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Did a bunch of testing and Samus is not going down any faster, so she's done. got 4:58 Metal Mario. Score: 1352051 vs. Metal Mario 4:58
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I just made a test run of Samus, 16 seconds, getting star finish, no item, hawk, speedster, no miss x8, no damage, full power, smashless, fighter stance, acid clear, with a final score of 1201151. I tested how many air drills it took to clear Samus, I did 3 down drill and did a back kick then cutter, and she came back down, so I tried 4 down drill, then back kick then cutter, and she died. So 4 is optimal. I must admit, I was suprised at the power of a tool assisted drill attack. I think the final cutter can be improved to save one second, as it took a few tries and Samus was either dodging or using her VERY annoying up+b, so I just noodled around until I could kill her to see the score, so I can probably shave off one second with an optimal cutter. This was SO much easier to do than Kirby/Yoshi Team, I did in in probably less than 10 minutes. and thegreginator, I'm sure it'll satisfy your action needs. vs. Samus .m64
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up tilt juggling nullifies hawk since it's on the ground, that's the thing, other wise that'd be best. I found that with Z-cancelling you can actually prevent opponents from being knocked away by down+a aerial, especialy if it's an optimal drill that starts near the ground and barely finishes before touching the ground. What I'm most concerned about is, what % damage does Samus need to be to fall into the background after hitting the plasma?
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I just redid Kirby Stage, making sure every Cutter was aerial, and ended up with 2 seconds slower and no hawk bonus, so no Hawk is available in this stage by using the projectile part of cutter which is what I did. Using the sword part of Cutter will not work, because hitting them up does not cause them to die forcing me to do it many many times, the only way is if I can spike them into the bottom of the screen which would waste time because they do not float beyond the boundaries of the bottom platform unless hit there. So the first .m64 I posted is the highest score in the lowest time. Anyone have suggestions for Samus stage? antd, any ideas? I'm thinking of getting Hawk, Star Finish, and Acid clear, but using down air drill and stone to rack up damage, then at the optimal moment use a cutter spike to send Samus straight down into the Lava, and then have her have enough damage% to fall into the background, as opposed to psychoticworm's first vid where Samus was beaten using smash a as afst as possible.
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I'm sure there could be more, but those were the first two to come to mind. It's sad that this hasn't been accepted yet.
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Can't you backflip, and drop a bomb in mid-air, which'll give more time to do stuff before the bomb expoldes?
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I just got a 23 second Kirby Team fight, getting a score of 1079121 because of no item, shooter, speedster, no miss x7, no damage, full power, smashless, single move, fighter stance, and kirby ranks. I can get an additional 18,000 from hawk if I redo to make sure all attacks are aerial, because I think I mess up in one or two spots. But how's that for a killer Kirby stage? This actually proves that I wouldn't get speedster in the Yoshi stage from this strategy, since the 8 Kirby's took a while to die and I was 7 seconds above the speedster mark, and they were very crafty in dodging my attacks most of the time. So thank God I'm not going to redo, because redoing the Yoshi stage was one of the main reasons for restarting, but now I know it'd net in +1,000 points in less time., which goes against my high score timeattack goal. Edit: actually the cutter projectile is an instant Yoshi killer, so actually it is possible. It'll be featured in an improvd version if I ever decide to improve it again. I also had to manipulate them to suicide by either giving up or using their b move, depending on where I was, which is why I move about on the playing field. Kirby Stage Test Run .m64 of course Link Kirby, #3, had to be the one to mess up aerial :P it couldn't have been one of the later ones, oh no...
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thegreginator wrote:
I would actually say that watching 30 seconds of insane damage-dealing combos would be far more entertaining than just watching Fox kill himself.
That goes without saying. But for my high score, a quick pacifist is more entertaining than a prolonged one.
thegreginator wrote:
For your second run/redo of this game, I would give more thought to getting a higher score at the cost of time in some places such as Fox. I can understand how boring Yoshi Team would be, but there may be other places where going for pure score can be more entertaining than you think.
A redo of THIS run would be a higher score in a shorter time, fixing any tiny mistakes I made and keeping most of the same strategies while trying to improve slightly on time and improve on score where it wouldn't lose time. But there's also the possibility of me doing a highest possible score after that redo.
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Not particularly. I'd prefer if sidehops were taken out for making uphill climbs, but you're the author so up to you. If you think a redo for that section is nescessary, go for it.
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Since the physics of the game was changed in MM (for example crouch stabbing, I just found out by looking at SDA that it was removed in MM, I should've looked harder when I awas arguing that it still existed) it couldn't hurt to test it out. Although as helpful as it sounds, are there any levels where you need to go down into something?
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That's not true in the original. As psychotic worm found out, For Metal Mario and Pikachu they are instant kills if you swallow them and still have them in your mouth. For Link, DK, Fox and the others, this is not the case. Oopsie, I realized I had a full 3 hours to play around with Kirby level... I could've been finished with that stage by now. I'll try to get back to working on this tonight.
