lot to digest, I might've missed something or could elaborate on something more, if you want to give your opinions on any of this (particularly info about the MM 100% speedrun) feel free. is anybody interested in starting to piece together an OoT 100% TAS route?
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