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dudes wrote:
rules
I think it's a good idea to keep in mind the origins and spirit of the rom version rule. It came into place at first because:
(1) it was hard to tell which run was better than another when timing had to be done basically by hand and fell on judges, and the emulators of the time weren't much help. (IIRC the big deal was between E and U versions of games, but there were also problems with, say, Bionic Commando and Contra for example, as well as games where the game input could be the same but the text would be faster in one version or another which could lead to "cheap" obsoletions, so it was extended across the board.)
And (2) preferring the U version made sense because the site was in English.
It seems that #1 hasn't really been dealt with at all in this game's case. Obviously it's a better run than Bloob's run, so I guess it doesn't really matter. In the future it might be hard to time against another run if someone wants to use a different version again, though.
We seem to be trying to move away from #2 as a site, which is totally cool. But there has to be some consideration, I think, to #1 when making a run like this for a site that cares about exact timings.
Basically, I think the J rom is A-OK ^____^ if that's what the author wants to use.
I get the sense that nobody really cares about why the rule exists in the first place, though, it's just being used as a tool.
Please note that this is a long winded more-or-less neutral observation and not an actual argument.
I can't believe I felt the need to type that.
eta: I think a third reason for the rule in the first place was to avoid arguments like this altogether but, well, that didn't work!
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Slowking wrote:
Please watch the english and japanese light arrow cutscene again, then come back here. If you can still say this with a straight face, we'll have to have your sense of time checked.
Inzult wrote:
The implication here seems to be that because my viewing experience is different, there's something wrong with it.
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CosmoZSR wrote:
Inzult wrote:
fwiw even though over the course of the whole run cut scenes are like 12 minutes or whatever faster, it doesn't feel (to me) like any individual cut scene goes by noticeably quicker. (imo)
What an unusual thing to say! Empirical evidence presented as a rebuttal for a subjective viewing experience. The implication here seems to be that because my viewing experience is different, there's something wrong with it.
For this specific example, looking at the same scene I've seen dozens of times in 2:20 or so feels slow. Reading dialogue I've read dozens of times for 3:20 or so seems to go by quicker. Because my mind is actively engaged in a scene that doesn't contain any cool tricks or slick maneuvers for me to marvel at. Watching the side-by-side comparison, of course it's obvious one's faster than the other, but I found myself reading the English text the whole time anyway.
I only said anything because I assumed (perhaps incorrectly???) that the OoT speedrunning community might care what a somewhat casual viewer thinks.
Let me point out here again that I think the run should be published. I am not arguing that the J version should not be used. I'm simply giving feedback.
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DJSlambdaN wrote:
the japanese text is a very good thing for a tas of oot, i mean, you get your heart really pumped up over a trick, and then just a short little cutscene stub, and then more heart pumping action. instead of heart pumping action, falling asleep action, heart pumping action. i mean tases are made for entertainment and not for falling asleep.
fwiw even though over the course of the whole run cut scenes are like 12 minutes or whatever faster, it doesn't feel (to me) like any individual cut scene goes by noticeably quicker. (imo)
this is exacerbated by staring at text that doesn't mean anything (to me) (imo)
reading gives my mind something to do to pass the time (true fact)
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I dunno, if I'm going to sit through a text heavy cut scene, I'd prefer to be able to read what's there rather than just look at a bunch of text that has no meaning to me. It sort of doesn't even matter if the plot makes sense or if chunks of it are skipped or even if I can read it all before it goes off screen. It gives me something to do other than reach for the fast forward button. Any run where I feel the need to skip parts is a big minus.
(imo)
Anyway, cool run. Yes vote.
(imo)
Does there exist an encode that cuts out the cut scenes? I'd download that one over either language option.
(imo)
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Well! That looks pretty good with the little improvements. I'd certainly watch a full run, though my desire to make TASes is pretty much gone these days. I'm glad to have helped a little, at least.
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I haven't looked at the WIP (yours or mine) but I do recall learning that you could hit the boss while it was still on the wall after I made it, so it's not too surprising you figured a faster way.
I got really hung up on trying to force my way into the walls after that and couldn't do it, so made no more progress.
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Saethori wrote:
PikachuMan wrote:
[...] I would like to see Zelda and Zelda II side by side. [...]
I'm thinking two games with significantly different control schemes and play styles might be pushing the dual-run envelope too far. Despite them being sequential in the series, the two games are just far too different.
I had thought about doing this run, actually. And although this isn't exactly the thread to discuss it, let's just say the different times it takes to finish the two games is a pretty big problem.
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perhaps "memory is altered to activate a state within the game wherein some portion of the post-victory script of the ending code is accessed in advance of playing portions of the game usually required leading up to and including the typical defeat of the expected final boss"
or you know we could be less pedantic for a second
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This is delightful and I am voting yes. I don't really have an opinion about the two strategies. The other run already uses some fairly esoteric glitches to finish levels early but it at least goes to those levels so I can see why people want both.
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mugg, I decided to try out the glitch as shown in the video on my console, considering I have a controller with a turbo function on start.
On the 15th attempt, the credits were triggered. Other attempts saw various sound and visual anomalies of various colors. One attempt reset the game.
The point is, I can confirm this glitch works on the console proper exactly as shown in the video.
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4matsy wrote:
I'd rather see an unglitched low% run that completes the game with the bare minimum of items, spells, and levelups instead. I heard something like 3-1-1 or 4-1-1 by the end was possible...
I'm pretty sure the run already gets the bare minimum of items and spells. I imagine a minimum levels run would be pretty different route-wise but that's because you're forced to fight the bosses in a semi-specific order in order to absorb all EXP. There's bound to be some backtracking to fight earlier bosses later on, long after getting the item. And you'd need to pick up way more keys, if those even count I dunno.
I guess you could skip the hammer if you start a second quest and have thunder in your spell list. So if we go down that road, we don't have to actually collect any spells, already start with 'em. But it lets you skip one more item. And then, since you start with experience, you don't have to backtrack for bosses as much! But then it looks a lot like the published run but with slower bosses.
Personally, I'd prefer a glitched 100% run. I don't know if levels count for 100% but if they do then everything sucks!