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it did... I don't even think getting platform #10 second to last and getting #6 last is possible, it is quite a distance to go and Kirby's last floats lose a lot of velocity. While I could cathc the first moving platform by skipping #6, I don't think it'd save time, since A) it would take a lot of time to reach platform #6 if done last and B) I don't think it's possible. I haven't started Kirby Team yet, so if anyone wants to prove me wrong go ahead... Plus, I beat the world record anyways.
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That's a great strategy. It'll be interesting to see if 5:59 is possible. Metal Mario Manipulation is going to be essential, I have now 3 vids of different ways to get mario to jump soon. I'll definetly find the fastest since I can rerecord until I get the perfect Mario movement.
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No one is going to obsolete it 5 minutes after submission, or possibly ever until they improve Mupen. You are the only one with the guts and patience to tackle this game. The only way someone could obsolete it was if there were no desynchs and someone EXTREMELY godly at this game were to play it and find many time savers/new glitches. So you have no worries, you're handling the desynchs just fine it seems and your playing this game really well.
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There's more to my arguments than just increasing my post count and upping my high post/day ratio :P Kirby stage should be done today, and possibly Samus as well. if not, the weekend is coming up soon. I look foward to when antd can start work on the fastest completion run again, it's possible he'll find a fast way to beat Samus that I may not notice going in, since we'll both be comboing Samus to rack up damage %. My plan is to get speedster, hawk (this'll be hard, limiting me to only the aerial A's and Cutter/Stone), acid clear, star finish, and whatever bonus points for Samus's % damage.
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moozooh wrote:
Since you have to get the AVI anyway, and see the answer yourself, could you please cut the amount of redundancy in your posts? I should say, they are very redundant. Probably to the Warp's level of redundancy, with the only exception that Warp doesn't post as much as you do. Have I said you're often being redundant? Oh, it seems I have. Now I'm going to get myself a glass of cola… By the way, to answer your question, the subtitles don't say anything about skips, and the magnet beam was solidified. But as you had to get the AVI and see it yourself, my answer was automatically rendered redundant. Oh my, what a pity.
I didn't have the AVI at the moment, it'll take a while to get, and I was wondering *beforehand* if those changes were made. and I see that they have, so no worries.
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wow, that actually took a while for publication for a Megaman game. Interesting. Now I have to get the AVI of this to replace the 15:48... The things that were mentioned in the 15:48, namely the point of the subtitle at the beginning telling viewers to skip ahead which I thought was unnescessary, as well as not using the patch to solidify the magna beams... was that changed?
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so I waited for one whole day of downloading the original AVI so that I'd have to download another version???? It's not biggie, and a good thinig I guess, I'll wait until the number of seeders/peers gets way higher before I redownload.
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I liked the previous version, and I liked this better. Yes vote. Plus, this game has the best music stage of any Megaman game that I've seen- Bubbleman stage!
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V9 progress is halted until Super Smash Bros High Score Timeattack is done. But the improvements are good enough that I'm excited to bring V9 to a finish. I'm glad that you liked the improvements. I was impressed myself that each level could have saved that many frames, but my figuring is that, besides the tiny mistakes that I have noticed that are improvable, the later levels won't have as much, since my TASing skill increases over time for anything that I do (as is probably the case for anyone) the later levels were better done. However, towards the very end I think I forgot to check on some very small things (like in Screech's Sprint, after the second Barrel Blast I start flapping on first possible frame, which is slower than letting the barrel blast carry me a good ways, and I realized that the restart screen can be skipped very quickly, and I can go straight to the game menu, saving about 8-10 seconds. Both of which I discovered post-publication.
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I also remembering stating at the begininning that sidehops look much slower, especially when you do them up inclines. Is it in fact faster than spinning up? I really believe that spinning is best to use when making turns and going up that inclines that you use sidehopping for- I noticed a few places where you used sidehops to do this, and it seemed much slower. It's most likely because Deku Link has slow/short jumps, both for backflips and sidehops (that probably also applis to Goron, and from what i remember the Zora sidehopped seemed to be slightly slower as well, though not as bad as Deku/Goron.) with longer pauses between jumps, and that normal Link has the best hopping action.
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laughing_gas wrote:
do you know how much extra time you still have to get speed demon? If there is a lot you could use it for some damage points to samus or metal mario, or for the aforementioned random occurences like the arwing. You're going for acid clear against samus, right?
I actually don't know, although I do know I have plenty of time for the two suggestions you make. Samus I am planning on doing a lot of damage and doing the most entertaining combo + acid clear possible. Metal Mario, since pacifist is doable and easy, would far outpace any other method of damaging. (samus pacifist is not doable. Samus is crafty, and while an acid clear + pacifist is theoretical, it's not practical at all.) Acid clear is only 1,500 points anyways, so maybe it's not that big a deal, although would look the coolest and does seem to ensure a star finish. Arwing clear is totally not worth it. I tested it, and I had to wait over 20 seconds for it to appear, and it was not in a very good position to kill Fox. I had to wait for it to appear again before Fox died. the 8 second pacifist had a much faster time, and a very similar score. another thing I forgot to mention which is big was entertainment. This is a huge thing on this website, since technically we're cheating by using tools, so we make the movies as entertaining as possible. speed is in 99.9% of cases entertaining, and it's no different here. an 8 second of Fox pacifist is going to, I guarantee, be more entertaining than a 30 second of Kirby goofing around waiting for Fox to get Arwing-afied. Same with the Yoshi stage. The pacifist stages that I do are entertaining because they are done so quickly. Who would've thought you could beat extremely tough opponents like Giant DK and, gawd, Metal Mario in under 6 seconds? and Pikachu we knew died easily, but in 2 seconds?!?
psychoticworm wrote:
SO STOP WHINING.
he was right to bring this up though, because it was not addressed at the time that I A) started this run and B) mentioned this term 'high score time attack'. Since the shorthand term of calling my run is SSB high score run, it does seem a little deceptive since higher score ARE possible. so his opinion was justified, but hopefully we've got it all cleared now.
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laughing_gas and psychotic worm, good synopsis. The fact alone that technically I'm beating psychoticworm's video, which is itself a "highest score" run, here is a VERY indepth explanation of the difference you point out of highest score time attack and highest possible score: This is a little tricky and something a little hard to explain. There are a large number of bonuses, making combinations of bonuses quite possible. Also, it is possible to get more bonus points with more time; however, I opted to get the most points per stage in as short amount of time as possible. This differs from a fastest time attack, where the goal is to have the opponent beaten in as little time as possible, skipping the bonuses, with the shortest final time after having beaten Master Hand. In order to make my run fast and interesting, I'm trying to make a high score time attack, to get the highest score in the shortest amount of time. While you get points for beating the opponent fast, you get more points for getting the bonuses, as is evident if you compare the final score of nico's run vs. psychoticworm's final score. Mathematically, you get 50 bonus points for each second, so each second wasted is 50 points. However, that is offset by the bonus points that you can get if you wait for certain circumstances to occur. For instance, I calculated that, for the Arwing clear of 4,000 points (on the lower end of bonus points), you'd have 80 seconds before the time wasted to get the bonus outpaces the bonus points from Arwing clear. I decided that, making such sacrifices of time to get other bonuses was not what I wanted. I wanted a time attack of high score, because it would be more interesting, fast paced, and entertaining to see what redicilously high score can be gotten in such a short amount of time. It is totally a personal choice, and the superior one IMO at that since this is a timeattack site. Now, let me compare it to StarFox 64, where Vidar is working on a high score run. Starfox 64 is a mostly sidescrolling game, where you can't really control your speed, besides breaking and boosting, although you have waiting periods for those; in general, it's a sidescroller, and you for the most part cannot beat the game faster than intended. With Super Smash Bros., you have a time limit of 5 minutes per stage, and depending on your skill you can beat it in as little as 10 seconds or it could take you the whole 5 minutes. But, based on skill you CAN decrease the amount of time it takes. so therefore, scorewise you could either try to, in the 5 minute limit, try to get as high a score as possible, but unlike StarFox64 you can beat it extremely fast. It is beacuse of the 5 minute limit that two goals exist: highest score in fastest time (because, based on skill you can get a high score in a low time) and highest possible score in the 5 minute time limit. I chose the more time attack oriented goal of highest score in lowest time. So higher scores than what I'm achieving are possible, but you must waste time to do so. Also, my run is competetive- if someone gets a higher score in a less amount of time than I do. Therefore, it is a solid goal for this game. I hope that clears it up, sorry for it being so long and wordy but it hits the nail on the head of what my run is about. The fact that I am going to by default get the highest score, as compared to what anyone else has got (seeing as psychoticworm holds the record of 2.4 million), is just icing on the cake. unless someone makes a dedicated run going for the absolute highest score possible without bothering about time, then it's similarly going to hold the higest score title. when I'm done, I might consider doing this, since I proved that the two are seperate categories. 1: Fastest time 2: Highest Score in shortest amount of time 3: Highest physically possible score in any amount of time. as I mentioned, and this is probably the most important point, so I'll reiterate, since these are all competitive, that makes each it's own category. Someone could A) try to get the fastest time possible, as antd is doing to beat nico, B) try to get the highest score in the lowest time, as I'm doing to beat psychoticworm, or C) get the highest score that the game can produce.
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Mupen does allow up to 4 controllers. So yes, a 3 controller TAS is feasible, but sounds extremely difficult. There is a Genesis Lost Vikings 3 player TAS, so my guess is that it's not impossible. Just very, very, very, hard.
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almost true: for Link and G. DK they are not automatic kills against the enemy if you hit the bottom with them still in your mouth. For Pikachu and Metal Mario it is. I can jump and suck with Pikachu and Metal Mario, to try and get to the bottom of the screen as fast as possible, but Link and DK require me to wait for the exact moment on the edge, because if I fall one frame to soon or early, I'll spit him out too early, losing time, or getting unsuccessful, or spit out too late, when I'm already dead. Waiting on the ledge makes me spit out Link/DK without harming them, and it takes a few seconds for that to happen, thus I wait on the edge and get "wobbled" off. If I were to spit out or copy DK or Link by hitting A or B, it deals damage to them, making me lose Pacifist.
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